Building a fire in a wood stove

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Dick, thank you for this detailed reply. I see you have the same challenge as I do with the size of your stove. I guess loading diagonally is the only solution. I use "bottom up" loading in the sense that I start by placing two larger logs in the bottom. I find that that creates 3" or so of air space at the bottom. Otherwise, the pile of kindling tends to collapse and smother the fire. I never knew a clothes dryer could create a draft! I open a window on the theory that it will improve both draft and air quality. My chimney is probably a bit short, and it's on the down side of a hill.

I'm confused. Is your stove only 14-16" both ways? Attached is a pic to clarify N/S/E/W as I think Dick has it backwards in his summary.

Unless you have too-long wood for both orientations, you should be choosing one. Short pieces for quick starts/shorter burns = N/S, normal pieces for normal/extended burns = E/W.

If your fires aren't starting easily, you either have unseasoned (too moist) wood or not enough air. The air problem could be a damper/draft issue or clogged stove inlet.

Essentially, if things are "right," you shouldn't have to jump through hoops to pile the wood in a way that there's a lot of space/air.

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

I'm confused. Is your stove only 14-16" both ways? Attached is a pic to clarify N/S/E/W as I think Dick has it backwards in his summary.

Unless you have too-long wood for both orientations, you should be choosing one. Short pieces for quick starts/shorter burns = N/S, normal pieces for normal/extended burns = E/W.

If your fires aren't starting easily, you either have unseasoned (too moist) wood or not enough air. The air problem could be a damper/draft issue or clogged stove inlet.

Essentially, if things are "right," you shouldn't have to jump through hoops to pile the wood in a way that there's a lot of space/air.

My wood fits east-west. It doesn't fit north-south. Your photos illustrate the problem: no air! There's no way my stove would burn a good fire loaded like that. My fires start fine. Adding more wood is difficult because the pieces only fit one way, which makes it hard to get air in the pile.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

My wood fits east-west. It doesn't fit north-south. Your photos illustrate the problem: no air! There's no way my stove would burn a good fire loaded like that. My fires start fine. Adding more wood is difficult because the pieces only fit one way, which makes it hard to get air in the pile.

So that's my point: there's no such thing as getting "air into the pile." Unless it's a weird stove, your air inlet is towards the front and/or front top of the stove. The purpose of that design is to pack the firebox tight with wood so it burns from top/front to down/back.

What, exactly, is the problem you're having?

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

So that's my point: there's no such thing as getting "air into the pile." Unless it's a weird stove, your air inlet is towards the front and/or front top of the stove. The purpose of that design is to pack the firebox tight with wood so it burns from top/front to down/back.

What, exactly, is the problem you're having?

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Are you sure about that? I read somewhere that modern stoves are harder to get a hot fire going and maintain it. The air inlet is at the back near the bottom, plus in the tubes with holes in them on the underside of the top of the stove. My stove absolutely cannot be "packed tight."

What's my problem? As I said in my original post, "I try to criss-cross the pieces diagonally, but usually they eventually collapse so that they're all lined up lengthwise with insufficient air between the pieces." And then the fire dies down. Eventually I do get a hot fire going, it's just that the wood pile is precarious.

Here's a photo of my wood stove. It's a CFM (made in Canada) bought at Home Depot around 2005.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Are you sure about that? I read somewhere that modern stoves are harder to get a hot fire going and maintain it. The air inlet is at the back near the bottom, plus in the tubes with holes in them on the underside of the top of the stove. My stove absolutely cannot be "packed tight."

What's my problem? As I said in my original post, "I try to criss-cross the pieces diagonally, but usually they eventually collapse so that they're all lined up lengthwise with insufficient air between the pieces." And then the fire dies down. Eventually I do get a hot fire going, it's just that the wood pile is precarious.

Here's a photo of my wood stove. It's a CFM (made in Canada) bought at Home Depot around 2005.

Ok, so if you look at your stove, the air control slide is in the front at the bottom—right inside the front door is the "dog house," which is where the air comes in. The burner tubes at the top only "recycle" combustible air.

With that stove, you absolutely should be able to pack it full and have it burn front to back. If not, you've got a poor draft and/or blockage.

If you don't want to get into problem-solving/learning to burn properly (not a criticism, just clarifying), then I would split some small wedges and put them between your stacked logs to "let the air in."

PS That's an Englander 13 (essentially identical: https://www.acmestoveco.com/product/...3-nc-pedestal/), which I also own. It's a notoriously difficult stove to master given the size, especially if the venting/drafting system is imperfect.

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

It's a notoriously difficult stove to master given the size, especially if the venting/drafting system is imperfect.

Can you elaborate on that?

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Can you elaborate on that?

So, because it's a fairly small box, it's tough to find the right balance for the air adjustment (front slide) that keeps the fire hot and cruising without burning through too quickly.

