The Dive?

[WakeboardMom]

Did anyone make it to The Dive this weekend? Curious if you were able to drop off people on these chilly days.

It would be a fun place to watch the game when it's a 1:00 game like yesterday.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by WakeboardMom

Did anyone make it to The Dive this weekend? Curious if you were able to drop off people on these chilly days.

It would be a fun place to watch the game when it's a 1:00 game like yesterday.

Drop off was open this past weekend and also you can now order food on the app and pick up at the drive thru window. Obviously with the weather and schools in NH, MA, Ct, NY back in session Smalls Cove was not crowded at all and the Dive did not look very busy.

[Taz]

Originally Posted by joey2665

Drop off was open this past weekend and also you can now order food on the app and pick up at the drive thru window. Obviously with the weather and schools in NH, MA, Ct, NY back in session Smalls Cove was not crowded at all and the Dive did not look very busy.

Even with drop off open some one still needs to anchor and wade/walk to the dive. Water still warm but air was cold and no one wants to sit outside with wet clothes on a cold day. They need a shuttle if they want to attract business this time of year.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Taz

Even with drop off open some one still needs to anchor and wade/walk to the dive. Water still warm but air was cold and no one wants to sit outside with wet clothes on a cold day. They need a shuttle if they want to attract business this time of year.

I absolutely agree. I was just responding to a previous post. If they are going to continue to operate this time of year and later into the fall then they must devise some type of shuttle service for the captain of the boats dropping people.

[WakeboardMom]

Originally Posted by joey2665

If they are going to continue to operate this time of year and later into the fall then they must devise some type of shuttle service for the captain of the boats dropping people.

Should be NBD on a 600k investment. The manpower might be the issue. And maybe insurance.

https://www.amazon.com/Z-Ray-Surveyo...latable+dinghy

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by WakeboardMom

Should be NBD on a 600k investment. The manpower might be the issue. And maybe insurance.

https://www.amazon.com/Z-Ray-Surveyo...latable+dinghy

Yes with a 600k investment they need to be imaginative and think outside to box to extend their season and start their season as early as possible in order to maximize the ROI

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by joey2665

Yes with a 600k investment they need to be imaginative and think outside to box to extend their season and start their season as early as possible in order to maximize the ROI

Agreed, but that is also more money. As much money as they invested, it seems like they missed some important aspects. Even if they have a dinghy, people still need to be out there...

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[joey2665]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Agreed, but that is also more money. As much money as they invested, it seems like they missed some important aspects. Even if they have a dinghy, people still need to be out there...

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Yes they did miss quite a few very important aspects. 1) underpowering the vessel 2) getting patrons (boats captains) to and from their boats when the weather isn't idle to wade or swim or when the captain doesn't want to get wet before boarding 3) from a strict financial point of view, investing 600k in a bar/restaurant with an extremely short season.

I truly hope they succeed but as a CPA and one that invests commercially in businesses and real estate tis is a business I would never invest in myself nopr would I advise a client to invest.

[Cal Coon]

I went out briefly saturday, and the Dive had a 22' or 24' center console tied up to it and I thought that it was probably being used as a shuttle. It was early in the day, and the only people on the Dive were employees, so I don't think the center console belonged to a patron on board the Dive. It was tied up and idling, (cc), with no one on board which I thought was kind of strange.

[Descant]

Originally Posted by joey2665

Yes they did miss quite a few very important aspects. 1) underpowering the vessel 2) getting patrons (boats captains) to and from their boats when the weather isn't idle to wade or swim or when the captain doesn't want to get wet before boarding 3) from a strict financial point of view, investing 600k in a bar/restaurant with an extremely short season.

I truly hope they succeed but as a CPA and one that invests commercially in businesses and real estate tis is a business I would never invest in myself nor would I advise a client to invest.

Right. I would not expect my CPA to advise in favor of anything risky. I also would not expect him/her to be richer than I am since I might take greater risks. I would need him/her to guide me through bankruptcy. Risk vs. reward, right?
I expect the Dive will be reworking their business plan for 2019 to include events and ticketed cruises (new power?) and perhaps negotiating a better homeport.
Homeporting at a marina or resort with lots of parking and no restaurant/bar
would work.
Remember that 600K could have been spent on a restaurant development and you would pay big property taxes. The Dive, by comparison, pays registration fees, but no property taxes. Remove the engines and use a tow boat, and I think no registration fees, just for the tow boat.
Maybe she'll find an island home and be Mama Lucy's II? Stranger things have happened on Winnipesaukee.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Descant

Right. I would not expect my CPA to advise in favor of anything risky. I also would not expect him/her to be richer than I am since I might take greater risks. I would need him/her to guide me through bankruptcy. Risk vs. reward, right? .

I don’t understand the comment about the CPA’s personal finances and what they have to do with there analysis of an investment and the risks vs rewards or expecting your CPA to have less net worth than their clients.

In my opinion it is completely irrelevant. If this was the case I would lose 75% of my clients.



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[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Descant

Maybe she'll find an island home and be Mama Lucy's II? Stranger things have happened on Winnipesaukee.

When you start thinking about places that could accommodate a 66 X 22 vessel the number of options is very small. Off the top of my head I know of no island docks that are capable of handling a vessel this size. Then there are the associated issues, such as where would any customers dock their boats.

As far as a different mainland location, the size again presents a problem. When you eliminate the commercial locations that would not want the competition for the food business the list gets even smaller. Thinking about the whole lake, there are few docks that the Dive could fit at, even if they were welcomed.

The booze cruise idea might help the bottom line if they could find a town or any location where they could temporarily dock to allow passengers to board. That would have to be a location with substantial parking. Laconia has already said no, (they didn't even want the Tiki Boats to pick up passengers there) and it may be difficult to find any other town that will approve it.

