Boating Accident/Death off Diamond Island

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Beggaman Thief

The more I study the photo, the more it looks like speed wasn’t a factor as evident by the trim tabs and the out-drives being in the down position. And, the way the front is damaged, it appears the boat never went up and over the object….. Wolfeboro Baja, I also echo your sentiments. My thoughts and prayers go out to everyone that is touched by this tragedy.

If she was exceeding 6 MPH/no wake, speed was a factor. It's obvious the boat was closer to Diamond Island than 150'.

[robmac]

this is a very tragic story and reality for all involved.My prayers go out to all of the families involved and think making judgements of what and how should be done by professionals who have more info than has been released

[SIKSUKR]

This has hit real close to home for me.I know Erica and Steph real well.Stephanie was the sweetest girl.Please stop this crazy taking sides before any infomation has been released.What is wrong with members like FLL and Turtle Boy jumping on the speed limit bandwagon without one shred of info.The only thing we know is that the weather was not good.Shame on you people!

[Bear Islander]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

This has hit real close to home for me.I know Erica and Steph real well.Stephanie was the sweetest girl.Please stop this crazy taking sides before any infomation has been released.What is wrong with members like FLL and Turtle Boy jumping on the speed limit bandwagon without one shred of info.The only thing we know is that the weather was not good.Shame on you people!

I agree with you.

And speculating the speed was under the limit is no different from speculating it was over. Plus it will only lead to more speculation or counter theories.

[Weirs guy]

Good to see everyones getting along the same while I'm gone. One person has died and 2 have to live with that and their injures forever and we're all worried about how fast they were going.

My condolences to all those effected.

[sa meredith]

Because she was such an experienced boater, and would know the lake like the back of her hand, I would think people should lean more toward speculation of mechanical failure, or something of this nature. But, really, I agree...NONE OF THAT MATTERS NOW.
Maybe later, but now the only thing people should be concerned with is passing along thoughts of condolence to the families involved.

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by Dave R

If she was exceeding 6 MPH/no wake, speed was a factor. It's obvious the boat was closer to Diamond Island than 150'.

Dave nailed it here, 6 MPH was the limit.

It is a shame that this tragedy occurred- my prayers are with all of the familes involved.

[Cal]

Originally Posted by VitaBene

Dave nailed it here, 6 MPH was the limit.

It is a shame that this tragedy occurred- my prayers are with all of the familes involved.

You and Dave R should both use your heads with this 150' 6mph thing.
What would you bet SHE DIDN'T REALIZE THE ISLAND WAS THERE?
That doesn't take rocket science to figure out.


My condolences to all involved.

[sa meredith]

Originally Posted by Cal

You and Dave R should both use your heads with this 150' 6mph thing.
What would you bet SHE DIDN'T REALIZE THE ISLAND WAS THERE?
That doesn't take rocket science to figure out.


My condolences to all involved.

Cal...of course she didn't realize it was there!!!! To believe she did would mean she intentionally killed someone. And the time for all this is certainly not now. But, as has been discusssed on this forum countless times after boating mishaps...the captain is responsible for EVERYTHING AND ANYTHING!
First and foremost the safety of all passengers. It was her responsibility/job/obligation to know exactly where she was. The only way this comes out OK is if they find severe mechanical failure. see my earlier post

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Cal

You and Dave R should both use your heads with this 150' 6mph thing.
What would you bet SHE DIDN'T REALIZE THE ISLAND WAS THERE?
That doesn't take rocket science to figure out.


My condolences to all involved.

Obviously. Please use your own head and read between the lines.

[flyry49]

Originally Posted by Dave R

If she was exceeding 6 MPH/no wake, speed was a factor. It's obvious the boat was closer to Diamond Island than 150'.

" Well maybe if she saw the no wake sign or "the island" she would have slown down", and by the way the headway speed law is 300 feet from shore not 150. nice try tho

[NightWing]

Originally Posted by flyry49

" Well maybe if she saw the no wake sign or "the island" she would have slown down", and by the way the headway speed law is 300 feet from shore not 150. nice try tho

300' only if you are on a 2 person ski craft.

[Skip]

According to this article in today's on-line edition of the Union Leader, Blizzard's condition has been upgraded. Additionally, the Marine Patrol continues to investigate a number of possibilities surrounding the collision.

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by Skip

According to this article in today's on-line edition of the Union Leader, Blizzard's condition has been upgraded. Additionally, the Marine Patrol continues to investigate a number of possibilities surrounding the collision.

Great news Skip, thanks for the update.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by flyry49

" Well maybe if she saw the no wake sign or "the island" she would have slown down", and by the way the headway speed law is 300 feet from shore not 150. nice try tho

Wow, great post. Some corrections are needed though...

There are no "no wake" signs near Diamond Island. The closest is at Smith's Point, more than a mile away and not at all relevant,

"Slown"? Not a word I'm familiar with.

