City of Laconia home rentals

[Major]

Originally Posted by joey2665

I owned a small business also for 30 years. Your missing my point, the law should have never been changed, you are restricting my rights as a landowner. There were just are not enough complaints to justify the change, this came over one specific incident and the rest are now paying for it. Laconia is a vacation destination and now you are limiting visitors who rent homes on a weekly basis so the home will just sit empty when there could be renters that patron the businesses around the lake.

I don't think I am. While I agree with you emotionally on some level, the "right" you assert is based on less than solid ground. Had the planning department and city council enforced the zoning laws since the beginning of SD/LB, the "right" you reference would not exist. There is no right. Owners in a residential neighborhood do not expect nor want weekly rentals. There should be no difference for owners in Long Bay.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Major

I don't think I am. While I agree with you emotionally on some level, the "right" you assert is based on less than solid ground. Had the planning department and city council enforced the zoning laws since the beginning of SD/LB, the "right" you reference would not exist. There is no right. Owners in a residential neighborhood do not expect nor want weekly rentals. There should be no difference for owners in Long Bay.

I’m not saying there should be. I think all Laconia should be allowed to short term rent and there were allowed to until recently. I think your statement that owners “do not expect nor want weekly rentals” is quite broad and you nor I have any way of knowing if it’s accurate.


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[Red apple]

So I guess my question is does the zoning board have the right to pick and choose who they allow to short term rent and who they say no to. I just watched the three hour town meeting (it is on you tube if you search it) and there is no way that I can see that renting your home by the week through VRBO or the night with Air B2B is that you can prove a hardship.With that said the board said no to all three that at that nights meeting and most likely will continue to say no to everyone that comes in for a variance.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Red apple

So I guess my question is does the zoning board have the right to pick and choose who they allow to short term rent and who they say no to. I just watched the three hour town meeting (it is on you tube if you search it) and there is no way that I can see that renting your home by the week through VRBO or the night with Air B2B is that you can prove a hardship.With that said the board said no to all three that at that nights meeting and most likely will continue to say no to everyone that comes in for a variance.

So much for “Live Free or Die”


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[fatlazyless]

So, "how can a residential property suddenly turn into a commercial property in a residential area? I would think that local homeowners have a right to have their neighborhood remain a private residential neighborhood."


* copied from 1/02/19 www.ConwayDailySun.com, letters to the editor from Lorene Miklos

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by joey2665

So much for “Live Free or Die”


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They need to change that logo. It no longer rings true.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Biggd

They need to change that logo. It no longer rings true.

Unfortunately you are correct

[Woodsy]

IMHO,

While I don't think government should really have to get involved...

If you live in an area that is zoned Residential, then you probably shouldn't be doing short term rentals. Your neighbors didn't sign up for a small motel next door.

If you live in the Commercial Resort zoned areas of the city like the Weirs, you should be allowed to do short term rentals as long as your HOA allows it.

For the record, I live in the Weirs and my HOA does not allow short term rentals.

Woodsy

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

IMHO,

While I don't think government should really have to get involved...

If you live in an area that is zoned Residential, then you probably shouldn't be doing short term rentals. Your neighbors didn't sign up for a small motel next door.

If you live in the Commercial Resort zoned areas of the city like the Weirs, you should be allowed to do short term rentals as long as your HOA allows it.

For the record, I live in the Weirs and my HOA does not allow short term rentals.

Woodsy

It's been a staple of resort areas forever but now that it can be tracked it's no longer allowed? That doesn't really make sense. I don't rent my house out but I wouldn't want to be told I couldn't. My neighbor across the street from me rented her A frame out all summer, weekly rentals, and I had no issues with the tenants but if I did she would hear about it.

[Major]

Originally Posted by Biggd

It's been a staple of resort areas forever but now that it can be tracked it's no longer allowed? That doesn't really make sense. I don't rent my house out but I wouldn't want to be told I couldn't. My neighbor across the street from me rented her A frame out all summer, weekly rentals, and I had no issues with the tenants but if I did she would hear about it.

If you live in a zoned residential area, you cannot rent your house on a short term basis without a variance or by changing the zoning. In the past, the City chose not to enforce the zoning laws. With the advent of internet short term rental sites, the issue is now at the City level, and now they are enforcing the zoning laws. I agree with Woodsy. I would not expect while living in a zoned residential neighborhood to have weekly rentals next to my home.

The enforcement of the zoning laws has nothing to do with the evaporation of the Live Free or Die mentality of our great State. Our State's moto has been undergoing a slow death (no pun intended) over the past decade or so. Growth of government and the insatiable desire for the almighty tax dollar have done more to change our mindset away from the Live Free or Die mentality.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Major

If you live in a zoned residential area, you cannot rent your house on a short term basis without a variance or by changing the zoning. In the past, the City chose not to enforce the zoning laws. With the advent of internet short term rental sites, the issue is now at the City level, and now they are enforcing the zoning laws. I agree with Woodsy. I would not expect while living in a zoned residential neighborhood to have weekly rentals next to my home.