Although it is a unique idea, given the initial investment, insurance, and operating costs, the numbers just don't seem to me to be workable. I could be wrong but I would be surprised if it is still operating by 2020.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

When you start thinking about places that could accommodate a 66 X 22 vessel the number of options is very small. Off the top of my head I know of no island docks that are capable of handling a vessel this size. Then there are the associated issues, such as where would any customers dock their boats.

As far as a different mainland location, the size again presents a problem. When you eliminate the commercial locations that would not want the competition for the food business the list gets even smaller. Thinking about the whole lake, there are few docks that the Dive could fit at, even if they were welcomed.

The booze cruise idea might help the bottom line if they could find a town or any location where they could temporarily dock to allow passengers to board. That would have to be a location with substantial parking. Laconia has already said no, (they didn't even want the Tiki Boats to pick up passengers there) and it may be difficult to find any other town that will approve it.

Although it is a unique idea, given the initial investment, insurance, and operating costs, the numbers just don't seem to me to be workable. I could be wrong but I would be surprised if it is still operating by 2020.

The idea was probably to actively use the short summer season, then "park" their barge for the winter. Where? Where all the other barges "park" for the winter. (And there are an increasing number of barges on this lake).

One blue work barge was "grounded" across from me in Winter Harbor. Then one Spring day, it left. It appeared to have sunk in place—whether deliberately or not, I don't know. With the pressure of ice equal inside and out, it didn't appear crushed; in fact, it seemed to have weathered the winter OK. The barge had made its own island!

Originally Posted by Taz

Say the Dive was going to Braun Bay. How long would it take to go from WAM to Braun? It seems like it would be awful slow and maybe not feasible to go that far. There are not many areas it could go to be profitable. I think 3, Braun, Smalls, Margate sand bars and Braun, Margate maybe not feasible to go to, take too long to get there and back, also
not sure how it would handle a rough water day were it to travel. Smalls maybe its only feasible option.

A couple of days ago, the wind came up from the west—very strongly. I was surprised to see a work barge leaving a protected anchorage to start its journey crossing this wind at 90°.

.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Laconia has already said no, (they didn't even want the Tiki Boats to pick up passengers there) and it may be difficult to find any other town that will approve it.

Agreed. Come to our town, take up dock space and parking, then motor people away from our tax-paying restaurants and bars to spend their money--no thanks.

[Woodsy]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Agreed. Come to our town, take up dock space and parking, then motor people away from our tax-paying restaurants and bars to spend their money--no thanks.

Laconia has some sort of no-compete agreement with the Mount... that's why the Tiki Boats, the Winni Belle and now the Dive cannot use the Weirs docks.

I suspect however they could strike a $$ deal with a local marina for pick up/drop off!

If the Dive can replace the lower units on their outboards to a more "work boat" friendly setup.... they will be able to move about the lake next year easily.

Woodsy

[fatlazyless]

For $250 The Dive can get one of those blue Sun Dolphin Bali 13'6" x 34", 70-lb, capacity 500-lb, two seater plus, sit-on-top family kayaks from the Plymouth Walmart, and just let the customers paddle it themselves ........ it can even be hand paddled with just arms and hands ..... no paddles ...... a courtesy kayak .... boat to barge ..... barge to boat ..... boat to boat ..... boat to shoreline for a quick pee..... sounds like fun ..... helloooo, WHO needs the kayak? ....... and where-o-where is the kayak? ...... more user friendly than a stand up paddle board ...... where to Governor? ....... paddle-ho ho ho!

[joey2665]

Just like in "Poltergeist" he's back....................

[WakeboardMom]

Originally Posted by Cal Coon

I went out briefly saturday, and the Dive had a 22' or 24' center console tied up to it and I thought that it was probably being used as a shuttle. It was early in the day, and the only people on the Dive were employees, so I don't think the center console belonged to a patron on board the Dive. It was tied up and idling, (cc), with no one on board which I thought was kind of strange.

They use it to shuttle employees to and from The Dive and for supply runs. When they have it tied up there, it's difficult for captains to discharge passengers/customers who don't care to wade or swim in order to board.

[noreast]

Originally Posted by joey2665

I absolutely agree. I was just responding to a previous post. If they are going to continue to operate this time of year and later into the fall then they must devise some type of shuttle service for the captain of the boats dropping people.

Or shuttle it down to Florida for the next 9 months.

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by noreast

Or shuttle it down to Florida for the next 9 months.

LOL. It would take 9 months just to get it to FL, plus a handful of permits to move it from Winnipesaukee to any water body not land-locked.

[Rusty]

Vermin will have a good place to nest this winter.

[Cal Coon]

Originally Posted by WakeboardMom

They use it to shuttle employees to and from The Dive and for supply runs. When they have it tied up there, it's difficult for captains to discharge passengers/customers who don't care to wade or swim in order to board.

Why not just use it as a shuttle then, for everyone? Instead of the Captain of the boat dropping off passengers, why not just set anchor and call the Dive for "pick up", and they come get you. Bring people back and forth to their boats, no one gets wet when it's cold, win, win for everyone. (I realize this gets difficult as the sand bar becomes crowded, maybe use a smaller boat??) Or, maybe people can just start blowing their "air horn' for pick up like they do at yacht clubs for moored boats... Something else for people to complain about!!

[Taz]

Originally Posted by Cal Coon

Why not just use it as a shuttle then, for everyone? Instead of the Captain of the boat dropping off passengers, why not just set anchor and call the Dive for "pick up", and they come get you. Bring people back and forth to their boats, no one gets wet when it's cold, win, win for everyone. (I realize this gets difficult as the sand bar becomes crowded, maybe use a smaller boat??) Or, maybe people can just start blowing their "air horn' for pick up like they do at yacht clubs for moored boats... Something else for people to complain about!!