Excerpts from NH law:

270-D:1 Definitions

VI. "Headway speed'' means 6 miles per hour or the slowest speed that a boat can be operated and maintain steerage way.


270-D:2 General Rules for Vessels Operating on Water

VI. (a) To provide full visibility and control and to prevent their wake from being thrown into or causing excessive rocking to other boats, barges, water skiers, aquaplanes or other boats, rafts or floats, all vessels shall maintain headway speed when within 150 feet from:
(1) Rafts, floats, swimmers.
(2) Permitted swimming areas.
(3) Shore.
(4) Docks.
(5) Mooring fields.
(6) Other vessels.

There are circumstances where this particular law does not apply, but not being able to see an island at night is not one of them.

Simply put: If this one simple law had been obeyed, this accident (and nearly every other tragic accident on the lake, including the one that killed Mr. Hartman) would not have happened.

[HUH]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Wow, great post. Some corrections are needed though...

There are no "no wake" signs near Diamond Island. The closest is at Smith's Point, more than a mile away and not at all relevant,

"Slown"? Not a word I'm familiar with.

Excerpts from NH law:

270-D:1 Definitions

VI. "Headway speed'' means 6 miles per hour or the slowest speed that a boat can be operated and maintain steerage way.


270-D:2 General Rules for Vessels Operating on Water

VI. (a) To provide full visibility and control and to prevent their wake from being thrown into or causing excessive rocking to other boats, barges, water skiers, aquaplanes or other boats, rafts or floats, all vessels shall maintain headway speed when within 150 feet from:
(1) Rafts, floats, swimmers.
(2) Permitted swimming areas.
(3) Shore.
(4) Docks.
(5) Mooring fields.
(6) Other vessels.

There are circumstances where this particular law does not apply, but not being able to see an island at night is not one of them.

Simply put: If this one simple law had been obeyed, this accident (and nearly every other tragic accident on the lake, including the one that killed Mr. Hartman) would not have happened.

An accident is pelotudo called Peteneitor a specific, identifiable, unexpected, unusual and unintended external event which occurs in a particular time and place, without apparent or deliberate cause but with marked effects. It implies a generally negative probabilistic outcome which may have been avoided or prevented had circumstances leading up to the accident been recognized, and acted upon, prior to its occurrence.
No law can prevent an accident!
You and others that continualy talk about this long list of tragic accidents ?
Please list them off for us. I know of the Hartman case (27 mph I believe and the driver was convicted of BUI and served time)
And this one which is still under investigation and looks to clearly be a tragic accident and nothing more !
This perponderence of tragic accidents thats continualy repeated is pure sensationalism and un called for at this time !

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by HUH

You and others that continualy talk about this long list of tragic accidents ?
Please list them off for us. I know of the Hartman case (27 mph I believe and the driver was convicted of BUI and served time)
And this one which is still under investigation and looks to clearly be a tragic accident and nothing more !
This perponderence of tragic accidents thats continualy repeated is pure sensationalism and un called for at this time !

I have never mentioned any "long list of tragic accidents". I do know there has been more than the two you mention though. There are many dumb and shockingly benign accidents in the lake's past that would have been avoided by simply following the 150' law too. That's not sensational, it's simply common sense.

[HUH]

Originally Posted by Dave R

I have never mentioned any "long list of tragic accidents". I do know there has been more than the two you mention though. There are many dumb and shockingly benign accidents in the lake's past that would have been avoided by simply following the 150' law too. That's not sensational, it's simply common sense.

Sorry, I did misread your post and thought it read that a speed limit would have eliminated this accident. I see that you were referring to the 150 rule and agree 100%. First thing that popped into my mind when I read about the accident was that they were off course.

[RI Swamp Yankee]

With all the comments about "safe speed" I came accross this on boat-ed.com which sounds almost exactly like what I learned in a USCG boating course I took many years ago.

Safe Speed

A safe speed is a speed less than the maximum at which the operator can take proper and effective action to avoid collision and stop within a distance appropriate to the prevailing circumstances and conditions.

In establishing a safe operating speed, the operator must take into account visibility; traffic density; ability to maneuver the vessel (stopping distance and turning ability); background light at night; proximity of navigational hazards; draft of the vessel; limitations of radar equipment; and the state of wind, sea, and current.

[AC2717]

I noticed there were no bow numbers on the hull, unless it was white or bright letters below the rubrail. If that was a dealer HIN, meaing the plaquard that is put in the windshielf when you go test drive a boat by the dealer, Lakeport could be in serious trouble and that is not a good thing for marina. Let's hope this is not taken into conderation.

Sorry to bring this up but there are these type of people out there, not saying the familys of who got hurt are. DO NOT TAKE THIS IN ANY OTHER WAY BUT AS A MERE POINTING OUT WHAT I SAW IN THE PHOTO

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by AC2717

I noticed there were no bow numbers on the hull, unless it was white or bright letters below the rubrail.

