When does it end? How can it?

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by Susie Cougar

I really don’t know what to think anymore. I don’t understand how something as simple as putting on a mask when you’re out in public has become such a huge inconvenience that people refuse to do it.

Because the use of masks, "social distancing" and isolation is NOT EFFECTIVE, this is not opinion but fact that continues to roll into to ongoing studies and fed into the CDC.

The reason why this information is NOT getting out into the public is by choice. I know I see what we are sending to the CDC as far as results go and it is quite different than what they are making public.

Imagine the panic that would ensue if the federal government basically stated the truth? There is a virus on the loose, it is HIGHLY contagious and there are no effective physical mitigations that can be employed? What I find hilarious is that people actually believe that standing 6 foot away from another does anything, or that wearing a mask most who wear them wrong anyways, does anything at all when the virus can easily penetrate the materials and spread. Seriously?

The good thing is that there are medications that can be used to treat this that are continue to show success and even better - it appears that as this thing continues to spread it is loosing it's potency. Meaning those that are being infected now are not suffering the acute symptoms as when this first hit in the early stages.

I for one am not going to subject myself to engaging is behavior that is silly, stupid and useless. If a business says I can't come in cause I don't have a mask on - fine see you later I'll go elsewhere. This nonsense has to stop.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

Because the use of masks, "social distancing" and isolation is NOT EFFECTIVE, this is not opinion but fact that continues to roll into to ongoing studies and fed into the CDC.

The reason why this information is NOT getting out into the public is by choice. I know I see what we are sending to the CDC as far as results go and it is quite different than what they are making public.

Imagine the panic that would ensue if the federal government basically stated the truth? There is a virus on the loose, it is HIGHLY contagious and there are no effective physical mitigations that can be employed? What I find hilarious is that people actually believe that standing 6 foot away from another does anything, or that wearing a mask most who wear them wrong anyways, does anything at all when the virus can easily penetrate the materials and spread. Seriously?

The good thing is that there are medications that can be used to treat this that are continue to show success and even better - it appears that as this thing continues to spread it is loosing it's potency. Meaning those that are being infected now are not suffering the acute symptoms as when this first hit in the early stages.

I for one am not going to subject myself to engaging is behavior that is silly, stupid and useless. If a business says I can't come in cause I don't have a mask on - fine see you later I'll go elsewhere. This nonsense has to stop.

Several pieces of misinformation in here:

Masks and social distancing are not perfect, but have both proven effective in different ways. I think it was Charlie Baker (but maybe it was somebody similar) who said the best thing you can do to stop the virus is to stay home, second best is to wear a mask. ApS has a nice graphic on this above.

The federal government experts (Fauci, Birx, Redfield, etc) have told us the truth--there is a very dangerous virus, and there's no perfect shield

There is no medicine available that has shown the kind of success that should make any of us feel less danger. A few points less on the death toll is nice, but not a game changer.

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Several pieces of misinformation in here:

Masks and social distancing are not perfect, but have both proven effective in different ways. I think it was Charlie Baker (but maybe it was somebody similar) who said the best thing you can do to stop the virus is to stay home, second best is to wear a mask. ApS has a nice graphic on this above.

The federal government experts (Fauci, Birx, Redfield, etc) have told us the truth--there is a very dangerous virus, and there's no perfect shield

There is no medicine available that has shown the kind of success that should make any of us feel less danger. A few points less on the death toll is nice, but not a game changer.

LOL believe what you will everyone does irrespective of reality.

May want to re-evaluate your assertion of mis-information. This is coming directly from ACTIVE COVID-19 studies and clinical trials being executed across the globe. Not just one or two, we are running over 200 of them now.

What is on TV is not reality or even terribly accurate.

[Mr. V]

Here's a "back door" argument for the anti-maskers to consider:

Wearing masks, maintaining social distancing, minimizing exposure to others, frequent hand washing and use of sanitizer will slow down the spread of the virus.