The enforcement of the zoning laws has nothing to do with the evaporation of the Live Free or Die mentality of our great State. Our State's moto has been undergoing a slow death (no pun intended) over the past decade or so. Growth of government and the insatiable desire for the almighty tax dollar have done more to change our mindset away from the Live Free or Die mentality.

My house is in Meredith. Sorry to say but, if I owned property in Laconia it would be up for sale.

[Red apple]

Originally Posted by Biggd

My house is in Meredith. Sorry to say but, if I owned property in Laconia it would be up for sale.

Unfortunately Meredith and other lake towns are dealing with the same thing and will all be making changes to protect the residences in residential zoning areas.


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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Red apple

Unfortunately Meredith and other lake towns are dealing with the same thing and will all be making changes to protect the residences in residential zoning areas.


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I agree but there has to be a better way that can appease everyone. Maybe limit the amount of time it can be rented to one week a month and no renting by the just a day or a weekend.
People renting their second homes out in resort areas has been going on forever but, now with internet rental being popular, a new way of policing this needs to be implemented. I don't agree with just making it illegal.

[Woodsy]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I agree but there has to be a better way that can appease everyone. Maybe limit the amount of time it can be rented to one week a month and no renting by the just a day or a weekend.
People renting their second homes out in resort areas has been going on forever but, now with internet rental being popular, a new way of policing this needs to be implemented. I don't agree with just making it illegal.

I don't think anyone has ever had a problem if the neighbors rented their house out once or twice a year for week to cover taxes. Like you said that has been going on forever. However, with the advent of websites like Airbnb & VRBO, these rentals have essentially become an unregulated and untaxed small business. That is a problem.

I am not sure how the issue can be resolved, unless you restrict it to areas zoned a certain way.

Woodsy

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I agree but there has to be a better way that can appease everyone. Maybe limit the amount of time it can be rented to one week a month and no renting by the just a day or a weekend.
People renting their second homes out in resort areas has been going on forever but, now with internet rental being popular, a new way of policing this needs to be implemented. I don't agree with just making it illegal.

There are many waterfront homes that are used full time as rentals. My Gilford house is one of those. It is a weekly rental in the summer and one tenant from September until Memorial Day. The two houses immediately adjacent to the other side of the property (I spend summers in) have also been used 100% as rentals for the past 6 summers. I have no complaints about the people who have rented them and have not been impacted at all. Many of these rental homes were purchased by their owners for precisely that purpose.

If renting is significantly impacted by changes or enforcement of the laws I believe many homes will go on the market, and that will drive the sale prices down. That ranges from the families who rent to help offset expenses and use the property themselves, to properties that are rentals 100% of the time. When fewer house on the lake are available for rent, look for the weekly rental prices to skyrocket.

I still feel that the ideal solution is enforcement of noise regulations and regulations that specifically impact the problem property. As of this time, anyone who has purchased a home that is not in an association knew that there was a possibility that their neighbors could rent their home out. If the home is in an association the documents available before the purchase would inform the purchaser of the rental policy and may impact their decision to purchase.

We don't need to keep adding laws in the "Live Free or Die" state. In the view of many, continuously adding laws and regulations has already negatively impacted boating on the lake.

[kjkam]

Can someone confirm that Laconia is not creating a new law, just enforcement of existing regulations?

[fatlazyless]

The Laconia Daily Sun has an Oct 11, 2018 article: 'Short-term rentals come under new enforcement plan' that is a good read. It says the city already has the authority to restrict rentals according to permitted uses in various zones, and can fine the landlords who do not respond $275/day.

LaDaSun-Nov 28, 2018: 'Four enforcement actions launched under Airbnb policy'

LaDaSun-Dec 18, 2018: 'Board deals blow to Airbnb-type rentals'
…………

Conway Daily Sun-Jan 26, 2018: 'Unfairbnb? Short-term rentals mired in controversy'

[Garcia]

An easy solution, in my opinion, is to make a distinction between a short term rental to offset costs and a business venture. Pick a reasonable number, say 30 days/year that allows property owners to rent out their homes for short term rentals. If a property owner exceeds that number of days, it would be considered a business and face different, stiffer regulations.

Regardless of the number of days the property is rented, collect the state and local rental tax. If you are renting through Airbnb or VRBO, this is very easy to do.

Like any other regulation there are ways people can work around or ignore the above suggestion and no law or regulation is perfect. This is a model that has worked well in other communities.

[Woodsy]

Originally Posted by Garcia

An easy solution, in my opinion, is to make a distinction between a short term rental to offset costs and a business venture. Pick a reasonable number, say 30 days/year that allows property owners to rent out their homes for short term rentals. If a property owner exceeds that number of days, it would be considered a business and face different, stiffer regulations.

