The Dive

[wentworthwhitbreadIII]

Originally Posted by XCR-700

Kinda insane.

Not sure how this is fun for anyone, but thats their business as I have ZERO intention of participating in that mess.

Hard to believe the Dive is only 20' x 60' as it looks huge everytime I see it;

Crowded sandbars and The Dive add great ambiance to Lake Winnipesaukee. It's what Squam aspires to be someday. Anyone that does not want to raft and get drunk while wading in the urine of others just needs to get a life. #sandbarlife

[XCR-700]

Originally Posted by wentworthwhitbreadIII

Crowded sandbars and The Dive add great ambiance to Lake Winnipesaukee. It's what Squam aspires to be someday. Anyone that does not want to raft and get drunk while wading in the urine of others just needs to get a life. #sandbarlife

Well after spending the day yesterday at Wolfboro, around Melody - Keniston - Barndoor islands, the West Alton sandbar and Paugas Bay, I have to say we had a good day.

Watching the spectrum of boating skills displayed at the Wolfboro docks reassured me that I am correct about paddle boarders keeping back some distance. (and maybe even other boaters!) Some people got their boats on without any problem, some couldnt do it all and gave up, some only were able to dock with the help of multiple people on the dock helping, and a few were way too confident and cocky and stuffed boats in were they should not have and too what appeared like unnecessary and high risk. We had the whole spectrum on Sunday.

Tubing around the islands SE of Wolfboro was perfect, other boaters were well behaved, no reckless nonsense and no probems made for a good time.

West Alton sandbar was actually very quiet for a weekend day. I would not have stopped and anchored if it was not so quiet. No bad actors, no loud music no DIVE,,,

And speaking of the DIVE, it was also not on the sandbar in Paugas, well at least not at lunchtime. We saw it along the shore between the Margate and Christmas Island. It actually blended in very well I almost didnt notice it. If thats its new home I say bravo, but then I dont live there,,, Still, it was way better than at one of the sandbars.

I dont wish them any ill will, I just dont think they should be on the Paugas Bay or West Alton sandbar nor any of the town docks intended for boats. Elsewhere, maybe depends of where, and so far as I'm concerned it can cruise the lake all they want.

[Taz]

Originally Posted by XCR-700

Well after spending the day yesterday at Wolfboro, around Melody - Keniston - Barndoor islands, the West Alton sandbar and Paugas Bay, I have to say we had a good day.

Watching the spectrum of boating skills displayed at the Wolfboro docks reassured me that I am correct about paddle boarders keeping back some distance. (and maybe even other boaters!) Some people got their boats on without any problem, some couldnt do it all and gave up, some only were able to dock with the help of multiple people on the dock helping, and a few were way too confident and cocky and stuffed boats in were they should not have and too what appeared like unnecessary and high risk. We had the whole spectrum on Sunday.

Tubing around the islands SE of Wolfboro was perfect, other boaters were well behaved, no reckless nonsense and no probems made for a good time.

West Alton sandbar was actually very quiet for a weekend day. I would not have stopped and anchored if it was not so quiet. No bad actors, no loud music no DIVE,,,

And speaking of the DIVE, it was also not on the sandbar in Paugas, well at least not at lunchtime. We saw it along the shore between the Margate and Christmas Island. It actually blended in very well I almost didnt notice it. If thats its new home I say bravo, but then I dont live there,,, Still, it was way better than at one of the sandbars.

I dont wish them any ill will, I just dont think they should be on the Paugas Bay or West Alton sandbar nor any of the town docks intended for boats. Elsewhere, maybe depends of where, and so far as I'm concerned it can cruise the lake all they want.

I don't think just cruising the lake is sustainable and they can't do cruises anyway because they have no place they are allowed to pick up customers. I don't think doing sandbars is sustainable which was their original business plan. You get July and August to go to sandbars, not enough business and too cold to wade in the water before July and after August. They need a permanent home to tie up to and conduct business. Their one chance was Weirs and that's out now. I don't know anywhere else they can go. I would not be surprised if they are out of business on Winni in a year or two. I don't wish any ill will but I don't see how it's sustainable or worth the effort and aggravation on Winni. It should be in Florida or the Carribean.

[John Mercier]

The sandbars, etc, have a larger issue. Sewage.
We don't take the bath houses at the beaches and pump them into the lakes.

So if ''floating'' at the sandbars becomes too large a water quality issue, that venue could be gone rather quickly.

Beyond that, as this economic cycle wanes, customers are looking to the less expensive option. Pretty hard to beat a cooler with a couple of bags of ice.

[LikeLakes]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

The sandbars, etc, have a larger issue. Sewage.
We don't take the bath houses at the beaches and pump them into the lakes.

So if ''floating'' at the sandbars becomes too large a water quality issue, that venue could be gone rather quickly.

Beyond that, as this economic cycle wanes, customers are looking to the less expensive option. Pretty hard to beat a cooler with a couple of bags of ice.

Two things - first, and I'm in the camp of "hope they do well, but they certainly have a bad business plan and are quick to criticize their critics", meaning I'm not pro-Dive or anti-Dive ..... one thing you have to give to them, their clientele have a bathroom that has a holding tank that is properly pumped out when back at a dock. So if anything they help reduce the waste at the sandbars a bit, certainly do not add to it.