DO NOT TAKE THIS IN ANY OTHER WAY BUT AS A MERE POINTING OUT WHAT I SAW IN THE PHOTO

You didn't see the numbers because - THERE WAS NO BOW REMAINING!!!

I continue to read these posts - many while shaking my head, some get my attention enough to call someone else over to read the post to make sure I am not misreading or misunderstanding.....SURELY you are kidding about the bow numbers?????

Unbelievable!!

[secondcurve]

The facts surrounding this tragedy will come with time. However, the accident serves as an unfortunate reminder that we all should have adequate insurance on our boats and also anyone with significant assets should have an umbrella policy. If a lady with as much boating experience as Ms. Blizzard can get into this type of accident it can happen to most anyone.

[AMekler]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

You didn't see the numbers because - THERE WAS NO BOW REMAINING!!!

I continue to read these posts - many while shaking my head, some get my attention enough to call someone else over to read the post to make sure I am not misreading or misunderstanding.....SURELY you are kidding about the bow numbers?????

Unbelievable!!

there were no bow numbers on the boat. there was a dealer plate on the boat.
AMekler

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by AMekler

there were no bow numbers on the boat. there was a dealer plate on the boat.
AMekler

I dont recall reading anything about this being a dealer boat from Channel.

Not that it matters - if she had the dealer plate - there is still no issue. My point was - post on not seeing bow numbers was pretty obvious considering there was no bow left.

[AMekler]

I was on the island after the event sunday morning and noticed a dealer plate near the passenger side windshield. I'll check my pictures.
AMekler

[AMekler]

see the photo attachement

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by AMekler

see the photo attachement

The picture depicts just in front of the windshield area, not the front/side of the bow where a number would be found. ???

If there was a dealer plate it would most likely be placed on the dash however could be tossed anywhere with that hit.

[pmj]

No that it matters, but boats do not need to show bow/registration numbers if they have USCG documentation. That said, most lake boats probably do not apply for documentation but you never know


it's a totally moot point.

[wildwoodfam]

Gotta love digital cameras and the ability to enlarge the photo, I can now see the dealer plate on the boat!

And my apologies - I said Channel and of course new it was Lakeport. That's what happens when you are on the other side of the lake, everything beyond the Weirs blurs together!

Still a very sad story unfolding here...

[UncleRay]

Originally Posted by NHDOLFAN

Wow. This article shows that someone was drinking. Now, whether the person(s) were impaired is a different story. At what speed would a boat need to be traveling to be on plane? I'm sure that Formula could answer this question. Only time will tell but it does not look good.

According to the tests on this hull, it looks to plane off at about 19/20 mph.

http://www.boattest.com/oem/general-...381#TestResult



If you care to run the math, this will get you close:

Minimum Planing Speed in Knots:

2.3 x ((32.2 x (all up displacement in pounds)^0.333)^0.5)/1.6889

For example, an 18' boat at 2,323.2 pounds (including crew) may plane at 13.902 knots.

The formula has no input for the shape of the hull. It just calculates the speed required to lift 2300 pounds. It also does not indicate how difficult it will be to get the hull to 13.9 knots. However, in my ignorance, I believe it may be somewhat representative. If the boat was surfing down a wave at 13.9 knots, it may very well be planing.

[2Blackdogs]

Looks like Uncle Ray got "called in".

A rule of thumb is that the larger the city, hospital, emergency room, fire department or police force, the more sophisticated the attention to official inquiry. Europe, I'm reading today, has the technology to find fingerprints on anything made of metal, even if it's old or submerged. European laboratories are far better funded than US laboratories.

When an agency has only a handful of annual investigations like this one (or even fewer), it's not going to be sophisticated at all. Worse, the investigation in a tourist-dependent state is subject to fierce political and economic community pressures.

Perhaps "the showing to the door" of Safety Director Dick Flynn will change that impression, but funding to the NHMP is already such a rarity that the radar guns, the radar survey, and officer's radar training were grieved as major expenses. Or so we were told here. The survey itself was widely criticized as unscientific, and suggested a political pressure at work to make the findings "turn out right".

The presence of alcohol evidence has turned this discussion to the real intent of the NHRBA, and that is to perpetuate a party-hardy atmosphere for Winni's cowboys. We haven't heard from the primary proponent of A.I.S. lately, especially with today's potentially embarrassing link to the NHRBA. It's too late to impeach the president of NHRBA now, but it could happen.

I hope you're wrong about the driver behind the wheel. That driver might be the one who cannot speak in defense.

[chipj29]

Originally Posted by 2Blackdogs

...
The presence of alcohol evidence has turned this discussion to the real intent of the NHRBA, and that is to perpetuate a party-hardy atmosphere for Winni's cowboys. We haven't heard from the primary proponent of A.I.S. lately, especially with today's potentially embarrassing link to the NHRBA. It's too late to impeach the president of NHRBA now, but it could happen.

I hope you're wrong about the driver behind the wheel. That driver might be the one who cannot speak in defense.

Here you go again...yet one more COMPLETELY uncalled for post.

