Diminishing returns on investment

[gillygirl]

I am tired of seeing all the Covid stuff on the main Winni forum. At this point in time of the pandemic, everyone on both polar sides are locked into their opinion. This needs to be moved to the non-lake related forum so that those of us who are looking for specific lake related issues don’t have to wade through the bs from either side. This also goes for generalized topics like investments. If you’re looking for a specific agent in the Lakes Region to assist you with your investments, that’s one thing. If you’re looking for non-lake specific info, put it under the non-lake specific group. And I don’t want to hear “you can skip over threads.” There is a structure to this site that should be followed. Granted, the Covid bs is still under the main lake topics, but I would ask it to be moved to the non-lake related group. I want to learn the deets of the Lyon’s Den sale, not more generalized Covid bs.

FYI, this is coming from someone on the more liberal side, but as a scientist who analyzes the crap out of things, I don’t see the wisdom of beating the alarmist drum. I’m in Florida where things are very open. I make educated decisions on what is comfortable for me to do. I realize I’m not going to sway anyone with my opinion at this point. Thus the title “return on investment.”


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[SailinAway]

I'm confused. You seem to be saying that you're tired of the controversy in the Covid section? But then you assert an opinion that's likely to stir up controversy, calling the Covid discussions "bs" and saying posters are "beating the alarmist drum."

I don't personally care where the Covid section appears. It has been probably the most active section for the past two years, so I wouldn't be in favor getting rid of it. The activity in that section shows that people think this is an important topic. And valuable information about things like where to get vaccinations has been posted.

As for the two recent investment threads (I started one of them), I think that's a valid use of this kind of community forum---getting information, opinions, and advice from knowledgeable people. I've personally benefited greatly from the high level of knowledge about home maintenance here.

But as you point out, these topics aren't specific to the Lakes Region, although there are several Covid threads that are specific to this area. I think it's good that this website serves as a meeting place for people to discuss a variety of things on their mind, especially during a time when gathering in public places has been difficult.

My personal opinion is that people who deny the existence of a public threat or post false information about a public threat should be banned and their posts should be removed. In other words, this website should be a public service, not a detriment to public safety.

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

I'm confused. You seem to be saying that you're tired of the controversy in the Covid section? But then you assert an opinion that's likely to stir up controversy, calling the Covid discussions "bs" and saying posters are "beating the alarmist drum."

I don't personally care where the Covid section appears. It has been probably the most active section for the past two years, so I wouldn't be in favor getting rid of it. The activity in that section shows that people think this is an important topic. And valuable information about things like where to get vaccinations has been posted.

As for the two recent investment threads (I started one of them), I think that's a valid use of this kind of community forum---getting information, opinions, and advice from knowledgeable people. I've personally benefited greatly from the high level of knowledge about home maintenance here.

But as you point out, these topics aren't specific to the Lakes Region, although there are several Covid threads that are specific to this area. I think it's good that this website serves as a meeting place for people to discuss a variety of things on their mind, especially during a time when gathering in public places has been difficult.

My personal opinion is that people who deny the existence of a public threat or post false information about a public threat should be banned and their posts should be removed. In other words, this website should be a public service, not a detriment to public safety.

My concern is that neither the Covid information nor the investment information are specific to the Lakes Region. Don created a non-lake related section for issues that aren’t specifically lake related. He’s probably too overwhelmed to address these issues, but he also seems reticent to allow others to assist him in monitoring things. Yet issues that are broader than the Lakes Region show up in the Lakes Region section, and from what I see, many respected members of this page have discontinued their participation. Don is free to police his forum as he sees fit, but at this point, I think it’s illogical not to accept assistance from trusted members. As an admin to the Facebook page for my community in FL, I recognize that multiple opinions are necessary for the proper administration of any social media platform, but unfriendly discourse from either side is detrimental to the whole, whatever the topic might be.

