Wolfeboro Dock Expansion

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by tis

So the boaters that aren't from Wolfeboro that want to use the docks should chip in instead of just making the Wolfeboro taxpayer pay?

Wolfeboro could charge people to use the docks during busy times and easily make enough money to maintain, improve and expand them. Charge $.25 per foot LOA per hour with a 1 hour minimum and 3 hour maximum during peak times. There's about 1320 linear feet of usable dock space, so say they can fill 1200 feet, that's 300 bucks an hour. Pay a couple of people 15 bucks an hour to manage the docks and collect the money and the town would still be making at least 250 bucks an hour when the docks are full. Realistically, they could probably double the rate and still fill the docks. They could even put the dock space on Dockwa and let people reserve and pay ahead of time with the app. I use Dockwa all the time to reserve docks and moorings, it's brilliant.

[Cal Coon]

I hate to say this, but the reality is that the town docks just aren't big enough for the amount of traffic it carries (mostly) on weekends. I don't think Monday through Friday is as much of a problem, but we all know for a fact that wkends are a zoo!! I don't think it matters how much you expand any docks in any town on the lake, it will never be enough (on weekends), and you obviously can't enlarge the lake. It's not the money, or who pays for the expansion, it's the congestion that's the problem. It's the same problem Boston, and the surrounding areas have experienced since its settlement. It was originally built for horse and buggy. It was NEVER meant to carry the amount of traffic/congestion we have today, same as the lake. The difference is you can "expand" the roadways, byways, and highways surrounding the city, even though that creates it's own set of nightmare problems in itself, and will probably never be "big" enough to handle today's congestion anyways. The only "solution" to this problem on the lake, is to set limits on something, (ie: number of boats allowed on the lake, size of boats allowed on lake, etc,etc...), which we all know will most likely never happen as long as we remain the "live free or die" state. So, in the end, there really is no solution to this problem that keeps everybody happy, unfortunately. Someone, or something will have to suffer. I hope I'm wrong, we shall see. My own personal solution to this problem is to stay away from town docks on weekends. It works great!! I don't want to go places on my boat that i can go in my car...

[XCR-700]

Originally Posted by Cal Coon

I hate to say this, but the reality is that the town docks just aren't big enough for the amount of traffic it carries (mostly) on weekends. I don't think Monday through Friday is as much of a problem, but we all know for a fact that wkends are a zoo!! I don't think it matters how much you expand any docks in any town on the lake, it will never be enough (on weekends), and you obviously can't enlarge the lake. It's not the money, or who pays for the expansion, it's the congestion that's the problem. It's the same problem Boston, and the surrounding areas have experienced since its settlement. It was originally built for horse and buggy. It was NEVER meant to carry the amount of traffic/congestion we have today, same as the lake. The difference is you can "expand" the roadways, byways, and highways surrounding the city, even though that creates it's own set of nightmare problems in itself, and will probably never be "big" enough to handle today's congestion anyways. The only "solution" to this problem on the lake, is to set limits on something, (ie: number of boats allowed on the lake, size of boats allowed on lake, etc,etc...), which we all know will most likely never happen as long as we remain the "live free or die" state. So, in the end, there really is no solution to this problem that keeps everybody happy, unfortunately. Someone, or something will have to suffer. I hope I'm wrong, we shall see. My own personal solution to this problem is to stay away from town docks on weekends. It works great!! I don't want to go places on my boat that i can go in my car...

I no longer boat on Winnipesaukee on Saturdays in the summer as its virtually impossible to get on any town dock, or anchor at a sandbar or even drive safely without constant concern.

Weekdays are MUCH better, but try to get on a Wolfeboro dock on a Wednesday between 11:30 - 1:30, you will still wait.

And it was NOT better last summer even with the COVID.

There is clearly a problem.

What if anything will be done, at the moment it looks like nothing, and still people are undeterred, they are just more impatient - arrogant - dangerous.

I will wait maybe 20 minutes, after that we move on, and hope for a better experience next time.

Having a slightly larger boat (27') I am sometimes picky about what dock space I want to tie up on and will pass up a spot occasionally and wave a smaller boat through ahead of us. I work hard to make sure I dont cut anyone else off/jump ahead in the line while waiting, unfortunately I am seeing more and more people just ignoring any etiquette and bypassing people who have been waiting much longer. Sometimes they say nothing, somethings they argue that they were waiting longer knowing they are BSing. Its getting really bad in the last few years,,,

[Cal Coon]

Remember the (not so old) cliche: "If you build it, they will come"...