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Another story:

Jun 24, 10:48 AM EDT
Alcohol may have been involved in NH boat crash

GILFORD, N.H. (AP) -- Investigators are looking into possible criminal charges in a fatal boating accident on New Hampshire's Lake Winnipesaukee last week.

In court documents, the Marine Patrol said it is investigating whether the death of 34-year-old Stephanie Beaudoin, of Meredith, was a negligent homicide.

Court affidavits say a surviving passenger, 34-year-old Nicole Shinopulos, of Burlington, Massachusetts, told investigators she and the two other women on the boat had been drinking before they crashed into Diamond Island around 2:30 a.m. on June 15.

The boat's driver, 34-year-old Erica Blizzard, of Laconia, suffered serious injuries. Blizzard is the president of the New Hampshire Recreational Boaters Association, which has opposed boating speed limits on the lake.

She is in stable condition at Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center in Lebanon.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...06-24-10-48-28
------------------

And, as I posted earlier, the boat was going too fast for the conditions.

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by RI Swamp Yankee

And, as I posted earlier, the boat was going too fast for the conditions.

Please don't take this the wrong way:

How fast were they going again? I don't recall reading what the investigators determined their speed to be?

As a general comment, enough with the speculation. We need to let the investigators sort this out before anybody jumps to conclusions.

[VtSteve]

Well Blackdogs, they are investigating anything and everything, as many assumed. Your constant insinuations, riddled with sarcasm and demeaning language, pretty much put you in the position of an agenda poster. Regardless of the outcome of this accident, most of us could pretty much predict what you'd write for each potential outcome.

One of the chief criticisms in the SL arguments is that many of us have read about numerous accident stories, seen the raw data, and tried to discuss solutions as we both participate in boating and care for ourselves and others. While others have distorted data, misinterpreted it, or even ignored it altogether.

In the end, all that counts is safety and reducing accidents. Something tells me that's not your number one goal here.

[Airwaves]

The AP article that RI Swamp Yankee quotes is based on this article in the Laconia Citizen.

The AP story is heavily editied and the Laconia Citizen article relies exclusively on court documents filed to get various search warrants needed for the investigation.

To restate my point the AP article was based on the Laconia Citizen Article. The Citizen article was based on the reading of court documents. I did not see anywhere in the article where anyone involved in the investigation or accident was actually interviewed for the story.

This comes back to the ongoing reduction in newspaper workforce and the regurgitation of a marginal story as fact by other news organizations and drawing conclusions from it. It's going to get worse friends.

[Skip]

Originally Posted by 2Blackdogs

...A rule of thumb is that the larger the city, hospital, emergency room, fire department or police force, the more sophisticated the attention to official inquiry...When an agency has only a handful of annual investigations like this one (or even fewer), it's not going to be sophisticated at all. Worse, the investigation in a tourist-dependent state is subject to fierce political and economic community pressures...

Normally I ignore deliberate attempts to troll, but I'll make an exception this time to reassure the readers that this invetigation is in safe & capable hands.

As has been noted by numerous public sources, the lead investigator is Lt. Tim Dunleavy of the NHMP. Dunleavy is a career full time law enforcement supervisor that is recognized by the New Hampshire Court system, Underwriters Labratory and the United States Coast Guard as an expert in boat accident reconstruction amongst a number of other qualifications & duties, and can and has succesfully testified to same.

He also has extensive experience in responiding to, investigating, and succesfully prosecuting numerous criminal violations of the State's boating regulations, including a fair share of the fatalities that have occured on our waters the last few decades.

Finally, numerous serious crimes occur throughout our State in various small locals on an annual basis. All Departments in this State utilize neighboring community experts, each County Attorney's Office, the State Attorney General's Office, the NH State Police, the State Police Crime Lab and a long list of private and federal agencies to assist in all levels of evidence gathering and criminal investigation and prosecution.

The root cause of this tragedy will be thoroughly investigated and the public will have timely and relevant material released at the appropriate juncture, just as today's new stories have proven.

While it takes only the ability to operate a keyboard to be a troll, rest assured that the folks in charge of this investigation are much more qualified than the naysayers at their respective craft.

Skip

[Waterbaby]

Originally Posted by 2Blackdogs

Looks like Uncle Ray got "called in".

A rule of thumb is that the larger the city, hospital, emergency room, fire department or police force, the more sophisticated the attention to official inquiry. Europe, I'm reading today, has the technology to find fingerprints on anything made of metal, even if it's old or submerged. European laboratories are far better funded than US laboratories.

When an agency has only a handful of annual investigations like this one (or even fewer), it's not going to be sophisticated at all. Worse, the investigation in a tourist-dependent state is subject to fierce political and economic community pressures.

Perhaps "the showing to the door" of Safety Director Dick Flynn will change that impression, but funding to the NHMP is already such a rarity that the radar guns, the radar survey, and officer's radar training were grieved as major expenses. Or so we were told here. The survey itself was widely criticized as unscientific, and suggested a political pressure at work to make the findings "turn out right".