Tell that to the Dive, their not doing that.

[Cal Coon]

Originally Posted by Taz

Tell that to the Dive, their not doing that.

It all depends on how desperate thing's become, desperate people do desperate thing's... However, you may be right, maybe this is just a hobby for someone and money is no object. Time will tell...

[Taz]

Originally Posted by Cal Coon

It all depends on how desperate thing's become, desperate people do desperate thing's... However, you may be right, maybe this is just a hobby for someone and money is no object. Time will tell...

Funny we are having this conversation. Just saw a FB post on the Dive FB page dated 9/8 where they announce they will have Pats on Sunday but say nothing of shuttle. Some one asked on the post that people need to board without getting wet and the Dive answered as of 9/10 they will shuttle customers. Why didn't they mention it in post heading? It's buried in the questions. They did a poor job of letting customers know this.

[noreast]

I thought food pick up (drive through) was going to be the M.O?

[Descant]

Anchoring and getting a shuttle pick up is certainly an improvement over trying to dock at the Weirs.

[Flyfisha]

Just saw the dive out on a cruise. Just rounded Smith Point towards Diamond??

[fatlazyless]

Driving past on Rt 25 thought I saw The Dive tied up to the long dock at the Center Harbor Inn, so's I drove down to the Center Harbor town beach there and sure enough, the bow of The Dive is right up against the outermost end of that long dock there.

Looks like Center Harbor welcomes The Dive, or something?

Saw it there at 4:00-pm, on Friday. Facebook says it has a private party. Maybe it will show in the Center Harbor Inn web cam?

[GBGX2]

https://www.facebook.com/thedivelake...8444181626502/

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by GBGX2

https://www.facebook.com/thedivelake...8444181626502/

does that video look like Center Harbor bay?

[thinkxingu]

We saw them cruising out of Center Harbor last night around 6-6:30.

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[rsmlp]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

We saw them cruising out of Center Harbor last night around 6-6:30.

What a PERFECT night they had!

[joey2665]

The Dive finally starting to venture of if Smalls Cove. Headed to Braun Bay today.

https://www.facebook.com/thedivelake...9915349784008/


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[LoveLakeLife]

IMG_0442.MOV


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[ApS]

Originally Posted by joey2665

The Dive finally starting to venture of if Smalls Cove. Headed to Braun Bay today.

Someday, with a spreading franchise, four "The Dives" will be squatting on all four sandbars.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by ApS

Someday, with a spreading franchise, four "The Dives" will be squatting on all four sandbars.

Highly doubt that. . This gives the people around Smalls a break


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[GBGX2]

https://www.facebook.com/events/725969801073939/

TUESDAY OCTOBER 2ND join us 6:00 - 9:00pm for our KARAOKE BOOZE CRUISE with DJ Oz & The Dive Crew! Tickets on sale starting Sunday 9/23 at Eventbrite.com $20 per passenger.


ONLY 65 tickets available! Ticketed guests will board at Alton Bay Public Docks beginning at 5:30 gang plank up & departure at 6:00 sharp! Full menu available until 8:30, full bar until last call at 8:45. We look forward to celebrating this event with all of you!!

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by GBGX2

Attachment 14266

https://www.facebook.com/events/725969801073939/

TUESDAY OCTOBER 2ND join us 6:00 - 9:00pm for our KARAOKE BOOZE CRUISE with DJ Oz & The Dive Crew! Tickets on sale starting Sunday 9/23 at Eventbrite.com $20 per passenger.


ONLY 65 tickets available! Ticketed guests will board at Alton Bay Public Docks beginning at 5:30 gang plank up & departure at 6:00 sharp! Full menu available until 8:30, full bar until last call at 8:45. We look forward to celebrating this event with all of you!!

A little odd it’s on a Tuesday and not a weekend or holiday. Not many tourists or seasonal residents during the week in October. Columbus weekend would be better.


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[Descant]

Do the Selectman give permission for a commercial use of the public docks? Maybe a weekend date is already too busy, parking, etc.?

[strum]

Doing this on a Tuesday in October?????? Who is going to go!

[GBGX2]

https://www.facebook.com/thedivelake...video_explicit

[fatlazyless]

Sure seems like the time, money and effort to build The Dive would have been better spent constructing a dredge barge for working the shallow Alaskan coastal waters, sucking up pay dirt muck from the bottom of the Bering Sea, looking for gold. Who knows, maybe it will get converted into a dredge, and go to the Bering Sea …… talk about a slow voyage from here to Alaska?

In Alaska, they scream: Gold, we got yellow color showing in the box!

In Alton, NH, they scream: Wanna go visit The Dive and get a beer for 12-dollars!

[Hillcountry]

Originally Posted by GBGX2

https://www.facebook.com/thedivelake...video_explicit

Only thing I can say is why? Maybe they contracted with someone for off season docking?

[Momo]

There isn’t enough booze in the bay to go out on the Dive barge on a night like tonight. Kudos to those who do go out.... at least your beer will be cold😀

[Taz]

The Dive just announced after driving all the way to Alton town docks, they were greeted by Alton police and were not permitted to use the town docks to board passengers, supplies, can not use the docks for anything to do with their cruise. They didn't arrange permission with the town prior to the event? What is wrong with the owners? They then had to return to WAM to board and leave from there and cruise is now 7 -10, and they missed out on the DJ because they couldn't reach him before they left Alton.

$20 just to board, $12 - $14 for overpriced average cocktails in the pouring rain with only partial cover from the rain. It's a Tuesday also. I don't think they thought this through at all.

[tis]

Somebody posted a picture of it in the Bay. It looked very lonely.

