Sandy Point Going Condo!

[knowit]

This is all going to end very badly. Not sure why these idiots that are over paying for all of these properties don't see it. I saw this exact thing happen in Florida. two years later mass foreclosures and fire sale prices. People that don't learn from history are destined to repeat it. House across from me sold for $625K less than 2 years ago. Last month sold for $825K. Is it worth it? NO. The people getting hurt by all this craziness are the locals that can't afford to live here anymore. Hang tight folks and bank your money. The next realestate crash is coming. Be ready then. I will be.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by knowit

This is all going to end very badly. Not sure why these idiots that are over paying for all of these properties don't see it. I saw this exact thing happen in Florida. two years later mass foreclosures and fire sale prices. People that don't learn from history are destined to repeat it. House across from me sold for $625K less than 2 years ago. Last month sold for $825K. Is it worth it? NO. The people getting hurt by all this craziness are the locals that can't afford to live here anymore. Hang tight folks and bank your money. The next realestate crash is coming. Be ready then. I will be.

The biggest difference I see today is a lot of properties are selling for cash, no mortgage means no foreclosure. So unless we see a major recession I don't see it any time soon but I do think the market will slow down.

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by Biggd

So unless we see a major recession I don't see it any time soon but I do think the market will slow down.

Back in 2004 2005 advise was to purchase any real estate as price will go up 10% -30%. Buy. Buy. Buy.

Then, much hit bottom.

Hmmm . . . .

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

Back in 2004 2005 advise was to purchase any real estate as price will go up 10% -30%. Buy. Buy. Buy.

Then, much hit bottom.

Hmmm . . . .

Just think if you purchased in 2005 and held til now. You could be up 80-100%. Real estate should almost always be thought of as a long term investment unless your in the business of flipping homes. You would be hard to find real estate that decreased in value if it’s held for at least 5 years.


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[LakeDad]

Originally Posted by Biggd

The biggest difference I see today is a lot of properties are selling for cash, no mortgage means no foreclosure. So unless we see a major recession I don't see it any time soon but I do think the market will slow down.

Right you are.
This isn’t 2008. What is far more likely to happen, is available inventory will go up once forbearance ends. That will have (if only temporarily) a flattening effect, but it’s highly unlikely to affect this area. This is a vacation area and an area of wealth with many cash buyers.

What a house is worth isn’t determined by shocked locals who have seen a milder market in the past. Sure, covid has unexpectedly compounded this, but the effects on demand may be permanent: Every day, more professionals and executives have the option and make the decision to telecommute. Covid gave this a big boost, but many of the effects will be lasting: Companies don’t need a large, expensive, central office to be successful.

Where are you going to live when you can live anywhere you want?
Most of us know the answer to that

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by LakeDad

Right you are.
This isn’t 2008. What is far more likely to happen, is available inventory will go up once forbearance ends. That will have (if only temporarily) a flattening effect, but it’s highly unlikely to affect this area. This is a vacation area and an area of wealth with many cash buyers.

What a house is worth isn’t determined by shocked locals who have seen a milder market in the past. Sure, covid has unexpectedly compounded this, but the effects on demand may be permanent: Every day, more professionals and executives have the option and make the decision to telecommute. Covid gave this a big boost, but many of the effects will be lasting: Companies don’t need a large, expensive, central office to be successful.

Where are you going to live when you can live anywhere you want?
Most of us know the answer to that

Sure but we have already seen the lake camps swallowed up by the rich crowd... the rich crowd is getting pushed off the by the richer crowd. What is lost are the working folks that used to wait and cook at your favorite restaurants, cut your grass and build your decks who can no longer afford to live here

[LakeDad]

Originally Posted by VitaBene

Sure but we have already seen the lake camps swallowed up by the rich crowd... the rich crowd is getting pushed off the by the richer crowd. What is lost are the working folks that used to wait and cook at your favorite restaurants, cut your grass and build your decks who can no longer afford to live here

I know. 2 years ago I could have (and should have) bought on the lake.
I ended up 1/8 mile away and had to find a dock.

it’s not so much about the investment for me:
When I find a place on the lake, I’ll keep it forever.

[Biggd]

The real estate market has already started to slow down. Sellers are reaching for the stars with super high asking prices. You're not seeing the multiple offers over asking as was earlier this summer.
If interest rates start to rise then the slow down will continue which will eventually lead to lower offers and price negotiating again.
Anyone that bought in the past year will probably see some of their equity eaten away.

[LakeDad]

Originally Posted by Biggd

The real estate market has already started to slow down. Sellers are reaching for the stars with super high asking prices. You're not seeing the multiple offers over asking as was earlier this summer.
If interest rates start to rise then the slow down will continue which will eventually lead to lower offers and price negotiating again.
Anyone that bought in the past year will probably see some of their equity eaten away.

Fortunately, my seller didn’t want to do some key repairs, they started with the price too high (and we bought in the winter), so they came way down for our offer. I won’t lose anything other than hypothetical “stupid money” equity.