The presence of alcohol evidence has turned this discussion to the real intent of the NHRBA, and that is to perpetuate a party-hardy atmosphere for Winni's cowboys. We haven't heard from the primary proponent of A.I.S. lately, especially with today's potentially embarrassing link to the NHRBA. It's too late to impeach the president of NHRBA now, but it could happen.

I hope you're wrong about the driver behind the wheel. That driver might be the one who cannot speak in defense.

No matter how many times I read this, I cannot make it relevant to this thread.....................please don't elaborate, I'm not sure it will help your cause.

[flyry49]

Originally Posted by UncleRay

According to the tests on this hull, it looks to plane off at about 19/20 mph.

http://www.boattest.com/oem/general-...381#TestResult



If you care to run the math, this will get you close:

Minimum Planing Speed in Knots:

2.3 x ((32.2 x (all up displacement in pounds)^0.333)^0.5)/1.6889

For example, an 18' boat at 2,323.2 pounds (including crew) may plane at 13.902 knots.

The formula has no input for the shape of the hull. It just calculates the speed required to lift 2300 pounds. It also does not indicate how difficult it will be to get the hull to 13.9 knots. However, in my ignorance, I believe it may be somewhat representative. If the boat was surfing down a wave at 13.9 knots, it may very well be planing.

i can tell you right now that this boat wont fully plane out till close to 30 mph but why don't we leave this investigation to the investigators? my thoughts and prayers are with the people involved

[hockeypuck]

Everyone is a critic and I have no clue what happen on that night in question, except that it was a tragedy to all involved.
Imagine this for one moment. Pick a large parking lot, like to a mall or something, one that you have been to 100's of times. Go there at 2:00 in the morning with heavy cloud cover, maybe throw in a downpour and no lights on in the parking lot. Now turn off your head lights and drive around at 25 miles an hour. Even though you are familiar with the location of light poles and the location of stores, chances are an accident is about to happen.
You could say poor judgement, but who among us has never been guilty of poor judgement. Could be a mechanical problem, an investigation may find that. Could be other factors involved. NO matter, it's still a tragedy. The best that can come out of this is that other boaters will take extra precautions so that it doesn't happen again.

[tony1122]

What about the gun that was found on the boat that night?
Who gun was it ?

[sa meredith]

Post number 1?????
Gun???????
Will it ever stop?
I am curious though..I thought the results were due? Anyone know the timetable.
I, for one, am quite familiar with a boater "losing their way."

[chipj29]

Originally Posted by sa meredith

Post number 1?????
Gun???????
Will it ever stop?
I am curious though..I thought the results were due? Anyone know the timetable.
I, for one, am quite familiar with a boater "losing their way."

Can't be anything but a troll...

[webmaster]

Originally Posted by chipj29

Can't be anything but a troll...

Could be. I'll give tony1122 the rest of the day to post where he got this information or some corroboration. If he doesn't his post will be removed.

Thanks to everyone who reported the post.

[tony1122]

a mp officer that was on the boat that night

[ishoot308]

Since when is it illegal to have a firearm on your boat????

Dan

[parrothead]

The gun is kinda irrelevant when there was no evidence that it was fired. If it existed at all.

[Mee-n-Mac]

Oh man what's next, are we going to hear how the CIA projected a false image of the island to cause the crash because one of the occupants learned the "truth" about WTC #7 ?

[Bear Islander]

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Since when is it illegal to have a firearm on your boat????

Dan

Dan

Depends on the type of firearm and if its loaded.



RSA 207:7

II. No person shall have or carry, in or on a motor vehicle, OHRV, or aircraft, whether moving or stationary, a cocked crossbow, a loaded rifle or loaded shotgun, or a rifle or shotgun with a cartridge in a magazine or clip attached to the gun.

III. No person shall have in or on a boat or other craft while being propelled by mechanical power, or in a boat or other craft being towed by a boat or other craft propelled by mechanical power, a cocked crossbow, a loaded rifle or loaded shotgun, or a rifle or shotgun with a cartridge in a magazine or clip attached to the gun.

You also can't hunt deer or bear on the islands.

[HUH]

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

Dan

Depends on the type of firearm and if its loaded.



RSA 207:7

II. No person shall have or carry, in or on a motor vehicle, OHRV, or aircraft, whether moving or stationary, a cocked crossbow, a loaded rifle or loaded shotgun, or a rifle or shotgun with a cartridge in a magazine or clip attached to the gun.

III. No person shall have in or on a boat or other craft while being propelled by mechanical power, or in a boat or other craft being towed by a boat or other craft propelled by mechanical power, a cocked crossbow, a loaded rifle or loaded shotgun, or a rifle or shotgun with a cartridge in a magazine or clip attached to the gun.

You also can't hunt deer or bear on the islands.

Says cocked or loaded.. With a licence to carry you can do both.. No there is no hunting on the islands.. at least until the poulation explodes and the herd is starving to death, do they call in the "enviromentalists".