When slowed down, fewer people will get it and the economy can open sooner.

With fewer people getting sick and the economy on the mend the stock market should stop riding the crazy train it's been on lately, and those (most of us, I bet) who have money invested can bounce back financially.

It boils down to this: if you play by the rules we'll get healthy sooner, both physically and financially.

"Live Free Or Thrive?"

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

LOL believe what you will everyone does irrespective of reality.

May want to re-evaluate your assertion of mis-information. This is coming directly from ACTIVE COVID-19 studies and clinical trials being executed across the globe. Not just one or two, we are running over 200 of them now.

What is on TV is not reality or even terribly accurate.

Everyone believes what they want to believe to support their own agenda. You can easily cherry pick from hundreds of studies to support which ever side of the fence you are on.

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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

LOL believe what you will everyone does irrespective of reality.

May want to re-evaluate your assertion of mis-information. This is coming directly from ACTIVE COVID-19 studies and clinical trials being executed across the globe. Not just one or two, we are running over 200 of them now.

What is on TV is not reality or even terribly accurate.

When you say "believe what you will everyone does", I'm pretty sure that with respect to COVID, that is happening only on the Republican side. All of the significant Democratic assertions from the past few months have been generally true--this is really dangerous, it can grow super fast, if we shut down growth will slow. Most recently this is evidenced by backtracking on reopenings in both Florida and Texas, with bars now shut down amid booming virus growth--states Major cited just a couple of days ago as right to reopen "full throttle".

I made 3 assertions, all backed by numerous accounts in the press, so hardly a need to cite them again. Be my guest if you'd like to refute, but please be specific, and give us a source if it's not obvious.

[TheRoBoat]

Arguably, the biggest detriment to the economy will be if kids can't go back to school in the fall. The ripple effects of that situation could be debilitating to the economy.

The chances of TX and FL being able to open their schools in the fall just took a massive hit. I would even say that it will be impossible, considering where they are now, to open.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by TheRoBoat

Arguably, the biggest detriment to the economy will be if kids can't go back to school in the fall. The ripple effects of that situation could be debilitating to the economy.

The chances of TX and FL being able to open their schools in the fall just took a massive hit. I would even say that it will be impossible, considering where they are now, to open.

Exactly, my daughter has three kids. 6,4,&2 and she has to return to work. Without school and day care it's the grand parents that have to pick up the slack. At 66 it's exhausting chasing 3 little ones around now.

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[Susie Cougar]

Just a day or two ago, Manatee County, where I live, came up with a school opening plan for August.

Kindergarten through fifth grade would go to school five days per week. Those students had the hardest time adjusting to distance-learning. Grade 6 would go four days a week in school and one day of distance learning at home. Middle school and high school would be a combination of in school and at home learning.
They will be putting plastic shields around each desk and distancing each student. Students will be more spread out throughout the school and could be in the cafeteria or other rooms for teaching. There will be hand washing stations in each room. Students will eat lunch in their class room. Students may have to come in split shifts because of the busing situation.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Susie Cougar

Just a day or two ago, Manatee County, where I live, came up with a school opening plan for August.

Kindergarten through fifth grade would go to school five days per week. Those students had the hardest time adjusting to distance-learning. Grade 6 would go four days a week in school and one day of distance learning at home. Middle school and high school would be a combination of in school and at home learning.
They will be putting plastic shields around each desk and distancing each student. Students will be more spread out throughout the school and could be in the cafeteria or other rooms for teaching. There will be hand washing stations in each room. Students will eat lunch in their class room. Students may have to come in split shifts because of the busing situation.

Ugh. So sad. (And you probably left out the no games at recess part.) I'm not saying it's a bad plan, just that it's all the difficulty of school with none of the joy. I hope parents, teachers and kids can figure out something to bring some sort of normalcy.