[fatlazyless]

If only The Dive can land a $25,000/tv episode gig with the Discovery Channel for a reality tv show on-board The Dive ..... doing what the Dive does best ..... floating around the lake ..... and drinking ..... another week on-board The Dive ... glug-glug-glug.

[Patofnaud]

Originally Posted by Taz

The Dive just announced after driving all the way to Alton town docks, they were greeted by Alton police and we're not permitted to use the town docks to board passengers, supplies, can not use the docks for anything to do with their cruise.

Sigh.. Folks trying to make a living and folks whining about everything ruining it for others. I'm sure there were so many other folks wanting to use those docks tonight.

It's either the boats are too fast and they are ruining the lake, or they are too slow and ruin the lake. NIMBY.

[Descant]

Obviously not friendly to business, as are most administrators of town docks. e.g. Gilford, Laconia, etc. I'm a little surprised that the Dive didn't foresee this. At the same time, it would have been nice on a rainy night in October, for the police to give the Dive a ticket for $100 when they returned at the end of the cruise instead of totally preventing it. After all, until they started boarding passengers, no law was broken and nobody was hurt. Regardless, a phone call in either direction would have been a better plan.

[fatlazyless]

If they phoned Alton Town Hall, "hellooooooo, can we use your dock? ....... the presumed answer would be "sorry, no", but if they just do it, maybe it will slide by and get it done ..... ok?

What's a super-duper, totally awesome business plan for The Dive? If The Dive was really smart thinking, it would invade Downing's Landing at the southern most tip of Alton Bay, tie up to the dock there, raise their flag, and declare Downing's Landing to be their permanent, forever home. Is so nice to have a place to call home, and that shaky-waky state dock would probably get rebuilt a whole lot sooner... ha-ha-ha.

[tis]

I know in Wolfeboro the Mount and Winni Belle and Millie B (Boat Museum) all have to go to the town to get permission to use the docks.

[Skip]

Originally Posted by Descant

Obviously not friendly to business, as are most administrators of town docks. e.g. Gilford, Laconia, etc. I'm a little surprised that the Dive didn't foresee this. At the same time, it would have been nice on a rainy night in October, for the police to give the Dive a ticket for $100 when they returned at the end of the cruise instead of totally preventing it. After all, until they started boarding passengers, no law was broken and nobody was hurt. Regardless, a phone call in either direction would have been a better plan.

Actually the attached ordinance that prevents this type of activity was passed by the voters of Alton at a March 14th, 1990 town meeting.

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by Skip

Actually the attached ordinance that prevents this type of activity was passed by the voters of Alton at a March 14th, 1990 town meeting.

wouldn't The Dive be a taxpayer in Alton?

[joey2665]

"taxpayer" is a broad term in this regulation. It does not specify residential or commercial so I agree that The Dive is a taxpayer.

I did not see anywhere on FB were they posted a video of the activity on the cruise last night. Just wondering again with it being during the week, inclement weather and not in season how well it was attended.

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by AC2717

wouldn't The Dive be a taxpayer in Alton?

While you could probably argue that they are a taxpayer, it does not appear that they applied for the permit that is also required.

[chillininnh]

I don't see them ever getting permission in Alton or anywhere else. Yeah, it's October and the docks are empty and the parking plentiful. If you let them dock now, would you be obligated then to let them do it in season when the docks are full and the parking tight? How would you like to own a seasonal business near the public dock and have all the parking spaces gobbled up by Dive customers?

[Woodsy]

I told the people running the Dive when they were planning to use the Laconia town docks, that the City of Laconia would deny them access. (Prior experience with friends wanting the 'Belle to pick up passengers for a wedding). They also don't let the Tiki Boats pick up there either.

I think its funny they (the Dive) are surprised... No doubt the same goes for Alton.

I think they have a "no compete" clause with the Mount....

Woodsy

[fatlazyless]

Considering that the Coast Guard considers stand up paddle boards to be a vessel, requiring a pfd and a whislte, as well as a white light at night; is it ok by the City of Laconia for me to access myself and a stand up paddle board from the Weirs Beach town boat docks into the lake, there, and paddle out into the lake?

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Considering that the Coast Guard considers stand up paddle boards to be a vessel, requiring a pfd and a whislte, as well as a white light at night; is it ok by the City of Laconia for me to access myself and a stand up paddle board from the Weirs Beach town boat docks into the lake, there, and paddle out into the lake?

Just curious: How do you see the comparison of your personal use of a town dock with the commercial use of the dock? The logic escapes me.

[Hillcountry]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Just curious: How do you see the comparison of your personal use of a town dock with the commercial use of the dock? The logic escapes me.

Lol...the fat, lazy one rarely displays the use of logic in his posts. More like hitting a “tennis ball of random thoughts” back and forth until he goes out of bounds...

[tis]

You really don't think the town of Alton would let them use it long enough to just pick up and drop off passengers. I don't know what harm that would do once in a while. How can they allow one commercial vessel and not another?

[fatlazyless]

Woodsy's post was about The Dive not being able to use the Laconia-Weirs Beach town boat docks, and my thinking was about accessing the water with a stand up paddle board from the same location, the Laconia-Weirs Beach town boat docks.

And, it was prefaced with the Off Topic emoticon.

Sups are a different type of a vessel than what is usually considered to be a vessel, because weighing just 20-30-40lbs, they are portable and can be carried under your arm for quite a distance, like down the steep steps from the Weirs' boardwalk, to the docks, to the water, and launched into the water.

This is one of those issues somewhat similar to The Dive using the Alton Town Dock where it may be better to just go for it without asking permission first, and a lot depends on what happens at the time it gets done ……. or something like that!

When you see flashing blue lights awaiting at the town dock, you know that 'just going for it' ain't gonna happen today.