[GWC...]

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

You also can't hunt deer or bear on the islands.

So, what is the name given to the occasional event that occurs on Long Island?

Originally Posted by F&G: Frequently Asked Questions - Hunting

What's up with the Long Island deer hunt?
An annual archery hunt takes place on Long Island in Moultonboro, N.H. It is open only to bow hunters who have obtained written landowner permission on a form that can be picked up at Fish and Game headquarters in Concord; or individuals can call the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 to request a form by mail. Attached to the forms are the pertinent rules and laws that govern this hunt. The hunt begins the first weekday in October and runs through December 15 except for certain weekends and holidays that are outlined in the rules. Once the landowner forms are completed, permits must be purchased at Fish and Game headquarters starting August 1.

http://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/Hunt...qs_hunting.htm

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

RSA 207:7

III. No person shall have in or on a boat or other craft while being propelled by mechanical power, or in a boat or other craft being towed by a boat or other craft propelled by mechanical power, a cocked crossbow, a loaded rifle or loaded shotgun, or a rifle or shotgun with a cartridge in a magazine or clip attached to the gun.

So you're saying the Zuni's mounted on deck are legal but the twin BMG50's that pop out the side ports are best kept hidden ....

[gtxrider]

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

Dan

Depends on the type of firearm and if its loaded.



RSA 207:7

II. No person shall have or carry, in or on a motor vehicle, OHRV, or aircraft, whether moving or stationary, a cocked crossbow, a loaded rifle or loaded shotgun, or a rifle or shotgun with a cartridge in a magazine or clip attached to the gun.

III. No person shall have in or on a boat or other craft while being propelled by mechanical power, or in a boat or other craft being towed by a boat or other craft propelled by mechanical power, a cocked crossbow, a loaded rifle or loaded shotgun, or a rifle or shotgun with a cartridge in a magazine or clip attached to the gun.

You also can't hunt deer or bear on the islands.

It does not mention if a hand gun is allowed.

[twoplustwo]

This tragedy isn't well served by your unique attempts at humor, FLL.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by twoplustwo

This tragedy isn't well served by your unique attempts at humor, FLL.

This tragedy does not deserve humor.

[Skip]

Three families have been utterly devastated by this crash.

The legal system is now going to determine ultimate responsibility.

My gosh, its the height of the Holiday season.

Could we please leave the sophmoric and insensitive attempts at humor out of the conversation?

[4Fun]

Were there any details of the BAC made public? I personally think there is a big difference in .08 vs .1 or .2somehting....

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Mee-n-Mac

"...I was thinking a...low powered forward looking radar (like those we are starting to see in cars).

BMW has that option: it flashes a dash light visible only to the driver—and vibrates the steering wheel.

Originally Posted by jeffk

"...This is all just speculation since we don't know many critical facts of the case nor what the strategy of the prosecution or defense will be..."

We seldom see terms such as the prosecution's theories of the case, nor The Citizen's use of the terms "alleged driver" and "alleged homicide".

In reading the media's tea-leaves, this may prove to be a difficult trial. I'm seeing the machinations of the defense already in this case: some might call it suborning of a witness.

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

"...What is the typical delay before public information is released...?"

Bad news for politicians are released on Fridays before a weekend: really bad news is released on a Friday before a holiday weekend.

What incentive would there be to delay this release until the week before the Christmas holiday? Would it be to minimize open discussions?

Originally Posted by Skip

"...The legal system is now going to determine ultimate responsibility..."

After appeals, "determining ultimate responsibility" shouldn't take long. As we have seen, jail time (if even warranted in this case) could be as long as four years away—right?

Originally Posted by jeffk

"...Not with boats, cars, jet skis, snowmobiles, motorcycles, or ATVs...And it's probably not too smart to be skiing, horse riding, using power equipment, and a whole bunch of other stuff while drinking either..."

In fog, a New Hampshire aircraft pilot has a good chance of flying into "Cumulo-granitus".

Among boating terms, I prefer the terms piloting or navigating to "driving": "Driving" suggests casual travel. As we have seen time and again, boating—like flying—is serious business.

[AC2717]

Operator of boat in fatal crash charged with negligent homicide

By GAIL OBER
[email protected]


Article Date: Friday, December 12, 2008
The Gilford woman who was allegedly driving the boat that struck the rocks off Diamond Island this June has been indicted by a Belknap County grand jury on two counts of negligent homicide.

Erica Blizzard, 34, was also indicted on one court of aggravated driving while intoxicated for the Father's Day collision that killed Stephanie Beaudoin of Meredith.

The two counts reflect the decision of Belknap County District Attorney James Carroll to present two different theories of the alleged homicide to a jury.

No trial date has been scheduled.

[Skip]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

..anyone know how your boat insurance policy works w/ regard to a negligent homicide indictment.........ouch?...

It should have no bearing on your current policy, as an idictment is not an indication of guilt or innocence; it means the grand jury found enough evidence to warrant a trial.

