Trail Closure Notice

[RTTOOL]

ok people say its land owner rights where is the rights of the people that buy all these products to use. with more and more land being closed and passing the blame to the user is not the anwser.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

ok people say its land owner rights where is the rights of the people that buy all these products to use. with more and more land being closed and passing the blame to the user is not the anwser.

Wow!...So you think the right of the toy purchaser supersedes the rights of the landowner...?? Because I have it I have the right to use it wherever I want??

More and more land is being closed because of idiots who leave their trash buried in the snow, drink excessively and cause problems on the trails, ride off the trails or change their stock exhaust to some kind of "can" that adds absolute ZERO performance gains, too bad if it's loud and annoys landowners, I like it and I want it on my sled! Very selfish and disrespectful way to think if you ask me.

We have to police our own or more and more trails will be closed it's that simple! The local clubs have turned into mediators for us constantly putting out fires that we have created and they can't do it all!

Dan

[RTTOOL]

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Wow!...So you think the right of the toy purchaser supersedes the rights of the landowner...?? Because I have it I have the right to use it wherever I want??

More and more land is being closed because of idiots who leave their trash buried in the snow, drink excessively and cause problems on the trails, ride off the trails or change their stock exhaust to some kind of "can" that adds absolute ZERO performance gains, too bad if it's loud and annoys landowners, I like it and I want it on my sled! Very selfish and disrespectful way to think if you ask me.

We have to police our own or more and more trails will be closed it's that simple! The local clubs have turned into mediators for us constantly putting out fires that we have created and they can't do it all!

Dan

THIS is very selfish to say trash left behind is from snowobilers when its buried in the snow maybe hikers. and with the cans if they sell it it must be ok. just like all the highbread selds that are here to stay.

[SAB1]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

ok people say its land owner rights where is the rights of the people that buy all these products to use. with more and more land being closed and passing the blame to the user is not the anwser.

Hopefully you are joking....

[RTTOOL]

Originally Posted by SAB1

Hopefully you are joking....

NO NOT JOKING ITS THE WAY we all think but afriad to say.

[SAB1]

No, not all ALL of us. I for one am not as misguided as you. Private property is priviledge to use not a right.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

NO NOT JOKING ITS THE WAY we all think but afriad to say.

Dan--it's only Dec 28, but I'm ready to vote for your "privilege not a right" post as the best of the year. Not only did you make an important point, but you managed to inspire those on the opposite side to help you make your case.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

NO NOT JOKING ITS THE WAY we all think but afriad to say.

I honestly don't know what to say except wow... you really are a "tool".

You have proven my point better than I could of ever stated...how unfortunate.

Dan

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by ishoot308

I honestly don't know what to say except wow... you really are a "tool".

You have proven my point better than I could of ever stated...how unfortunate.

Dan

Either a tool or a fisherman.

Maybe landowners should put up toll booths.

[Hillcountry]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

Either a tool or a fisherman.

Maybe landowners should put up toll booths.

PLEASE! Fishermen are sportsmen...there are “tools” in every Part of the human race...but they are in the “loud” minority.

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by Hillcountry

PLEASE! Fishermen are sportsmen...there are “tools” in every Part of the human race...but they are in the “loud” minority.

Not sure if you understood that I was implying that he was fishing for reactions.

[Hillcountry]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

Not sure if you understood that I was implying that he was fishing for reactions.

No, I did not understand it that way...thanks for the clarification!

[MAXUM]

Let this be an illustration of "you can't fix stupid", about the only thing these donkeys understand is to have their privileges taken away. Unfortunately this cannot be done selectively when it comes to a snowmobile trail so everyone is affected. Sadly there is no good fix for this, LEOs can't be everywhere to catch people in the act. The clubs can only do so much and their efforts go for the most part unnoticed and under appreciated.

How many trails must close before people start to get it? Seems like for now not enough, but thanks to the RTTOOL mindset the trend continues to accelerate in the wrong direction.