Is one of dos tings …… Mt TiltonBB and Mr Hillcountry!

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Hillcountry

Lol...the fat, lazy one rarely displays the use of logic in his posts. More like hitting a “tennis ball of random thoughts” back and forth until he goes out of bounds...

[upthesaukee]

You really don't think the town of Alton would let them use it long enough to just pick up and drop off passengers. I don't know what harm that would do once in a while. How can they allow one commercial vessel and not another?

The Mount Washington Dock in Alton Bay is owned by the Winnipesaukee Flagship Corporation and is therefore private property. The property is assessed at $301,200 which is up from last year at $287,600.

The Town of Alton is not playing favorites. The Dive simply did not get the required permit.

Perhaps the Dive could have also reached out to W.F.Corp and got permission to use the Mount's dock.

Dave.

[fatlazyless]

Say hey ...... here is a totally, totally, totally, totally, totally super-duper idea for The Dive ...... go get that Keno 603 action going on-board The Dive.

Is possible The Dive and Keno 603 could be a good fit ....... something to do while waiting for your adult beverage ..... plus, probably the state gives you a free Keno promo sign which can go on the side of their barge.

Play Keno here ....... and win big! ...... Keno-garten!

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by joey2665

"taxpayer" is a broad term in this regulation. It does not specify residential or commercial so I agree that The Dive is a taxpayer.

I did not see anywhere on FB were they posted a video of the activity on the cruise last night. Just wondering again with it being during the week, inclement weather and not in season how well it was attended.

And just what taxes would the Dive be paying to Alton?

[Barney Bear]

The Dive will be featured on NH Chronicle at 7:00 PM tonight on Channel 9. 🖥

[tis]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

You really don't think the town of Alton would let them use it long enough to just pick up and drop off passengers. I don't know what harm that would do once in a while. How can they allow one commercial vessel and not another?

The Mount Washington Dock in Alton Bay is owned by the Winnipesaukee Flagship Corporation and is therefore private property. The property is assessed at $301,200 which is up from last year at $287,600.

The Town of Alton is not playing favorites. The Dive simply did not get the required permit.

Perhaps the Dive could have also reached out to W.F.Corp and got permission to use the Mount's dock.

Dave.

I did not know that Dave. Thanks for the info. The town docks in Wolfeboro are owned by the town. I don't think the commercial vessels pay a fee to the town to use the docks but I could be wrong. I do know they need permission.

[The Real BigGuy]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

While you could probably argue that they are a taxpayer, it does not appear that they applied for the permit that is also required.

Why do people assume they are an Alton “taxpayer”. As a floating business that apparently doesn’t own dock space anywhere doesn’t it then become a question of where the business is domiciled?


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[joey2665]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

And just what taxes would the Dive be paying to Alton?

Making the assumption for this conversation that their business is located in the Town of Alton since they are currently docked in Alton. Also what if the owners reside in Alton? Nevertheless as worded "taxpayer is a broad term"

[webmaster]

https://www.wmur.com/article/thursda...46520/23610324

[Woody38]

Just saw the Chronicle piece. The Dive looks great, hope they do well in the future.
We stopped at Shibley's this summer, can't say we will return. The place was filthy, service terrible and our food didn't look anything like that shown in the video. Actually it was not appetizing and the taste was no better. Assuming they did a bang up job for the Chronicle.

-------------------------------------------------

I am a retired workaholic and continuing aquaholic

[fatlazyless]

If only The Dive had a home ..... a real home ...... someplace it would always be ..... when not out cruising the lake ....... someplace where people could drive past, and think to themselves, there's The Dive..... if only The Dive had a home ..... attached to the land by a walking dock ..... close to parking ..... someplace seen by cars from the nearby road ..... if only The Dive had a home!


Where-o-where could that be?


Seems like the Center Harbor Inn may be just the spot?


Would The Dive business help the Center Harbor Inn business? Is not unknown for a waterfront inn to have an attached restaurant/bar biz.


That location would probably, definitely help The Dive business. For one thing, the white barge vessel that is The Dive can be seen from Rt-25 while driving a car, down the end of the long dock at Center Harbor Inn. It could put the lake to work for both the Inn and The Dive.


....don't-ya-just-a-know ..... that un-drivered, 100-yard, pickup truck, backwards downhill roll-a-way that just happened on Wednesday was really a message from God to indicate .... the Center Harbor Inn is the spot for The Dive ....... shaaaaaa-zzzaaaammmmm and bottoms up!!!

[Barney Bear]

The Dive is way too large to be located in Center Harbor!!!

[jbolty]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

If only The Dive had a home ..... a real home ...... someplace it would always be ..... when not out cruising the lake ....... someplace where people could drive past, and think to themselves, there's The Dive..... if only The Dive had a home ..... attached to the land by a walking dock ..... close to parking ..... someplace seen by cars from the nearby road ..... if only The Dive had a home!


Where-o-where could that be?


Seems like the Center Harbor Inn may be just the spot?


Would The Dive business help the Center Harbor Inn business? Is not unknown for a waterfront inn to have an attached restaurant/bar biz.


That location would probably, definitely help The Dive business. For one thing, the white barge vessel that is The Dive can be seen from Rt-25 while driving a car, down the end of the long dock at Center Harbor Inn. It could put the lake to work for both the Inn and The Dive.


....don't-ya-just-a-know ..... that un-drivered, 100-yard, pickup truck, backwards downhill roll-a-way that just happened on Wednesday was really a message from God to indicate .... the Center Harbor Inn is the spot for The Dive ....... shaaaaaa-zzzaaaammmmm and bottoms up!!!

Originally Posted by Barney Bear

The Dive is way too large to be located in Center Harbor!!!

not a bad idea. There isn't really any bar & grill competitor in town to complain and there's plenty of room.