Second, on your last comment, I don't agree. Yes, anyone can go cheaper with a cooler, but Winni isn't about cheap, there are a ton of people that are willing, able, and anxious to pay $9 for a drink and I don't think they are going away in an economic cycle. Winnipesaukee is relatively immune from cycles, the wealth of the people at those sandbars is above John Q. Public that shifts to buying mac and cheese during economic downturns.

[John Mercier]

I didn't state they caused the sewage problem... just that ''floating'' may be restricted at all sandbars because of it.

And no... they really do not have more money than John Q Public.
You may think they do, but they really don't.

[LikeLakes]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

I didn't state they caused the sewage problem... just that ''floating'' may be restricted at all sandbars because of it.

And no... they really do not have more money than John Q Public.
You may think they do, but they really don't.

John, I didn't mean to imply you said they cause sewage problems, sorry about that. I just meant that if they show up at a sandbar it may be that they slightly reduce the problem.

On the money (wealth) part of it ... do you seriously think that lakefront and power boat owners on Winnipesaukee are not a wealthier group than the average citizen?

[Descant]

As I read it, "John Mercier" is pretty definitive in his statements. I disagree with some, but have no reason, i.e. Forum history, to give him the credibility he presumes, or to deny credibility. A little history or a more expansive profile would help. For example, posting about island services as a non-islander diminished his credibility on other issues. Obviously, anybody can post on anything, but I personally look at credentials from posters on some issues that deal with more closed issues. That's why, when posters look for help, I always want to know "Where are you?"

[John Mercier]

Really?
Who do you think these contractors purchase their materials from?

When I tell you we sell IKO... what establishment to you think I am talking about?

When I suggest that the tan LumberRock looks just like the Azek Brownstone and is priced the same way with delivery... what establishment comes to mind?

Most people have been in to Middleton and had me quote them something over the last several years... they not only have my card... they have my e*mail.

We ask the contractors continually if they are busy. We do that because the contractor contact list is a page long. Why waste a customers time by directing them to a contractor that is busy.

If you notice, I don't post on landscapers/lawn maintenance... because we don't generally handle most of what those contractors do.

As for the sandbar issue... it isn't new, and it isn't just the big lake.
While I fully believe the Dive is helping the situation... it isn't able to cover the scope of the situation.

And after 55 years of being born and raised here... I have watched economic cycle after economic cycle. Those with a high networth generally survive, those with a high income but little to no networth generally suffer.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

Really?
Who do you think these contractors purchase their materials from?

When I tell you we sell IKO... what establishment to you think I am talking about?

When I suggest that the tan LumberRock looks just like the Azek Brownstone and is priced the same way with delivery... what establishment comes to mind?

Most people have been in to Middleton and had me quote them something over the last several years... they not only have my card... they have my e*mail.

We ask the contractors continually if they are busy. We do that because the contractor contact list is a page long. Why waste a customers time by directing them to a contractor that is busy.

If you notice, I don't post on landscapers/lawn maintenance... because we don't generally handle most of what those contractors do.

As for the sandbar issue... it isn't new, and it isn't just the big lake.
While I fully believe the Dive is helping the situation... it isn't able to cover the scope of the situation.

And after 55 years of being born and raised here... I have watched economic cycle after economic cycle. Those with a high networth generally survive, those with a high income but little to no networth generally suffer.

I was wondering what lumber supply you worked at, now I know. I go in there all the time so I will ask for you, sent you a PM.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I was wondering what lumber supply you worked at, now I know. I go in there all the time so I will ask for you, sent you a PM.

Unless I am circulating, they would need to call me down from upstairs.
I usually have set appointments or meetings. Saturdays, unless I have an appointment (lots of customers are starting to go that route), I will usually be on the floor.

You may want to think about tomorrow mid-day... they have a contractor cook-out with vendors coming in. Trex is one on the schedule.

[LikeLakes]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

And after 55 years of being born and raised here... I have watched economic cycle after economic cycle. Those with a high networth generally survive, those with a high income but little to no networth generally suffer.

That is a very true statement, I couldn't agree more.

But, whether they survive long term, or earn fast and blow it in the long run, I'm still saying the people at the sandbar are on average a far wealthier group than an average group of citizens. I don't think bars and restaurants on the lake and The Dive will go out of business because there aren't enough people to buy $9 drinks and $34 steaks, if they do it's because they have a bad business model, or in the case of the past year something out of their control pushes them out.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by LikeLakes

That is a very true statement, I couldn't agree more.

But, whether they survive long term, or earn fast and blow it in the long run, I'm still saying the people at the sandbar are on average a far wealthier group than an average group of citizens. I don't think bars and restaurants on the lake and The Dive will go out of business because there aren't enough people to buy $9 drinks and $34 steaks, if they do it's because they have a bad business model, or in the case of the past year something out of their control pushes them out.

A bad business model is when your customer base is where you are not. Do you think the Dive's customers are going to upgrade $18 drinks and $34 steaks, or downgrade to $2 beers and steaks/burgers off the grill of the nearby pontoon boat?

But the people that are currently earning the same as the sandbar group, but drinking the $2 beer and getting a burger off the barbie... they will not only keep going... they will have all the money they saved up to keep going.