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

ok people say its land owner rights where is the rights of the people that buy all these products to use. with more and more land being closed and passing the blame to the user is not the anwser.

As a landowner who allowed the Mount Major Snowmobile Club to create a portion of the Rand Hill Rd trail to pass through my property, albeit a small section of the trail's total length, I can tell you that if anyone using the trail through my property ever told me that it was a right, not a privilege, to ride through my property would find out how quickly my little corner of the road would be closed to snowmobiling.

Sent from my SM-T580 using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[RTTOOL]

ok did i piss off the few we have here or should we talk speed limt to piss off the rest....i will let the cat out of the bag soon.

[winni83]

Well. It is RT TROLL.

[Outdoorsman]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

ok did i piss off the few we have here or should we talk speed limt to piss off the rest....i will let the cat out of the bag soon.

I hope you realize that even forums such as this do yield search results near the top of the list. If you are posting this BS for shock value, SHAME ON YOU! If even one person sees this BS and thinks that it is OK, you are the reason.

Also, it is people like YOU that have caused me to "give up" on riding locally. I have not even volunteered in a number of years because of idiots like you. It is just a hopeless cause IMHO.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

As a landowner who allowed the Mount Major Snowmobile Club to create a portion of the Rand Hill Rd trail to pass through my property, albeit a small section of the trail's total length, I can tell you that if anyone using the trail through my property ever told me that it was a right, not a privilege, to ride through my property would find out how quickly my little corner of the road would be closed to snowmobiling.

Sent from my SM-T580 using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

Thanks for opening your property Up, some tool will probably say something stupid to you, just remember, most of us try to use your property so we are unnoticed to you, we are a serious majority, and very grateful for you allowing us to be there. Ignore the trolls.

[Tom T]

Originally Posted by ITD

Thanks for opening your property Up, some tool will probably say something stupid to you, just remember, most of us try to use your property so we are unnoticed to you, we are a serious majority, and very grateful for you allowing us to be there. Ignore the trolls.

If its wasn't for the generosity of property owners there would be no trail systems. The ones that like to complain or make ridiculous statements are the same ones that ignore the local clubs asking for help. Every one is entitled to their opinions but until you get involved and know what it takes to keep trails open they are speaking out of term.

[nhcatrider]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

ok people say its land owner rights where is the rights of the people that buy all these products to use. with more and more land being closed and passing the blame to the user is not the anwser.

It's the idiotic actions of a select few that ruin it for the rest. One of my friends had 3 miles of trail running through his land and the actions of a few were responsible for the closure of the trail. Imagine having to do a 3 mile reroute in January which is when he closed the gates on his land.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by nhcatrider

It's the idiotic actions of a select few that ruin it for the rest. One of my friends had 3 miles of trail running through his land and the actions of a few were responsible for the closure of the trail. Imagine having to do a 3 mile reroute in January which is when he closed the gates on his land.

Just curious NHcat,... knowing what you know of the situation, do you agree with his/her decision to close the trail or do you think the landowner wasn’t forgiving enough and was being selfish? Honest question.

Thanks!

Dan

[Outdoorsman]

About 5ish years ago, with the help of my local snowmobile club, I built a decent (not elaborate) bridge across the brook on my property. I supplied most of the material. To be fair, this trail was used more by locals than the general riding population, but it was a secondary feeder trail that was generally used as a shortcut for a smaller loop ride and was open and used by the public. Three weeks after building that bridge, someone had stolen ALL the new materials used to make that bridge. 2x4's, Plywood etc. and left a mess of what little was not stolen.

I had the trail closed and there is no longer a reasonable "loop trail" as far as I know.

So, with all due respect, I can not ever see a land owner being "selfish". It is the few that ruin it for the many.

Sorry for the rant.