For those who would like to read the brief news report at the Citizen, please go HERE.

[AC2717]

Insurance is for "stupidity" and I AM NOT SAYING SHE WAS STUPID!
In other words her insurance will react no matter what she did, unless the insurance comopany was mis-informed or lied to on the application, but even then that would mean a cancellation of the policy in a certain amount of time, but even if this was the case, which it obviously is not, if the policy was in force at the time, then it would have to pay out. Now they have a rgith to defend you in a lawsuit as you transfer your rights, but this is a criminal case and unless there is some sort of insurance for that, which I am not sure there is? then the insurance will not take care of the case. There is usually a clause in every insurance policy that if there was a criminally negligent act comitted (and found to be committed is included), They have a right to deny a claim that YOU make for PD and liability against your policy, but in most cases, such as this one, they will still pay to third parties in this type of event, but have fun trying to get standard insurance for the rest of your life, you will be stuck in the pool forever paying higher than average prices due to your experience.

[tis]

And as you know if you have served on Grand Jury, only one side is presented ( no defense) and very few are NOT indicted.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

"...anyone know how your boat insurance policy works w/ regard to a negligent homicide indictment..."

The indictment can't help the effect on future premiums; however, a final decision reached four years ago after a series of under-the-radar court appeals might assist in understanding the provisions of your particular policy. Coverage can be excluded depending on criminal court findings:

"...[The Federal Court's] finding that coverage was excluded under the provision in Section B regarding "any loss, damage or liability willfully, intentionally or criminally caused or incurred by an insured person..."

In other words, any civil suit decision comes "out of your hide" (and not your insurance policy) if you have the above provision in your policy.

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Wow, what an incredible mess, 2008 has got to be a year she just wants to forget about. How the heck did this happen?

If the indictment is true (and as far as the BUI is concerned I doubt they would have bothered with it if the BAC did not support it), it happened because she got on a boat impaired and drove it in to an island while going too fast for the conditions.

[jeffk]

Not with boats, cars, jet skis, snowmobiles, motorcycles, or ATVs.

And it's probably not too smart to be skiing, horse riding, using power equipment, and a whole bunch of other stuff while drinking either.

The CDC estimates that every year
13,470 people are killed in alcohol related car crashes,
255,000 people are injured,
$51 BILLION in damage is done.

This is for cars only.

And it doesn't begin to touch on the anguish and grief left behind in the wake of the destruction.


We don't seem to be able to learn this lesson.
And we tolerate the behaviors that create the problem.

We'll see how this plays out in court but I agree that the charges would not have been brought without significant evidence of alcohol impairment, specifically the aggravated DWI charge, which then strengthens (in my mind) the negligent homicide charge.

This is really sad.

[Airwaves]

"...two counts of negligent homicide..."

Two?

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Originally Posted by Airwaves

"...two counts of negligent homicide..."

Two?

From the Citizen story link posted earlier:

The two counts reflect the decision of Belknap County District Attorney James Carroll to present two different theories of the alleged homicide to a jury.

It looks like the Grand Jury found either / both may apply.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

I dont recall reading anything about this being a dealer boat from Channel.

Not that it matters - if she had the dealer plate - there is still no issue. My point was - post on not seeing bow numbers was pretty obvious considering there was no bow left.

This was not a dealer boat from Channel...???

It was from Lakeport Landing, the family dealership. It is listed on their site for sale.

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

You didn't see the numbers because - THERE WAS NO BOW REMAINING!!!

I continue to read these posts - many while shaking my head, some get my attention enough to call someone else over to read the post to make sure I am not misreading or misunderstanding.....SURELY you are kidding about the bow numbers?????

Unbelievable!!

Again, Clearly some people that read the forum do not read the whole posting when they feel someone is wrong, As I would like to draw attention to the last line of my post in big capital letters.
To continue this though: if I am not mistaken the bow letters are supposed to be above the Rub rail, hence the reason for my post. Just a mere pointing out of what i saw in the photo and that is it.

[LDR4]

I have been reading some of these posts regarding this terrible accident over the past few days and have resisted writing my own because I was sure that all of this would eventually die down and did not want to add fuel to the fire. Unfortunately there are way to many people with way too much time on their hands (see turtleboy) that have already been able to conclude the cause of this accident was excessive speed and therefore find it acceptable to use this forum as a place to become Judge and Jury and convict someoneone of something that she has not even had a chance to defend herself of.

Yes I opposed the speed limit bill. I also do not have a boat that will go above 30 mph so it does not, and will not affect how I boat on the lake. I am against the bill because I think that the effort and money that has been put into this debate (by both sides) would be much better served being directed towards things like increased Marine Patrol presence on our lakes (all of them not just Winni) and stricter boater education requirements.
People are going to exceed 45 mph and 25mph whether there is a speed limit in force or not, and the Marine patrol does not, and will have the resources to effectively prevent that.
I don't know whether that boat was doing 20 mph or 50 mph that night. The only people that do (or will) are the people who survived the accident and the officials charged with the responsibility of determining the cause.