[Water Camper]

Originally Posted by Woody38

Just saw the Chronicle piece. The Dive looks great, hope they do well in the future.
We stopped at Shibley's this summer, can't say we will return. The place was filthy, service terrible and our food didn't look anything like that shown in the video. Actually it was not appetizing and the taste was no better. Assuming they did a bang up job for the Chronicle.

-------------------------------------------------

I am a retired workaholic and continuing aquaholic

Have been to Shibley's several times this summer. Found the experience enjoyable, food was good and view from the deck was excellent.

My 2 cents,
Bill

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Woody38

Just saw the Chronicle piece. The Dive looks great, hope they do well in the future.
We stopped at Shibley's this summer, can't say we will return. The place was filthy, service terrible and our food didn't look anything like that shown in the video. Actually it was not appetizing and the taste was no better. Assuming they did a bang up job for the Chronicle.

-------------------------------------------------

I am a retired workaholic and continuing aquaholic

Went there twice this summer and both experiences were very good. The service was a little slow but after chatting with the hostess, they have had the same experience as most restaurants in the area, lack of available help. I cannot blame a restaurant for slow service when they cannot find enough staff to hire.

[fatlazyless]

Most likely, the Town of Center Harbor's Board of Selectmen as well as the nearby waterfront neighbors would probably, like most likely ...... be very much against The Dive's permanently doing business down the end of that long dock at the Center Harbor Inn.

Is just too too bad for The Dive, when no one wants you, and you is a business like that without a real home, stuck away on an uninhabited stretch of sandbar, at the entrance to the WAM inlet .... everyone is just cry'n in their beer?

Oh well ..... life must be very tough ..... when you ain't got no home .... and nobody wants you around ..... so's everyone ...... puh-lease go visit The Dive and at least have a freebie glass of courtesy water along with some freebie bar pretzels ..... just to cheer them up!

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Taz

My original suspicions have now been confirmed. A Facebook post from the Dive Facebook page posted on I Boat on Lake Winnipesaukee (IBOLW) confirmed that Dive owners have told WAM members that the Dive is so underpowered it will take 3 hrs to get to any other sandbar and it was not suppose to be kept at WAM. Not sure where else it would be kept. Because of this it will not be moving from Smalls anytime soon. I also agree with Phantom. I do not see the Dive surviving. Unless they can do enough charters, private functions to supplement the sandbar days and that is if they can repower it as it can not get out of its own way now. Season is too short. I don't think there will be enough customers to brave the cold water to walk to the Dive early and late season. That leaves July and August and maybe a weekend or 2 in September but even then many people stop coming to the lake after Labor Day. There has also been a lot of banter on IBOLW regarding the marine patrol ticketing many patrons because of there being more boats at Smalls so boats are anchored too close to shore in a NRZ, too many boats tied together etc. Home owners have been calling marine patrol to complain and marine patrol has responded with much more ticketing at Smalls than ever before. I did give it a try myself. The server Naomi was very good, the staff very attentive. However, the drinks were average in quality, size and above average in price. The food no better than any other establishment at any of the town docks. I agree with others its a "novelty" and I would not go back when I have my own boat, can serve my own cold beer and cocktails on my own boat, serve my own BBQ food on my own boat for much less money and go somewhere much quieter to do it. I wish them well and hope I am wrong but at this time they have a lot issues to resolve to make it work.

I failed to recall what power unit they had, but a work barge came by with a big bow wave.

"The Dive" should look into this one!

[fatlazyless]

With so many guests on-board, why not just ask for volunteers to paddle using long sup style paddles ...... like .....helloooooo everybody ...... we can use a little help here getting our barge from our West Alton home all the way down to that Center Harbor Inn ...... paddl'n is so much great exercise .... a real workout ..... look'n for volunteers here ...... we can use a little help ......who wants to just give paddl'n a wee bit of a go? ..... don't-a be a-bashful ..... paddl'n is so much fun ..... the crew that paddles together ..... drinks together

With so many guests on-board ..... is a great source of free paddl'n labor ....... stroke-stroke-stroke!


Will paddle for beer .....anyone?


In 2009, the MS Mount Washington was able to re-power their 1940's diesel that went wush-wush-wush with a $750,000 Caterpillar diesel that goes bzzzzzzz ...... and got it basically for free courtesy of the Cash for Clunkers federal program ....... so's maybe The Dive can do the same ..... and get a John Deere, made in Moline, Illinois, make america great again, marine diesel courtesy the federal government ....... yes? ...... for almost free?

In the mean time ...... a-just a-keep on paddl'n ....... to the tune of Michael row the boat ashore ...... hallelujuh ...... Sister, help to trim the sails ..... hallelujuh ..... we need more paddlers ... so much fun ..... who wants to paddle? ...... The Dive .... one, great big stand up paddle board, 62' x 24' ..... all together now .....just paddle! ...... how much further till we get there?

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

With so many guests on-board, why not just ask for volunteers to paddle using long sup style paddles ...... like .....helloooooo everybody ...... we can use a little help here getting our barge from our West Alton home all the way down to that Center Harbor Inn ...... paddl'n is so much great exercise .... a real workout ..... look'n for volunteers here ...... we can use a little help ......who wants to just give paddl'n a wee bit of a go? ..... don't-a be a-bashful ..... paddl'n is so much fun ..... the crew that paddles together ..... drinks together

With so many guests on-board ..... is a great source of free paddl'n labor ....... stroke-stroke-stroke!


Will paddle for beer .....anyone?