[nhcatrider]

I went with him one spring to clean up the trash that was left behind. The area of trash was out of sight of his house and the road. We filled his pickup when we cleaned up, and the area was clean before winter. This had happened over several years and the club was warned repeatedly as well as signs were posted. He even supplied trash barrels but they were hardly used and instead beer cans and other assorted trash was buried in the snow. He raises dogs and got sick of the predatory animals that were being attracted to the trash that was left behind. Since closing the trail he has not had a problem with animals. Seeing all of this I agree with his decision, even though it was a select few that ruined it for everyone else.

[SAMIAM]

Originally Posted by nhcatrider

I went with him one spring to clean up the trash that was left behind. The area of trash was out of sight of his house and the road. We filled his pickup when we cleaned up, and the area was clean before winter. This had happened over several years and the club was warned repeatedly as well as signs were posted. He even supplied trash barrels but they were hardly used and instead beer cans and other assorted trash was buried in the snow. He raises dogs and got sick of the predatory animals that were being attracted to the trash that was left behind. Since closing the trail he has not had a problem with animals. Seeing all of this I agree with his decision, even though it was a select few that ruined it for everyone else.

Here at the Village Kitchen we have hundreds of snowmobilers passing through our property weekly on the way to the Red Hill trail. Many stop and congregate in the lower field before going up and many stop in the back yard
and come in to eat. I have never encountered any significant trash in the spring and

they have always been respectful around our two leach fields.
I would urge landowners to try to be understanding of the occasional kid (or adult)that gets out of line because they do not represent the majority and I'm pretty sure that if a club member or local rider saw them acting up that they would have have some pretty harsh words for them

[Woodsy]

Unfortunately....

If we do not police ourselves, the sport as we know it in NH will be killed off. Property owners are not going to be so generous when opening up their land for our use when it becomes a hassle.. be it noise or trash or failure to stay on the trail!

If you see someone being a TOOL... say something. Take pic or a vid and send it into F&G..

Woodsy

[WINNOCTURN]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

Unfortunately....

If we do not police ourselves, the sport as we know it in NH will be killed off. Property owners are not going to be so generous when opening up their land for our use when it becomes a hassle.. be it noise or trash or failure to stay on the trail!

If you see someone being a TOOL... say something. Take pic or a vid and send it into F&G..

Woodsy

IGNORENT RIDERS hurt us more the Trash!

WHAT ABOUT THE RIDER THE DONOT OBEY THE SINAGE ON OUR TRAILS, SLOW, 10MPH AND SUCH.

WE ARE STILL TRYING TO FIGURE AWAY TO GET UP TO THE TOP OF THE NECK TRAIL FROM THE KONA AREA AND FAR ECHO WITH OUT HAVING TO USE THE LAKE FRO EITHE SIDE OF THE NECK.

OH THE "CAPS"? YES I AM SCREAMING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ANYONE TAKE NOTE OF THE NUMBER OF TRAIL CLOUSERS/TOTAL LOSS OF TRAIL SYSTEMS?

[SAB1]

Very frustrating! The trail off 19 mile bay parking lot that heads south to Lang pond road is closed again this year and the trail off Melvin bay that is a left at power line and goes to castle lot is closed again though many are using it (there is no rope across it just a sign which is a mistake) I met a nice guy in the castle lot Sunday afternoon that is working with Wolfboro club. He is trying to give Wolfboro a rerout across his land to help get this trail open again but....he said people have been snowmobiling all over his land the past two weeks and he's thinking of pulling back his offer. I agree with woodsy above, we all need to do more policing ourselves but it may not do much. I think a lot of non local people don't visit club websites and see the closures and they just follow tracks already on the trails. But then and again when I think of the way I see folks driving their boats on the lakes with little to no idea what a buoy is .........

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by WINNOCTURN

IGNORENT RIDERS hurt us more the Trash!

WHAT ABOUT THE RIDER THE DONOT OBEY THE SINAGE ON OUR TRAILS, SLOW, 10MPH AND SUCH.