Personally speaking, I think my participation in this forum is coming to an end. I may monitor for useful information, but this site is far removed from how it was at its inception. It was once friendly…not so much anymore. It’s sad that a pandemic that threatens the continued existence of all can drive such a wedge. But the citizenry of this country seems to be moving from acknowledging an obligation to being part of a society to drumming their own personal rights. Good luck with that attitude when the excrement hits the fan.


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[thinkxingu]

This is a tough one. While I'm not in favor of strict content limitations—I've often found value in minimally related lake topics—there hasn't been much for me here these last few months.

I can't tell if that's a reflection of the forum changing—I've mentioned the tone and members moving on in the past—or, frankly, if I'm just...worn out...by social media.

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[trfour]

"FIRST". It Is The "PANDENIC", of Covid-19 and it's variants, as it is totally Destroying LIFE here on Mother Earth.

[LoveLakeLife]

Originally Posted by trfour

"FIRST". It Is The "PANDENIC", of Covid-19 and it's variants, as it is totally Destroying LIFE here on Mother Earth.

hahaha so funny. It’s the flu with a 99+% survival rate. “Totally destroying life” seems a tad hyperbolic and capitalizing whole words doesn’t make them more persuasive.


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[LoveLakeLife]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

I'm confused. You seem to be saying that you're tired of the controversy in the Covid section? But then you assert an opinion that's likely to stir up controversy, calling the Covid discussions "bs" and saying posters are "beating the alarmist drum."

I don't personally care where the Covid section appears. It has been probably the most active section for the past two years, so I wouldn't be in favor getting rid of it. The activity in that section shows that people think this is an important topic. And valuable information about things like where to get vaccinations has been posted.

As for the two recent investment threads (I started one of them), I think that's a valid use of this kind of community forum---getting information, opinions, and advice from knowledgeable people. I've personally benefited greatly from the high level of knowledge about home maintenance here.

But as you point out, these topics aren't specific to the Lakes Region, although there are several Covid threads that are specific to this area. I think it's good that this website serves as a meeting place for people to discuss a variety of things on their mind, especially during a time when gathering in public places has been difficult.

My personal opinion is that people who deny the existence of a public threat or post false information about a public threat should be banned and their posts should be removed. In other words, this website should be a public service, not a detriment to public safety.

People who disagree should be banned and their posts removed? Typical non-tolerant and close-minded level of liberal argument. If you believe in your position then state it and trust in its validity as you see it. You shouldn’t try to take away others’ right to state their own positions. One man’s true information is another man’s false information. You’re a participant not the arbiter.


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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

My concern is that neither the Covid information nor the investment information are specific to the Lakes Region. . . . Don is free to police his forum as he sees fit, but at this point, I think it’s illogical not to accept assistance from trusted members. As an admin to the Facebook page for my community in FL, I recognize that multiple opinions are necessary for the proper administration of any social media platform, but unfriendly discourse from either side is detrimental to the whole, whatever the topic might be. . . . I think my participation in this forum is coming to an end. I may monitor for useful information, but this site is far removed from how it was at its inception. It was once friendly…not so much anymore. It’s sad that a pandemic that threatens the continued existence of all can drive such a wedge. But the citizenry of this country seems to be moving from acknowledging an obligation to being part of a society to drumming their own personal rights. Good luck with that attitude when the excrement hits the fan.

Gillygirl, you make important points about this forum and about how society is going in general. The unfriendly posts in the Covid forum are a microcosm of society. As I have read this forum over the past two years, I have been really discouraged to realize what the society around me here in the Lakes Region actually looks like. But this is true across our whole country---I've been depressed for a while now to realize how deep the divisions are in our country and how vicious they can get. This is definitely something new for us Oldsters who grew up in a more civil society. Unfortunately, the anonymity of the internet greatly magnifies the severity of insults and attacks as people say things they would never say in public. I try hard not to do that, by the way. Every few weeks I take a break forum this forum because honestly, it's a bit toxic. I'm with you on that.