In 2009, the MS Mount Washington was able to re-power their 1940's diesel that went wush-wush-wush with a $750,000 Caterpillar diesel that goes bzzzzzzz ...... and got it basically for free courtesy of the Cash for Clunkers federal program ....... so's maybe The Dive can do the same ..... and get a John Deere, made in Moline, Illinois, make america great again, marine diesel courtesy the federal government ....... yes? ...... for almost free?

In the mean time ...... a-just a-keep on paddl'n ....... to the tune of Michael row the boat ashore ...... hallelujuh ...... Sister, help to trim the sails ..... hallelujuh ..... we need more paddlers ... so much fun ..... who wants to paddle? ...... The Dive .... one, great big stand up paddle board, 62' x 24' ..... all together now .....just paddle! ...... how much further till we get there?

You are a navel engineering genius.

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by Rusty

You are a navel engineering genius.

.....you are so totally, totally, totally correct ...... absolutely, positively, absolutely!

And, besides getting about ten long handled paddles for any guests who want to volunteer to paddle ...... The Dive could go purchase an el cheapo ..... mast, boom and sail .... from craigslist-nh ..... size: extra large ..... and put that wind to work for them ..... after all .....the wind is free ........ SAIL HO...... arrgghh! ..... sailing three sheets to the windward seems like a good course for The Dive!

Having a sail could be a good new energy source for moving their business along. Who knows ..... maybe a bright red sail would really look good, sailing down the lake, as the sun sinks slowly into the west ...... ker-plunk ..... splash ..... seems to happen every day?

The Dive, needing more powerful engines than what it had, decided to add a large mast, boom and sail in an effort to capture the wind. Little did they know that raising a large, bright red, triangular sail, high above their barge would serve like a big, red advertising banner, and go a long way for powering up their business ....... SALES HO .....oops .... make that SAILS HO .....and off they sailed, up and down the big lake, happily powered by a big, bright red sail .....

THE DIVE; not just a $12-beer on a barge-restaurant ....... it's a power-paddle-sail adventure ..... to get it there ......and back ...... yo-heave-ho .... now, shut up and paddle!

[ursa minor]

This isn't a situation where the Dive is "underpowered" so much as how the power gets to the water and some basic principles of naval architecture. Also, note that even with double the power (it has 2, 300 HP Evinrude outboards now) it really wouldn't make a huge difference in speed.

As a displacement vessel, the length of the waterline dictates what the maximum practical speed will be, increasing the power above whatever is calculated to be required to produce "hull speed" will only increase the top speed a small amount even with a significant increase in power.

As has been noted in an earlier post, Diversified Contracting has a similar sized barge with twin 250 HP outboards. I've watched it go by our place many times, the operator runs those engines HARD and even with that I'd guess top speed is between 10 - 12 mph. It sounds to my ear as if the propellers cavitate a fair amount while doing so. Using Diversified's barge as an example, it looks like the Dive is similar in length and has roughly the same power so top speed would be in the same general range of 10-12 mph.

If they're not getting to 10 mph or so, I'm guessing part of the problem could be getting the propellers to convert the power available into actual thrust. The barge that APS referenced looks like it's powered by a pusher tug. If so, that likely has a diesel engine turning a much larger diameter and slower turning propeller that can get a better bite on the water to push the barge. Tough do that with engines designed for pleasure boats that turn small diameter propellers at high speed.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

THE DIVE; not just a $12-beer on a barge-restaurant ....... it's a power-paddle-sail adventure ..... to get it there ......and back ...... yo-heave-ho .... now, shut up and paddle!

Would it be similar to these guys rowing?

Something went wrong with this video so I deleted the embed code.

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by Rusty

Would it be similar to these guys rowing?

….yes, something like that ….. men, woman, kids, grandma, grandpa, all together rowing The Dive …… rowing is actually fun, fun, fun ….. especially when there's a Guinness a-waiting for you, up-top

….. beats the heck out of just sitting there, sipping a beer, and watching the shoreline homes unroll


….. all together now ….. let's all row in three part harmony …. and longer oars that are pinned are actually easier to row with better results …. no feathering needed! So, it is stroke-stroke-stroke-stroke-stroke as opposed to stroke-feather-stroke-feather-stroke-feather-stroke-feather...… capiche!


….those slaves in the video here ….. are they feathering? …. no …. and, it's working very very well for them! Is hard to tell, but most likely their oars have been pinned, or held by a pin in the oar lock, in one position for easier rowing. So, who wants to row hard for 40-minutes for a Guinness?
…….

So, what's the real price tag for the two Evinrude 300-hp outboards like they have ….. as opposed to finding a decent used marine diesel that turns a longer, wider propeller at a slower speed with a better bite?

Is the real price tag …… their going out of business and closing The Dive ….. stay tuned ….. is a lot easier to paddle a paddle?

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Rusty

Would it be similar to these guys rowing?

Please don't feed the duck.

[JADAQ]

Originally Posted by ursa minor

This isn't a situation where the Dive is "underpowered" so much as how the power gets to the water and some basic principles of naval architecture. Also, note that even with double the power (it has 2, 300 HP Evinrude outboards now) it really wouldn't make a huge difference in speed.

As a displacement vessel, the length of the waterline dictates what the maximum practical speed will be, increasing the power above whatever is calculated to be required to produce "hull speed" will only increase the top speed a small amount even with a significant increase in power.

As has been noted in an earlier post, Diversified Contracting has a similar sized barge with twin 250 HP outboards. I've watched it go by our place many times, the operator runs those engines HARD and even with that I'd guess top speed is between 10 - 12 mph. It sounds to my ear as if the propellers cavitate a fair amount while doing so. Using Diversified's barge as an example, it looks like the Dive is similar in length and has roughly the same power so top speed would be in the same general range of 10-12 mph.