WE ARE STILL TRYING TO FIGURE AWAY TO GET UP TO THE TOP OF THE NECK TRAIL FROM THE KONA AREA AND FAR ECHO WITH OUT HAVING TO USE THE LAKE FRO EITHE SIDE OF THE NECK.

OH THE "CAPS"? YES I AM SCREAMING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ANYONE TAKE NOTE OF THE NUMBER OF TRAIL CLOUSERS/TOTAL LOSS OF TRAIL SYSTEMS?

I think you are wrong about the riders being "Ignorent" (ignorant), I wish it were ignorance!... These riders can read signs, if they couldn't read or were uneducated or unaware that would be considered ignorant. Irresponsible and just don't give a sh&* is what these riders are. They have paid there registration fees and now they will ride where and however they want!

I have said it before and I will say it again, for whatever reason snowmobiling has more than its fair share of irresponsible people involved in the sport, more than any other outdoor sport I have ever been involved in by a long shot!

I agree with Woodsy and Sab1 that self policing is the only hope in hell we have to turn things around to save what few trails we have left. Even then I have my doubts...

Dan

[VitaBene]

Wow, this thread took on a life of its own!! We are fighting an uphill battle with land development and liability concerns. When we throw irresponsible riding into the mix, it becomes near impossible.

It is nice to see the support by many for our clubs and snowmobiling in general!

[Tom T]

Self policing and getting the word out to others is going to be the best way to handle these issues.

I volunteer with the Wolfeboro Snowmobile Club and SAB1 is correct we are close to having a reroute to the castle, if we get this through its in thanks to generous landowners. Anyone that is involved in this sport owes any landowner allowing trail access a world of thanks. Ishoot308 is correct a sign should be sufficient, even if we put fences up they find a way around them. A few just dont give a damn.

19 mile bay there was a no snowmobile sign posted, it sounds like someone took it down. Just another example if the ignorance of a few.

We have 3 no riding signs right next to each other near the transfer station and there are tracks going right through them. Again a few dont care. Maybe if we catch the ones abusing the right we can start getting the point across with a picture of there registration sent to fish and game. If you dont want to report them to fish and game notify your local club let them take care of it.

Our club has over 200 man hours into trail maintenance this year and this does not include our officers who spend countless hours talking with landowners, making sure permission forms are signed, looking for reroutes and the list goes on. All clubs work endless hours for all riders to enjoy. If we dont make a stand, police these individuals and spread the word our clubs will be gone.

Read the NHSA trail reports - many clubs are in the same battle. Moultonborough, Sandwich, Osspiee, Scurb Oaks are just a few in our backyards that have already lost trails.

Talk to your fellow riders, bring up the conversation at the coffee shops, local restaurants, happy hours wherever you like to spend time and have conversations. We need everyone to know about these issues. Most importantly we need the landowners to know we care.

[Woodsy]

It might be time for ALL of the clubs to invest in some trail cams for the trouble areas? This helps the property owners and the clubs....

Woodsy

[Tom T]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

It might be time for ALL of the clubs to invest in some trail cams for the trouble areas? This helps the property owners and the clubs....

Woodsy

I was just talking with our president about that today. Anything is worth a try

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

It might be time for ALL of the clubs to invest in some trail cams for the trouble areas? This helps the property owners and the clubs....

Woodsy

They would only get stolen or destroyed...

[tis]

Isn't it sad that we've come to this!?

[Woodsy]

ishoot...

While I do think them getting destroyed or stolen could happen.... the clubs have the advantage.

1st... the people don't know they are there... so there is the element of surprise.

2nd... clubs can use ladders to get the cam's high enough so that they cannot be reached easily.

3rd... the clubs can move the cameras around.

4th... a couple of well placed signs at junctions indicating trail cams are in use (junctions nowhere near actual trail cams) can go a long way.

Trailcams are a relatively inexpensive tool that can be used by the clubs and F&G to help with the issue.

Woodsy

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

ishoot...

While I do think them getting destroyed or stolen could happen.... the clubs have the advantage.

1st... the people don't know they are there... so there is the element of surprise.