What is the solution? The solution in a forum is no easier than at the national level. It involves questions about free speech, civility, and policing. Who should do the policing, and what would their guidelines and values be? For starters, if I owned a forum, I would delete all posts that propagated false information. We all know what that is. In 2020 there was a prolific poster who constantly denied the existence of the pandemic. That's dangerous, because people with addled minds believe it. Those posts should have been deleted. I would also remove posts with aggressive insults aimed at individuals. I would remove threads that are based on false information or uncivil, rather than closing them.

Ultimately any forum reflects the values of the forum owner. If people don't like the uncivility of a forum, they can go elsewhere or start their own forum. I would love to start my own Lakes Region forum based on the idea of neighbors helping neighbors. Boscawen actually has something like that. If you post that you need someone to snowblow your driveway you're likely to get a friendly reply from a volunteer. I suspect that starting and maintaining a forum is a lot of work.

The problem with the Covid forum is that the cat is out of the box. If the Covid forum were closed down, I would still be left with the knowledge that there are some people at this website who just don't care much about other people and truth. Yes, they are strangely civil in the other forums. Many of the same people who have insulted me in the Covid forum for making bold statements like "We have a responsibility toward others" have given me great advice about my house and my car!

You could conclude that this means that just closing down the Covid forum would solve the problem. But I'd like to say that when I first came to this website in spring 2020 my reason was that under the lockdown, there were no safe ways of making contact with people in the Lakes Region and getting firsthand information about things like which grocery stores had food on the shelves. The pandemic is nowhere near finished, and I think that this type of local information and exchange is still very important. It will be a long time before I personally go back to spending time in public places like restaurants where I could meet people in person. This website has been very helpful to me in that sense.

[LoveLakeLife]

I think we should all strive much harder to be the type of “society around [Sailin] in the Lakes Region] among whom Sailin can be proud to cavort. I for one am crushed that all of don’t collectively meet the standard which he has evidently deemed acceptable. I am grateful, though, that we have someone to whom we can look for not just guidance, but approval. Work harder, everyone, it’s the only way.


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[LoveLakeLife]

I hope that Gilly goes nowhere. Her posts are always enjoyable and a pleasure to read.


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[FlyingScot]

I agree with GG. Though I have posted a lot on COVID and a bit on investments, I have tried to limit it to only countering misinformation (and even that's a lot).

Although I will continue to post in response to others, I think we would all be happier if we focused on lake stuff

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by LoveLakeLife

I hope that Gilly goes nowhere. Her posts are always enjoyable and a pleasure to read.


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Thank you, LoveLakeLife! I appreciate that.


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[LikeLakes]

I don't think anyone should be banned, and as someone fairly new on the forum I hope nobody leaves. It's a lake forum, so when outside topics are discussed there will be all sorts of opinions, for all to agree or disagree with.

If I'm on a forum about politics and someone starts a topic about outboard engine maintenance, I probably won't take the info posted too seriously, might comment myself but certainly understand that there may be some info I disagree with or outright misinformation. After all, it's a politics forum. If there's a covid or finance topic on this site, I probably won't take the info posted too seriously, might comment myself but certainly understand that there may be some info I disagree with or outright misinformation. After all, it's a Lake Winnipesaukee forum.

[webmaster]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

I think my participation in this forum is coming to an end. I may monitor for useful information, but this site is far removed from how it was at its inception.

The COVID discussions are isolated to the "Covid-19 Discussions & Information" area and I've tried very hard to keep them there. It is also the very last category listed under all the Lakes Region dedicated categories. If the discussions there bother you why not just avoid that section and stick to the other 20 categories that for the most part remain friendly, helpful and almost completely Lakes Region related?

Sadly, I've received too many emails and messages from members telling me they're leaving the forum for good because of what is posted in the COVID section. It's as if the other 20 categories don't exist or have any value. I have to say I don't get it.