If they're not getting to 10 mph or so, I'm guessing part of the problem could be getting the propellers to convert the power available into actual thrust. The barge that APS referenced looks like it's powered by a pusher tug. If so, that likely has a diesel engine turning a much larger diameter and slower turning propeller that can get a better bite on the water to push the barge. Tough do that with engines designed for pleasure boats that turn small diameter propellers at high speed.

I believe they are twin “250” Evinrudes

[ursa minor]

Originally Posted by JADAQ

I believe they are twin “250” Evinrudes

My bad, I just went back to page 1, you are correct. Twin 250's as seen in the pictures. The point of my long winded post above is still the same though; whether 500 HP (as is), 600 HP(as I mistakenly mentioned above) or even adding a third engine to get up to some greater multiple of the above will not significantly increase the maximum speed of this vessel above it's hull speed.

Assuming a water line length of 70 feet (guestimate from looking at the construction photos) hull speed would calculate to 11.2 MPH (square root of the length at waterline X 1.34) Does anyone know if they tapered the front in any way as opposed to a square / flat entry (like the sides and stern), that would be a problem. I haven't seen it up close enough to be able to see that, most barges have a slope at the bow.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

….yes, something like that ….. men, woman, kids, grandma, grandpa, all together rowing The Dive …… rowing is actually fun, fun, fun ….. especially when there's a Guinness a-waiting for you, up-top

….. beats the heck out of just sitting there, sipping a beer, and watching the shoreline homes unroll


….. all together now ….. let's all row in three part harmony …. and longer oars that are pinned are actually easier to row with better results …. no feathering needed! So, it is stroke-stroke-stroke-stroke-stroke as opposed to stroke-feather-stroke-feather-stroke-feather-stroke-feather...… capiche!


….those slaves in the video here ….. are they feathering? …. no …. and, it's working very very well for them! Is hard to tell, but most likely their oars have been pinned, or held by a pin in the oar lock, in one position for easier rowing. So, who wants to row hard for 40-minutes for a Guinness?
…….

So, what's the real price tag for the two Evinrude 300-hp outboards like they have ….. as opposed to finding a decent used marine diesel that turns a longer, wider propeller at a slower speed with a better bite?

Is the real price tag …… their going out of business and closing The Dive ….. stay tuned ….. is a lot easier to paddle a paddle?

You must have graduated 1st in your class at navel engineering school. Row 40 minutes for a Guinness..you are a genius.

[pault842]

Sounds like it might be a cavitation problem. Might need to reprop and/or change the way the engines are mounted.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...18bedba9f.html

[ursa minor]

Originally Posted by pault842

Sounds like it might be a cavitation problem. Might need to reprop and/or change the way the engines are mounted.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...18bedba9f.html

That’s a timely article. It sure sounds like cavitation is a major issue in reading that. Their idea of getting custom propellers made may be the way to go, I believe the propellers for the G2 Evinrudes are specific to those engines, not a lot of aftermarket options.

[fatlazyless]

..... oh yeah Biggd ...... with that new propeller that's just right for powering up The Dive ....... that there barge there ..... will be gett'n up on plane just so fast ..... it will be able to pull two water skiers right off from sitt'n on that Flightcraft dock without them gett'n their knees wet ..... new propellers is all it needs to make everything go good!

..... 2019 will be the year for The Dive!


....you gotta admit ...... putt'n a huge red sail, mast and boom on the barge could make it a way cool sailboat.
……………..

Will be interesting to see what some different propellers do for moving The Dive around the lake, and if two-strokers have enough torque to make it work out good?

You know the US Coast Guard seems to have settled with using the 250-hp Honda, two or more per boat, for powering up their 35' something patrol boats. After trying all the different outboards, the Coasties go with Honda because they just need an engine that works good.

Seems like a Honda 4-stroker would have more torque with its' intake-compression-combustion-exhaust 4-cycles than an Evinrude 2-stroker with it's abbreviated, higher rpm, intake & compression - combustion & exhaust, 2-cycles?

Like, who knows ……. but maybe just maybe, Honda actually makes a 250 designed with an extra heavy gear case, a slower engine speed, and a larger propeller that is designed for pushing those slower, heavy, high water resistance loads ….. and it's named the Honda 250-b, with the b an abbreviation for barge …… like, who knows?

[JADAQ]

Today’s Laconia Sun has a good write up about the Dive, it also goes into more detail about the engine troubles they encountered on the high seas of Lake Winnipesaukee!

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...18bedba9f.html

[Woodsy]

Most likely they will have to replace the lower "foot" of the outboards... that will allow them to essentially regear the motors and allow them to swing a much larger diameter propeller slowly... giving them more control and better thrust.

the little 14" diameter props on those outboards will def not cut it...


Woodsy

[winni83]

I thought that their engine problem was "solved".

From their FB page on August 18th.

"The Dive
August 18 ·
We ARE coming out to Smalls Cove!!!! Save us "our" spot please! Engine problem solved 🤞 see y'all soon! "

[8gv]

As an alternative approach to the water pick up issue, could forward facing scoops be afixed over the standard inlets?

[Greene's Basin Girl]

Originally Posted by 8gv

As an alternative approach to the water pick up issue, could forward facing scoops be afixed over the standard inlets?

Why not have a jet ski that can bring customers to the boat?

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Greene's Basin Girl

Why not have a jet ski that can bring customers to the boat?

He is talking about cooling water to the motors. You seem to be talking about getting patrons to the boat. An entirely different issue.

[fatlazyless]

So's, how come semi-tractors pulling a 53' van trailer with a gross vehicle weight of up to 40-tons always have a diesel 4-stroke engine as opposed to a gasoline 2-stroke engine?

Like, what the h was they thinking when they went and got two Evinrude 2-strokes, which are actually very, very expensive ...... but just no good for pushing along a huge, heavy barge like The Dive?