2nd... clubs can use ladders to get the cam's high enough so that they cannot be reached easily.

3rd... the clubs can move the cameras around.

4th... a couple of well placed signs at junctions indicating trail cams are in use (junctions nowhere near actual trail cams) can go a long way.

Trailcams are a relatively inexpensive tool that can be used by the clubs and F&G to help with the issue.

Woodsy

Agreed....it's just my disgust with this subject makes me feel like this sport has no chance of surviving in NH. Unfortunately I have "the cup is always half empty" attitude on this topic...

Sorry;

Dan

[VitaBene]

We have a couple that we move around

[SAB1]

Its worth a try if some clubs have a little surplus cash. Installing them where trail closures are and getting numbers of those who cross the line is a great place to start. Just be aware, some of the cameras will be considered a donation because they will get stolen of smashed. As an avid hunter I can't tell you how many of ours have been stolen, smashed or tampered with (opening and taking the cards). Hiding them is key but people will see the foot prints in the snow going to them to check the cards. But its worth a shot.

[nhcatrider]

My local club at home had an issue about 5 years ago with irresponsible riding. We got sneaky putting up the cameras, I pulled my sled up near a tree and another rider brought a ladder over. We then sent a skinny person 20 feet up the ladder to put the camera up. 3 days later we had our culprits and the problem was solved. No footprints were left in the snow which helped, but its a bit awkward to carry a large ladder on a sled and not be noticed. Unfortunately this doesn't always work and the land owners close their land to us.

[Ridgefarmer63]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

ok people say its land owner rights where is the rights of the people that buy all these products to use. with more and more land being closed and passing the blame to the user is not the anwser.

LOL. Look boys, we found one !!!

[ApS]

Originally Posted by RTTOOL

ok people say its land owner rights where is the rights of the people that buy all these products to use. with more and more land being closed and
passing the blame to the user is not the answer.

While following this thread, I can't help but reflect on boaters who wonder why a law—restricting ocean-racers' summer "fun"—was signed into law by the Governor.

.

[Skip]

Originally Posted by ApS

While following this thread, I can't help but reflect on boaters who wonder why a law—restricting ocean-racers' summer "fun"—was signed into law by the Governor.

.

Of course you can’t, who would be surprised that for the thousandth time you would try to awaken the speed limit debate in yet another totally unrelated thread?

Well before the speed restriction was placed on Winnipesaukee, NH trails already had speed restrictions including a general 45 MPH upper limit on State trails.

You’ll need to find another angle.....

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Skip

Of course you can’t, who would be surprised that for the thousandth time you would try to awaken the speed limit debate in yet another totally unrelated thread?

Not "totally unrelated" at all. Trails are closing because a small number of sledders have no regard for their neighbors' wishes.

On the lake in the summer, there are a minority of boaters with a similar disregard for others. The big difference is that in the winter, the offended landowners have an easy solution. In the summer, it's much tougher for those offended, but ApS's response impulse is the same as the landowners closing their trails.

[Hillcountry]

Originally Posted by PeterG

Not "totally unrelated" at all. Trails are closing because a small number of sledders have no regard for their neighbors' wishes.

On the lake in the summer, there are a minority of boaters with a similar disregard for others. The big difference is that in the winter, the offended landowners have an easy solution. In the summer, it's much tougher for those offended, but ApS's response impulse is the same as the landowners closing their trails.

From my observations and experiences there is far more than a minority of scofflaw boaters during the summer...but the scarcity of MP is the reason...the tools know they won’t be caught.

[Skip]

Originally Posted by PeterG

Not "totally unrelated" at all. Trails are closing because a small number of sledders have no regard for their neighbors' wishes.

On the lake in the summer, there are a minority of boaters with a similar disregard for others. The big difference is that in the winter, the offended landowners have an easy solution. In the summer, it's much tougher for those offended, but ApS's response impulse is the same as the landowners closing their trails.