Do you have a temperature gauge on the flue? That's pretty important to figure out when to close the air and when to keep it open, etc.

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[SailinAway]

I watched this video yesterday: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Rc-4cwJ1Y

It shows how to split very large chunks of wood by hand by placing the axe on the outside edge and striking it with a mallet, rather than hitting it with an axe or maul in the center. I tried this method today and it worked! However, for me, at least, it was nowhere near as easy as this guy shows in the video. I was splitting maple that's been drying for 3 years (plus it was dead when it was cut down). Some of the grain was pretty ornery and it took forever to split it. Also, my axe took a beating and got stuck often.

(I know you can also split large chunks by cutting off small wedges around the outside. I'll try that next time to compare.)

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

I watched this video yesterday: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Rc-4cwJ1Y

It shows how to split very large chunks of wood by hand by placing the axe on the outside edge and striking it with a mallet, rather than hitting it with an axe or maul in the center. I tried this method today and it worked! However, for me, at least, it was nowhere near as easy as this guy shows in the video. I was splitting maple that's been drying for 3 years (plus it was dead when it was cut down). Some of the grain was pretty ornery and it took forever to split it. Also, my axe took a beating and got stuck often.

(I know you can also split large chunks by cutting off small wedges around the outside. I'll try that next time to compare.)

If you're gonna be splitting by hand, grab a Fiskars X25.

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

If you're gonna be splitting by hand, grab a Fiskars X25.

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I know the Fiskars have great reviews. Yesterday I bought a little Fiskars X7 hatchet for splitting kindling based on excellent reviews. I didn't find it effective at all. There's something odd about the shape of the blade---it barely penetrates the wood and bounces back. I sharpened an old hatchet I got for $5 at a yard sale and it works way better than the Fiskars. According to a YouTube review, a Fiskars axe is great for chopping but not as good for splitting. I sharpened my old axe too and it works pretty well, but I assume that axes are better these days (?). I'm going to return the X7.

Very informative video, Fiskars vs Gerber vs Estwing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gi3NkYGpZi8

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

I know the Fiskars have great reviews. Yesterday I bought a little Fiskars X7 hatchet for splitting kindling based on excellent reviews. I didn't find it effective at all. There's something odd about the shape of the blade---it barely penetrates the wood and bounces back. I sharpened an old hatchet I got for $5 at a yard sale and it works way better than the Fiskars. According to a YouTube review, a Fiskars axe is great for chopping but not as good for splitting. I sharpened my old axe too and it works pretty well, but I assume that axes are better these days (?). I'm going to return the X7.

Very informative video, Fiskars vs Gerber vs Estwing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gi3NkYGpZi8

Those are hatchets, not to be confused with axes or splitting axes. Maple gets really stringy with age, but the Fiskars splitting axes are as good as I've ever used.

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Those are hatchets, not to be confused with axes or splitting axes. Maple gets really stringy with age, but the Fiskars splitting axes are as good as I've ever used.

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Yes, I know the differences between a hatchet, axe, and maul. I have one of each.

[DickR]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

...Attached is a pic to clarify N/S/E/W as I think Dick has it backwards in his summary....

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Your pictures show what I was describing. The first two small pieces of kindling go in front to back ("N-S"), other kindling on top so as to provide air space to get the blaze going, and larger splits on top of that pile, diagonally, N-S, and E-W to provide stability as the kindling burns through and the pile settles. But I'm not putting in a full firebox load, as in your pictures. Also, my firebox (inside the bricks) is just over 17" deep (N-S) by just over 13" wide (E-W). It's a Quadrafire 2100 Millenium. Also, mine has the primary air low in front and the secondary tubes up top in the middle. After I get the stove up to temperature, I close the primary air control and the stove is running on "secondaries." The heat of the process makes the wood undergo pyrolysis, and the gases combine with the superheated air from the tubes, igniting the mixture.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by DickR

Your pictures show what I was describing. The first two small pieces of kindling go in front to back ("N-S"), other kindling on top so as to provide air space to get the blaze going, and larger splits on top of that pile, diagonally, N-S, and E-W to provide stability as the kindling burns through and the pile settles. But I'm not putting in a full firebox load, as in your pictures. Also, my firebox (inside the bricks) is just over 17" deep (N-S) by just over 13" wide (E-W). It's a Quadrafire 2100 Millenium. Also, mine has the primary air low in front and the secondary tubes up top in the middle. After I get the stove up to temperature, I close the primary air control and the stove is running on "secondaries." The heat of the process makes the wood undergo pyrolysis, and the gases combine with the superheated air from the tubes, igniting the mixture.

You sure on those measurements? The schematic online shows that the front door is 13", which means you must have at least 16" inside and probably closer to 17". There's very few (new) stoves that don't take at least 16" logs.

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