There will be plenty of time for everyone involved in the speed limit debate to get in their "I told you so's" once all the facts are determined.
This is still the United States, and we are still all "Innocent until proven Guilty"

Until we hear from those parties, I would suggest that we put this discussion on hold and pray for those recovering and for Stephanie and her family.

[sa meredith]

DaveG
While I certainly agree with the spirit of your post, I believe (as stated earlier), that other than mechanical failure, it really does not matter what the cause is. The captain is responsible for everything that takes place on his/her boat. Everything. And, as has been stated in this forum COUNTLESS times, the first order of reponsibility of the captain, is the safety of his/her passengers. I feel for Erica, as, no matter what, her life had changed forever.
But a girl has died, and there is a reason. I'm sure her family will want answers to all of their questions. And, utimately, I believe the captain will be held responsible for what occured on her boat.

[parrothead]

Originally Posted by sa meredith

DaveG
While I certainly agree with the spirit of your post, I believe (as stated earlier), that other than mechanical failure, it really does not matter what the cause is. The captain is responsible for everything that takes place on his/her boat. Everything. And, as has been stated in this forum COUNTLESS times, the first order of reponsibility of the captain, is the safety of his/her passengers. I feel for Erica, as, no matter what, her life had changed forever.
But a girl has died, and there is a reason. I'm sure her family will want answers to all of their questions. And, utimately, I believe the captain will be held responsible for what occured on her boat.

But until the investigation is completed it does no one any good to speculate on what happened in that boat. Until that time we should offer support to the family and friends of these women. I can't imagine what they must be going through, and don't think we should make it worse by trying to pass blame. Just let the investigators do their job.

[flyry49]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Wow, great post. Some corrections are needed though...

There are no "no wake" signs near Diamond Island. The closest is at Smith's Point, more than a mile away and not at all relevant,

"Slown"? Not a word I'm familiar with.

Excerpts from NH law:

270-D:1 Definitions

VI. "Headway speed'' means 6 miles per hour or the slowest speed that a boat can be operated and maintain steerage way.


270-D:2 General Rules for Vessels Operating on Water

VI. (a) To provide full visibility and control and to prevent their wake from being thrown into or causing excessive rocking to other boats, barges, water skiers, aquaplanes or other boats, rafts or floats, all vessels shall maintain headway speed when within 150 feet from:
(1) Rafts, floats, swimmers.
(2) Permitted swimming areas.
(3) Shore.
(4) Docks.
(5) Mooring fields.
(6) Other vessels.

There are circumstances where this particular law does not apply, but not being able to see an island at night is not one of them.

Simply put: If this one simple law had been obeyed, this accident (and nearly every other tragic accident on the lake, including the one that killed Mr. Hartman) would not have happened.

sorry if u dont like how i spell words, this forum isnt about writing formal essays so if it bugs you 2 damn bad. but u know exactly what it means. and you totally reached my point when i said if she saw a no wake sign. i know this island is terribly marked which also makes it hard to see it at night in the "rain" yes we all know she was moving faster than headway speed and breaking that law. im sure if she saw the island she would have tried to obey the headway speed law. so until you can prove how fast she was going stop talking about it

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by flyry49

sorry if u dont like how i spell words, this forum isnt about writing formal essays so if it bugs you 2 damn bad. but u know exactly what it means. and you totally reached my point when i said if she saw a no wake sign. i know this island is terribly marked which also makes it hard to see it at night in the "rain" yes we all know she was moving faster than headway speed and breaking that law. im sure if she saw the island she would have tried to obey the headway speed law. so until you can prove how fast she was going stop talking about it

When you are trying to make a convincing argument, good spelling and grammar help make your argument seem more credible. Your spelling and grammar are an excellent match for your argument.

[kthy66]

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...320/-1/CITNEWS


Lets keep things in perspective

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by kthy66

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...320/-1/CITNEWS


Lets keep things in perspective

That was a great tribute to her, sounded like a great woman.

[kthy66]

Yes she really did..
So sad for her parents and siblings. May god grant them serenity and peace in this time of need.

[woodswalk]

My wife and I often look to this forum for information. last night while she was on line I asked her to see what the winni site had to say about this recent incident. her response from the other room was simply "oh my god".

Shame all over you!!!- not all, (and you know who you are).
After looking through some of these posts, Me thinks a good portion of the boating crowd ought get their own know-it-all website and let the winni site do what it does best-
be a source one can go to to find out valuable information.

[NHKathy]

I have to say, I agree with Woodswalk - this should really stop. This thread has gotten WAY out of hand...
I also agree that this site is where to go for a source of valuable info about the Lakes Region, but every day when I log in lately, this thread is always there on top as having the newest post, and it's just back and forth arguing - no new info (such as updated conditions of those injured).
My condolences go out to the families involved, and prayers for recovery to the 2 women that were injured.