I will respectfully disagree. I’ve served on all board positions of my club, including club president. I’ve also served on several board positions including Vice President of the New Hampshire Snowmobile Association. Been a groomer operator for well over a decade. Sadly, I have too many first person dealings with trail closures within my club (OVSC) and at the State level while with the NHSA.

NEVER once was a trail closed due to speeding sleds. The most frequent reason is due to off trail riders. Loud (illegal exhaust) sleds followed closely by littering and property damage are a close second. And following up close behind is trail/property damage done by ATVs and trucks/ mud bloggers any time of the year, but particularly off season.

‘Nough said......

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Skip

I will respectfully disagree. I’ve served on all board positions of my club, including club president. I’ve also served on several board positions including Vice President of the New Hampshire Snowmobile Association. Been a groomer operator for well over a decade. Sadly, I have too many first person dealings with trail closures within my club (OVSC) and at the State level while with the NHSA.

NEVER once was a trail closed due to speeding sleds. The most frequent reason is due to off trail riders. Loud (illegal exhaust) sleds followed closely by littering and property damage are a close second. And following up close behind is trail/property damage done by ATVs and trucks/ mud bloggers any time of the year, but particularly off season.

‘Nough said......

Um...I'm not sure you do disagree. I did not mention speed in my post. I referred to disregard for others.

The issue is not the specific offense, but the absence of sensitivity, manners and common sense. Noise, speed, litter, property damage, right of way rules, etc...They're kind of all the same in terms of the reactions they provoke.

[Skip]

Originally Posted by PeterG

Um...I'm not sure you do disagree. I did not mention speed in my post. I referred to disregard for others.

The issue is not the specific offense, but the absence of sensitivity, manners and common sense. Noise, speed, litter, property damage, right of way rules, etc...They're kind of all the same in terms of the reactions they provoke.

Totally agree...thanks!

[swnoel]

What gives anyone who isn't a member of a club, the right to operate on any of the trails that are obviously private. I can't imagine just the fact they have a registered sled would give them that right... or has it something to do with registration funds used for maintaining those trails?

[Woodsy]

A NH sled registration gives you access to all of the sled trails in NH... just like a car registration gives you access to all public roads.

Most of the sled trails are on private, not public property. This gets ugly when people do not abide by the rules and ride off trail, leave trash, etc etc. The property owners then rescind their permission to cross the property!

Moral of the story.... don't be a TOOL! Respect the property owners and stay on the trail... carry in / carry out... keep quiet and don't mod your exhaust! If you go faster than 45... man up and take your speeding ticket if F&G catches you!

It is really pretty simple!

Woodsy

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Skip

I will respectfully disagree. I’ve served on all board positions of my club, including club president. I’ve also served on several board positions including Vice President of the New Hampshire Snowmobile Association. Been a groomer operator for well over a decade. Sadly, I have too many first person dealings with trail closures within my club (OVSC) and at the State level while with the NHSA.

NEVER once was a trail closed due to speeding sleds.
[#1]The most frequent reason is due to off trail riders.
[#2]Loud (illegal exhaust) sleds followed closely by littering and property damage are a close second. And following up close behind is trail/property damage done by ATVs and trucks/ mud bloggers any time of the year, but particularly off season. ‘Nough said......

It should be mentioned that a noisy sled is unlikely to get quieter as it achieves—or exceeds—posted speeds.

(As surmised by its #2 position above).

.

[SIKSUKR]

Originally Posted by ApS

It should be mentioned that a noisy sled is unlikely to get quieter as it achieves—or exceeds—posted speeds.

(As surmised by its #2 position above).

.

Yup, kind of like those old planes you love so much landing right off the lake. Its only important to you when it serves your agenda.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

Yup, kind of like those old planes you love so much landing right off the lake. Its only important to you when it serves your agenda.

Landings are quiet. But noise and speed are important regardless of whatever portion of the country they occur.

If you listen to radio, have conversations, or use a telephone at the lake, excessive noise is an undeniably anti-social intrusion.