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

When you say "believe what you will everyone does", I'm pretty sure that with respect to COVID, that is happening only on the Republican side. All of the significant Democratic assertions from the past few months have been generally true--this is really dangerous, it can grow super fast, if we shut down growth will slow. Most recently this is evidenced by backtracking on reopenings in both Florida and Texas, with bars now shut down amid booming virus growth--states Major cited just a couple of days ago as right to reopen "full throttle".

I made 3 assertions, all backed by numerous accounts in the press, so hardly a need to cite them again. Be my guest if you'd like to refute, but please be specific, and give us a source if it's not obvious.

If I could make specific current clinical trial and study data public I would, unfortunately I cannot. If you prefer to hear nothing to the contrary of what you believe to be true and continue to be mislead by all means be my guest.

No where in my statements as of late have I injected one bit of politics but if you want to go that route I'm glad you think the Democrats are getting it "mostly right" as here is a perfect example of that:

https://ktvz.com/news/national-world...oregon-county/

Now what's this REALLY about?

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

If I could make specific current clinical trial and study data public I would, unfortunately I cannot. If you prefer to hear nothing to the contrary of what you believe to be true and continue to be mislead by all means be my guest.

No where in my statements as of late have I injected one bit of politics but if you want to go that route I'm glad you think the Democrats are getting it "mostly right" as here is a perfect example of that:

https://ktvz.com/news/national-world...oregon-county/

Now what's this REALLY about?

Your claim is that the CDC's recommendations, which are based on the "fact" that the virus spreads through water droplets, are ineffective. What is inaccurate about that?

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[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Your claim is that the CDC's recommendations, which are based on the "fact" that the virus spreads through water droplets, are ineffective. What is inaccurate about that?

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There are several methods of spread, person to person via water droplets is just one means of transmission.

Far as the mask debate that no doubt will rage till the end of time. As our lead doctor has told me as I asked him straight up out of genuine concern for my own family - some of who are at high risk. What does the data thus far show? He told me the science is pretty consistent on this and several ongoing studies continue to trend in this way. He explained it in this way which I think is brilliant for those of us who are not doctors or scientists. You head out to the beach on a bright sunny day with a high UV index. Wearing a mask is as effective as wearing a little bit of sunscreen expecting that will prevent you from getting sunburned. He said that is assuming that everyone was wearing a mask made of the correct material and wearing it correctly. All you have to do is go out in public and see this is not the case.

Is there some benefit? Sure but don't be fooled into thinking this is terribly effective as it is not.

One thing that is undisputed at this point is this thing is highly contagious so exposure to it and spread will not stop and the increase in confirmed cases should be expected but not feared. The fatality rate of this continues to drop and thankfully the acuteness of this as it spreads continues to trend downwards. Unfortunately fear of getting this with the notion it is a death sentence is far more destructive than the virus itself.

[Garcia]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

There are several methods of spread, person to person via water droplets is just one means of transmission.

Far as the mask debate that no doubt will rage till the end of time. As our lead doctor has told me as I asked him straight up out of genuine concern for my own family - some of who are at high risk. What does the data thus far show? He told me the science is pretty consistent on this and several ongoing studies continue to trend in this way. He explained it in this way which I think is brilliant for those of us who are not doctors or scientists. You head out to the beach on a bright sunny day with a high UV index. Wearing a mask is as effective as wearing a little bit of sunscreen expecting that will prevent you from getting sunburned. He said that is assuming that everyone was wearing a mask made of the correct material and wearing it correctly. All you have to do is go out in public and see this is not the case.

Is there some benefit? Sure but don't be fooled into thinking this is terribly effective as it is not.

One thing that is undisputed at this point is this thing is highly contagious so exposure to it and spread will not stop and the increase in confirmed cases should be expected but not feared. The fatality rate of this continues to drop and thankfully the acuteness of this as it spreads continues to trend downwards. Unfortunately fear of getting this with the notion it is a death sentence is far more destructive than the virus itself.

I’m curious, what is the lead doctors advice? Does he suggest opening everything up fully, no masks, no 6’ distance? Does he recommend proper mask use to minimize spread and/or limiting crowds? Does he recommend proper n95 mask use to help prevent catching the virus?