[WinnisquamZ]

Well said. Don’t get the intolerance some have of other’s opinions.


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[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by webmaster

The COVID discussions are isolated to the "Covid-19 Discussions & Information" area and I've tried very hard to keep them there. It is also the very last category listed under all the Lakes Region dedicated categories. If the discussions there bother you why not just avoid that section and stick to the other 20 categories that for the most part remain friendly, helpful and almost completely Lakes Region related?

Sadly, I've received too many emails and messages from members telling me they're leaving the forum for good because of what is posted in the COVID section. It's as if the other 20 categories don't exist or have any value. I have to say I don't get it.

Since I view things under the unread tab, I can’t avoid seeing previews of all unread posts.


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[joey2665]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

Since I view things under the unread tab, I can’t avoid seeing previews of all unread posts.


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Same here


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[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

Since I view things under the unread tab, I can’t avoid seeing previews of all unread posts.


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Gillygirl, when you click on "new posts", you can see what forum section each thread is listed. When I don't want to read a subject, I don't open it and move on to the next one.

If there are a half dozen threads showing and two of them are COVID related, skip then and read the other 4. When you're done, click on new posts again, just in case something you may have come up while you're busy reading the posts you want to.

When your down to the 2 you want to skip, click on "quick links" and scroll down to "mark forums read" and click it, and your unwanted posts will be marked as read and disappear.

I left the Forum for a few months because I got frustrated reading so many caustic posts. But then I realized I had been on Winni.com for a lot of years and missed so many different sections, and that there were only a few subject matters and a handful of posters that I didn't like what/ how they posted. So I signed back in and am overall enjoying the Forum again.

Dave

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

Gillygirl, when you click on "new posts", you can see what forum section each thread is listed. When I don't want to read a subject, I don't open it and move on to the next one.

If there are a half dozen threads showing and two of them are COVID related, skip then and read the other 4. When you're done, click on new posts again, just in case something you may have come up while you're busy reading the posts you want to.

When your down to the 2 you want to skip, click on "quick links" and scroll down to "mark forums read" and click it, and your unwanted posts will be marked as read and disappear.

I left the Forum for a few months because I got frustrated reading so many caustic posts. But then I realized I had been on Winni.com for a lot of years and missed so many different sections, and that there were only a few subject matters and a handful of posters that I didn't like what/ how they posted. So I signed back in and am overall enjoying the Forum again.

Dave

Thanks, upthesaukee. I appreciate your taking the time to help me. I read the forum on the Tapatalk app on my iPad, so it works differently. I’ll check out settings to see if there’s a way to work around the automatic preview. I was just hoping the Covid subforum and non lake related issues could be moved to the Lake Issues forum. On Nextdoor, you can hide threads you don’t want to see. Would love that option on the app I use.


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[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

Since I view things under the unread tab, I can’t avoid seeing previews of all unread posts.
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This website is a great resource and very well run. It is very simple to read what you like and skip things that don't interest you. You don't even want to see a subject line that indicates it may be something you don't want to read?

I use my laptop daily and go to many websites. Often, I am looking for specific items like furniture or clothing. I have found that when I am looking for something specific like a desk but things like living room furniture come up I don't click on that section. When I am looking for clothing, I look at the men's clothes and skip the tab with the clothes for women and children. It is that simple.

Maybe I should ask the website owners where I shop to only have the items that I might like because it is too much trouble to skip the ones that don't interest me?

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

Thanks, upthesaukee. I appreciate your taking the time to help me. I read the forum on the Tapatalk app on my iPad, so it works differently. I’ll check out settings to see if there’s a way to work around the automatic preview. I was just hoping the Covid subforum and non lake related issues could be moved to the Lake Issues forum. On Nextdoor, you can hide threads you don’t want to see. Would love that option on the app I use.