Sure, acceleration is a factor, but where there are hills, there is going to be excessive noise. Stand alongside Wolfeboro's North Main Street some time, and try to tell me that a 4-stroke Harley is quiet going uphill.

I've pointed out my family moved to the Airpark—I was only 12, and had no "say". As it turned out, we were insulated from takeoff noise by a long, tall, hillside—and seldom heard landings. Perhaps, however, only on windless days—and only then—a landing consisted of a "chirp" of tires.

My poor neighbors near Thomas Point have had the worst noise from floatplane takeoffs, as high-drag "supersonic propeller-tip speed" blasted their ears. Wolfeboro property turnovers near Thomas Point are frequent. (A problem with buying "off-season").

Ironically, the Airpark's designated "lake landing strips" have become useless, as the increase in tubing—along with ever-increasing boat wakes—has turned floatplanes away.

My personal dislikes:

• Noisy sleds on Winnipesaukee ice.

• All floatplanes but Cessna 190 and one 130-HP Luscombe.

The Luscombe has the shortest takeoff run I've ever seen, and climbs to an impressive altitude immediately. Because free rides were given to Scouts, what little noise there was, could be overlooked.

.

[chipj29]

Originally Posted by ApS

Landings are quiet. But noise and speed are important regardless of whatever portion of the country they occur.

If you listen to radio, have conversations, or use a telephone at the lake, excessive noise is an undeniably anti-social intrusion.

Sure, acceleration is a factor, but where there are hills, there is going to be excessive noise. Stand alongside Wolfeboro's North Main Street some time, and try to tell me that a 4-stroke Harley is quiet going uphill.

I've pointed out my family moved to the Airpark—I was only 12, and had no "say". As it turned out, we were insulated from takeoff noise by a long, tall, hillside—and seldom heard landings. Perhaps, however, only on windless days—and only then—a landing consisted of a "chirp" of tires.

My poor neighbors near Thomas Point have had the worst noise from floatplane takeoffs, as high-drag "supersonic propeller-tip speed" blasted their ears. Wolfeboro property turnovers near Thomas Point are frequent. (A problem with buying "off-season").

Ironically, the Airpark's designated "lake landing strips" have become useless, as the increase in tubing—along with ever-increasing boat wakes—has turned floatplanes away.

My personal dislikes:

• Noisy sleds on Winnipesaukee ice.

• All floatplanes but Cessna 190 and one 130-HP Luscombe.

The Luscombe has the shortest takeoff run I've ever seen, and climbs to an impressive altitude immediately. Because free rides were given to Scouts, what little noise there was, could be overlooked.

.

Maybe we can get back on topic here. Float planes have nothing to do with snowmobile trail closures. For that matter, load sleds on the lake have nothing to do with trail closures, either.

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by ApS

It should be mentioned that a noisy sled is unlikely to get quieter as it achieves—or exceeds—posted speeds.

(As surmised by its #2 position above).

.

Your thinking is incorrect. A sled running at or near the legal snowmobile speed limit of 45 is quieter than when it is accelerating. It is loafing along at 45.

[Woodsy]

APS (Always Pushing Sh**) bringing up the speed limit where it has no relevance!

Unfortunately for APS, Speed has absolutely nothing to do with trail closures! For the most part loud sleds are thing of the past... especially with the rising popularity of the 4-stroke machines. You can drive a whisper quiet 200+ HP 4 stroke right from the factory!

Woodsy

[Skip]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

APS (Always Pushing Sh**) bringing up the speed limit where it has no relevance!

Unfortunately for APS, Speed has absolutely nothing to do with trail closures! For the most part loud sleds are thing of the past... especially with the rising popularity of the 4-stroke machines. You can drive a whisper quiet 200+ HP 4 stroke right from the factory!

Woodsy

Maybe speed/noise is a problem in the Sunshine State? Perhaps our esteemed poster could point us to the Florida Snowmobile Association page for further details??