[Descant]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Wolfeboro could charge people to use the docks during busy times and easily make enough money to maintain, improve and expand them. Charge $.25 per foot LOA per hour with a 1 hour minimum and 3 hour maximum during peak times. There's about 1320 linear feet of usable dock space, so say they can fill 1200 feet, that's 300 bucks an hour. Pay a couple of people 15 bucks an hour to manage the docks and collect the money and the town would still be making at least 250 bucks an hour when the docks are full. Realistically, they could probably double the rate and still fill the docks. They could even put the dock space on Dockwa and let people reserve and pay ahead of time with the app. I use Dockwa all the time to reserve docks and moorings, it's brilliant.

Assumne a 24
boat. You want to charge $6.00 so I can run in from Barndoor Sunday am to get a box of doughnuts and a paper? Too expensive. I think you'd get a lot of resistance from merchants and residents. A token amount, like parking meters might be better received. The goal should be to increase the efficiency of use, not to be punitive.

[DBreskin]

Originally Posted by Descant

Assumne a 24
boat. You want to charge $6.00 so I can run in from Barndoor Sunday am to get a box of doughnuts and a paper? Too expensive. I think you'd get a lot of resistance from merchants and residents. A token amount, like parking meters might be better received. The goal should be to increase the efficiency of use, not to be punitive.

One dock could be designated as free with a 15-minute limit. Enforcement might be a challenge.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Descant

Assumne a 24
boat. You want to charge $6.00 so I can run in from Barndoor Sunday am to get a box of doughnuts and a paper? Too expensive. I think you'd get a lot of resistance from merchants and residents. A token amount, like parking meters might be better received. The goal should be to increase the efficiency of use, not to be punitive.

My idea was a way to come up with the money to expand the docks that some people feel are inadequately-sized (the original subject of this thread). Since the town did not want to pay for it with tax revenue out of the general fund, charging those that use the docks during busy times a little fee seems like a logical solution.

My experience on Sunday at "newspaper and doughnuts o'clock" has been that the docks are not at all busy, so under my plan, there would not be anyone collecting money and you would still dock for free.

[jeffk]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Wolfeboro could charge people to use the docks during busy times and easily make enough money to maintain, improve and expand them. Charge $.25 per foot LOA per hour with a 1 hour minimum and 3 hour maximum during peak times. There's about 1320 linear feet of usable dock space, so say they can fill 1200 feet, that's 300 bucks an hour. Pay a couple of people 15 bucks an hour to manage the docks and collect the money and the town would still be making at least 250 bucks an hour when the docks are full. Realistically, they could probably double the rate and still fill the docks. They could even put the dock space on Dockwa and let people reserve and pay ahead of time with the app. I use Dockwa all the time to reserve docks and moorings, it's brilliant.

It seems that the problem is the summertime crowding. Your solution says that the answer is to create yet another fee that requires complex management and hiring people to administer it. Further, it sends a message that Wolfeboro isn't happy with all the money being spent by all its visitors and is going to gouge more out of them.

There are other issues created by summertime crowding as well. For example, police coverage. More people requires more police coverage in the summer for many purposes. Should Wolfeboro charge a summer "Police" fee when you come into town to defray the extra summertime costs of policing? After all, why should the residents pay more in taxes for this? They already pay the cost for the nominal police coverage THEY need.

The EXISTING solution is the property tax system. WHEN the voters or their reps decide that the existing docking is insufficient and it is in the general interest of the town to expand the docks, they will fund it and taxes, including those on businesses, will cover the cost. The businesses will indirectly pass on to visitors the extra tax costs in their prices and the visitors will happily pay it. Residents will pay the increase and might consider the costs required to live in a lively and prosperous resort town.

I might point out that Meredith expanded and improved their docks a ways back and there are no "docking meters" there. Further, there are STILL a lot of boats waiting for spots on busy weekend afternoons proving that demand is still increasing and outstrips supply. Considering that the docks are almost completely empty for 6 months of the year it is a valid question of how much effort and expense should be put into a time limited (summertime) and perhaps insolvable problem. It's an issue of Return on Investment and perhaps the current situation is a good balance. Perhaps not. Either way, IMO, it's a matter for the town government and the existing property tax system to manage.