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GG, one of the things I hated about Tapatalk or the Winni Mobile app was I couldn't see what was in the subject area of any particular thread. (Ie subject "call Jim" and body "he is the best". Can't see the subject, so I wouldn't know who is the best)
On my Samsung tablet I use the actual website. It works out just fine most of the time. On my S7 cell phone not so well, phone screen is too small for the full site.
Your welcome and good luck. (Keep smiling )

Dave

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

This website is a great resource and very well run. It is very simple to read what you like and skip things that don't interest you. You don't even want to see a subject line that indicates it may be something you don't want to read?

I use my laptop daily and go to many websites. Often, I am looking for specific items like furniture or clothing. I have found that when I am looking for something specific like a desk but things like living room furniture come up I don't click on that section. When I am looking for clothing, I look at the men's clothes and skip the tab with the clothes for women and children. It is that simple.

Maybe I should ask the website owners where I shop to only have the items that I might like because it is too much trouble to skip the ones that don't interest me?

Reread what I wrote. I’m not talking about subject lines, I don’t even see subject lines on the Tapatalk app. It’s different than the website. I see several lines of the first unread post from each thread. Can’t miss seeing some crazy things written as I scroll through.

I think it was the speed limit debate that caused Don to create a couple of other forums on the site for that stuff in order to maintain a friendly atmosphere on the Winni forum. I’m suggesting that contentious content should go there. There’s obviously an issue if he’s receiving many emails from people indicating that they’re leaving the site.


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[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

GG, one of the things I hated about Tapatalk or the Winni Mobile app was I couldn't see what was in the subject area of any particular thread. (Ie subject "call Jim" and body "he is the best". Can't see the subject, so I wouldn't know who is the best)

On my Samsung tablet I use the actual website. It works out just fine most of the time. On my S7 cell phone not so well, phone screen is too small for the full site.

Your welcome and good luck. (Keep smiling )


Dave

It definitely would be better if the subject was visible instead of a preview of what’s written. I still find the app easier to read on the iPad than the website.

Thanks for all your positivity!


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[BillJohn]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Gillygirl, you make important points about this forum and about how society is going in general. The unfriendly posts in the Covid forum are a microcosm of society. As I have read this forum over the past two years, I have been really discouraged to realize what the society around me here in the Lakes Region actually looks like. But this is true across our whole country---I've been depressed for a while now to realize how deep the divisions are in our country and how vicious they can get. This is definitely something new for us Oldsters who grew up in a more civil society. Unfortunately, the anonymity of the internet greatly magnifies the severity of insults and attacks as people say things they would never say in public. I try hard not to do that, by the way. Every few weeks I take a break forum this forum because honestly, it's a bit toxic. I'm with you on that.

I think you nailed it. Society has changed. People have become selfish, intolerant, and aggressive. Just look at the number of incidents that are happening while flying. Bad behavior use to be joining the mile high club...now you get punched.

[TiltonBB]

I only use my laptop for going online or any web searches and it works well on this site. I am old, so I use my Iphone for what a phone is meant for, phone calls.

Although I do realize many people use their phones for email etc., I sit behind them at green traffic lights honking the horn when they have their face buried in the phone and don't notice the light change. It is just one public service that I perform!

[Newbiesaukee]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

GG, one of the things I hated about Tapatalk or the Winni Mobile app was I couldn't see what was in the subject area of any particular thread. (Ie subject "call Jim" and body "he is the best". Can't see the subject, so I wouldn't know who is the best)
On my Samsung tablet I use the actual website. It works out just fine most of the time. On my S7 cell phone not so well, phone screen is too small for the full site.
Your welcome and good luck. (Keep smiling )

Dave

I do the same on my iPad. Frequently the actual website you would see with a browser is actually better than the app designed for the iPad. Basically I go to the Winni website, bookmark it and stay signed in.

[mcdude]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Although I do realize many people use their phones for email etc., I sit behind them at green traffic lights honking the horn when they have their face buried in the phone and don't notice the light change. It is just one public service that I perform!

Thank you for your service TiltonBB