But a lot of people buying turn key properties and flips will get hosed.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Biggd

The real estate market has already started to slow down. Sellers are reaching for the stars with super high asking prices. You're not seeing the multiple offers over asking as was earlier this summer.
If interest rates start to rise then the slow down will continue which will eventually lead to lower offers and price negotiating again.
Anyone that bought in the past year will probably see some of their equity eaten away.

agreed. But the "smart" money on the lake is not buying for a 5-10 year return. It's a generational asset

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

agreed. But the "smart" money on the lake is not buying for a 5-10 year return. It's a generational asset

It remains to be seen if this was "smart" money.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Biggd

It remains to be seen if this was "smart" money.

HA! Absolutely! We'll know in just another 30 years

I bought a few years ago, with no financial expectations. So I feel extraordinarily lucky that what I thought was a splurge was actually a genius investment with free vacations for life (at least so far...)

[codeman671]

Sandy Point was just listed for sale yesterday on realtor.com at $12.5mil.

[Boundary]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

agreed. But the "smart" money on the lake is not buying for a 5-10 year return. It's a generational asset

I wonder myself whether many of the recent waterfront home buyers getting in at these historically elevated home prices are in it for the generational asset or for a few years stay-cation knowing they are going to pay to play for a few years and then sell.

Either way - it is an expensive equation. But for a multi-generational asset I would argue a large number of waterfront homes are not well suited for that outside of a family heirloom / memory making items. They are money pits. Extremely enjoyable money pits.

Waterfront homes historically and into the future are not great investments for monetary return. At least by any way I have been able to think about it. I would love to be convinced otherwise..

Outside of Moultonborough, it isn't uncommon for decent sized water front homes to have $20,000 + tax bills. $2,000+ insurance, $3,000+ utilities, maintenance? landscaping / winter care? annual dock & boat expenses?

If this is a second home it is exactly that - secondary expenses on top of everything else in life, too.

Believe me - I know there are many many many people that can afford the 40k+ annual operating expenses happily while they are getting use out of it (covid). I also know many people that fall into that category of wealth who would never pay $40k a year in addition to the mindshare to maintain it without getting significant use out of it.

In my opinion, waterfront homes are meant to be enjoyed in the current. Otherwise unless you are the Marriott family there will be many annual checks that gets written which you look twice at. There is a reason water front homes turn over more frequently than non waterfront homes.

Long story short - I think their value is more directly tied to peoples immediate interest in the region and overall economic conditions. Both of which are at historical peaks this very moment.

[Descant]

Meanwhile, back to Sandy Point...Isn't it still restricted seasonally due to water and sewer issues? So, $12.5MM for a fixer-upper? Some of the condo conversions along Weirs Blvd had similar issues years ago, and instead of sellin g thew entirety, they converted and sold individual rooms. The new owners did the interior fix-up. Condo association did exterior stuff. Would that work for Sandy Point?

[LakeTimes]

Looks like it went back under contract again yesterday

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1...11085750_zpid/

[Rinkerguy]

What’s the status of the sale? Haven’t seen or heard anything but noticed the property down the street recently sold. Hope it works out for them.

[TiltonBB]

The most recent buyer moved on as well. I understand it is going back on the market tomorrow.

Get your checkbook ready!

[Descant]

Just after the war here was a lot of development around the lake up to maybe 1955. Around 1980, a lot of those motels went condo as original owners wanted to retire. Sandy Point is one of the last of those and maybe missed a window when it was a little easier to convert with less restrictive septic/sewer requirements. And, in Gilford, Laconia Meredith Center Harbor, etc, the new Winnipesaukee River Basin sewer was helpful. It would help the west side of Alton Bay if that line extended past West Alton. Senator and Alton state reps should pursue that issue. So should anybody who wants to re-develop Sandy Point.

[Rinkerguy]

Looks like they took it off the market for the winter. Too bad they’ve had interest, but town seems to be blocking development of the property

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by Rinkerguy

Looks like they took it off the market for the winter. Too bad they’ve had interest, but town seems to be blocking development of the property

Just curious, how is the town "blocking the development"?

Dave

[LakeDad]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

Just curious, how is the town "blocking the development"?

Dave

Zoning, petition, septic? Not sure, but it’s good to see some interest in preserving the area.


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[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by LakeDad

Zoning, petition, septic? Not sure, but it’s good to see some interest in preserving the area.

I don't want any new homes or new condos built AFTER mine was built. I wish to preserve the beauty of the area AFTER my mcmansion/condo was constructed.

[sky's]

Originally Posted by Biggd

The real estate market has already started to slow down. Sellers are reaching for the stars with super high asking prices. You're not seeing the multiple offers over asking as was earlier this summer.
If interest rates start to rise then the slow down will continue which will eventually lead to lower offers and price negotiating again.
Anyone that bought in the past year will probably see some of their equity eaten away.

this is true i saw on zillow a house on long island pineridge rd for 589k a simple split level 300k on a good day. omg who would pay that?? or even close to that price????

[Mr. V]

Originally Posted by VitaBene

Sure but we have already seen the lake camps swallowed up by the rich crowd... the rich crowd is getting pushed off the by the richer crowd. What is lost are the working folks that used to wait and cook at your favorite restaurants, cut your grass and build your decks who can no longer afford to live here

This is not surprising.

Think back: Lake Shore Park was created when there was a lot of available land lakeside.

It gave "the working man and woman" an opportunity to build and own a cabin on or near the lake for an affordable price, with beach access.

Not anymore: "No room at the inn."

As the available land has been built on or is otherwise protected there is only one viable solution: the price rises due to demand.