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

There are several methods of spread, person to person via water droplets is just one means of transmission.

Far as the mask debate that no doubt will rage till the end of time. As our lead doctor has told me as I asked him straight up out of genuine concern for my own family - some of who are at high risk. What does the data thus far show? He told me the science is pretty consistent on this and several ongoing studies continue to trend in this way. He explained it in this way which I think is brilliant for those of us who are not doctors or scientists. You head out to the beach on a bright sunny day with a high UV index. Wearing a mask is as effective as wearing a little bit of sunscreen expecting that will prevent you from getting sunburned. He said that is assuming that everyone was wearing a mask made of the correct material and wearing it correctly. All you have to do is go out in public and see this is not the case.

Is there some benefit? Sure but don't be fooled into thinking this is terribly effective as it is not.

One thing that is undisputed at this point is this thing is highly contagious so exposure to it and spread will not stop and the increase in confirmed cases should be expected but not feared. The fatality rate of this continues to drop and thankfully the acuteness of this as it spreads continues to trend downwards. Unfortunately fear of getting this with the notion it is a death sentence is far more destructive than the virus itself.

I don't understand the analogy. Is the suggestion that the sunlight is the virus—that we are bathed in virus?

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[Jdarby]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

There are several methods of spread, person to person via water droplets is just one means of transmission.

Far as the mask debate that no doubt will rage till the end of time. As our lead doctor has told me as I asked him straight up out of genuine concern for my own family - some of who are at high risk. What does the data thus far show? He told me the science is pretty consistent on this and several ongoing studies continue to trend in this way. He explained it in this way which I think is brilliant for those of us who are not doctors or scientists. You head out to the beach on a bright sunny day with a high UV index. Wearing a mask is as effective as wearing a little bit of sunscreen expecting that will prevent you from getting sunburned. He said that is assuming that everyone was wearing a mask made of the correct material and wearing it correctly. All you have to do is go out in public and see this is not the case.

Is there some benefit? Sure but don't be fooled into thinking this is terribly effective as it is not.

One thing that is undisputed at this point is this thing is highly contagious so exposure to it and spread will not stop and the increase in confirmed cases should be expected but not feared. The fatality rate of this continues to drop and thankfully the acuteness of this as it spreads continues to trend downwards. Unfortunately fear of getting this with the notion it is a death sentence is far more destructive than the virus itself.

I work with a multitude of critical care and emergency physicians from major academic centers (both in the US and abroad) that have a differing opinion than that of the doctor you spoke with. Funny how we all pick and choose what “doctors” we decide to listen to. I guess that’s why everyone should always get a second opinion! I also guess we Americans are far better at spreading it than all those other countries that have successfully curtailed its transmission. They should probably talk to your physician colleague about what exactly they are doing wrong as they really shouldn’t be able to stop it’s spread. Fascinating!


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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

If I could make specific current clinical trial and study data public I would, unfortunately I cannot. If you prefer to hear nothing to the contrary of what you believe to be true and continue to be mislead by all means be my guest.

No where in my statements as of late have I injected one bit of politics but if you want to go that route I'm glad you think the Democrats are getting it "mostly right" as here is a perfect example of that:

https://ktvz.com/news/national-world...oregon-county/

Now what's this REALLY about?

Kind of pathetic to compare dumb behavior from an obscure bureaucrat in a tiny 50,000 person county in the middle of nowhere with the incredibly irresponsible gigantic, world-wide impact of the President of the US and his sheep-like Governors of Florida and Texas.

Also silly that you try to cite "secret" information is response to me criticizing another member's post for asserting things that are not true. If his original post is true, he should back it up.

But strangest of all is that even as the data become irrefutable that the President has been completely incompetent on Covid, you still argue in his favor on this issue

[webmaster]

After 330 posts it's time to close this thread. Start new threads if needed. Keep the national politics OUT!