Regardless of the number of days the property is rented, collect the state and local rental tax. If you are renting through Airbnb or VRBO, this is very easy to do.

Like any other regulation there are ways people can work around or ignore the above suggestion and no law or regulation is perfect. This is a model that has worked well in other communities.

The question remains... how does the city/town know what days it was rented, and for how much? So the neighbors have to be eyes/ears of the city to make sure its not rented more than 30 days?

Not for nothing.. the burden should be on the property owner...

Woodsy

[fatlazyless]

https://www.nhbr.com/September-14-20...t-this-summer/ …. "Airbnb NH bookings soared over 50 percent this summer"



What the legislature could do is totally legalize both recreational marijuana and short term residential rentals in the same bill, and pass it unanimously!


Having done that, the Live Free or Die would be a real deal type of a license plate line. Otherwise, the line should be changed back to the 1963 license plate line of "Photoscenic".

Yes, is so very photoscenic here in NH except for the house next door with the 11 dope smok'n, weekend renters ….. this is the place! …. live free or die!

[Woodsy]

Biggd....

The resort areas in Laconia are zoned as such. Most of the Weirs is zoned Commercial Resort. Weekly rentals should absolutely be allowed in this zone. As long as the HOA rules allow for it.

Residential zoned property is a different animal entirely. What happens when somebody comes out with an app and the guy next door decides to switch from weekly rental to hourly?

People who own property in a residentially zoned neighborhood have a reasonable expectation that the guy next door cannot turn his property into a no tell motel.

Never mind the 9% room tax the state isn't getting.

Here is a link to the zoning map... https://www.laconianh.gov/DocumentCe...ing-Map?bidId=

Woodsy

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

Biggd....

The resort areas in Laconia are zoned as such. Most of the Weirs is zoned Commercial Resort. Weekly rentals should absolutely be allowed in this zone. As long as the HOA rules allow for it.

Residential zoned property is a different animal entirely. What happens when somebody comes out with an app and the guy next door decides to switch from weekly rental to hourly?

People who own property in a residentially zoned neighborhood have a reasonable expectation that the guy next door cannot turn his property into a no tell motel.

Never mind the 9% room tax the state isn't getting.

Here is a link to the zoning map... https://www.laconianh.gov/DocumentCe...ing-Map?bidId=

Woodsy

I understand what you're saying and I can understand what's happening. Things change fast on the information highway. I just think there could be a better way of policing these issues. With the amount of money people pay in taxes in Laconia it's perfectly understandable if they rent their place out some weeks to help pay the tax burden.

[TiltonBB]

I know that there are hundreds of single family homes around the lake that are sometimes rented out on a weekly basis. I have one next to my residence that I have rented out for 16 years. There are a few house rental agencies around the lake as well, some of whom represent over 100 rental homes. The agencies do collect the appropriate taxes on the rentals.

Many homeowners rent out of necessity to help them afford the house. What may have been affordable to their ancestors might have become more than they can afford. I would rather see them rent out their house than be forced off the lake. Also, if you start to limit the number of weekly rentals the price will rise because of supply and demand..

I am all for the rental process as it also enables families to come to the area, spend money, and enjoy all that it has to offer. That helps all of our businesses survive. Some families that have vacationed in the area for years go back to the same rental house every year. Many end up buying property.

I would rather see the towns enact a system that will enable some warning and an escalating fine system for violations of noise or other town regulations. The ultimate penalty could be an injunction preventing rentals on a specific property for a set amount of time.

Placing restrictions on properties that have no complaint history is unnecessary.

[Woodsy]

TiltonBB...

Normally we are on the same page... but I think this short term rental issue in residentially zoned neighborhood is a very slippery slope. I have no problem with the neighbors renting out their property once or twice a year to help offset costs....

But most of the people who list on AIRBNB & VRBO are renting their property out as business venture. This changes everything... now instead of people living in a residential neighborhood, they find themselves living next to what amounts to a motel...

There are ZERO protections in place for the neighbors. There is no punishment available for unruly/loud behavior, (yes the police can stop the actual offenders, but there is no punishment to the owners) There is NOTHING from stopping someone from renting their house out "by the hour". There are no regulations regarding taxation and collection... etc etc.

Maybe once the laws are changed to protect the neighborhood, then I will reconsider. But for now, short term rentals should be allowed only in the Commercial Resort District.

Woodsy

[fatlazyless]

1913-2017: unlimited local prop tax deduction off your federal taxes ..... effective for tax year 2018: $10,000 maximum limit on same ........

So's, only seems fair for the $10,000+ prop tax payer, now under attack from the fed, to have the option for renting it out maybe two or three of those rainy June-July weeks for something like $3000/week and let someone else go play in that cool, clammy June-July lite misty rain that's been present for the last ten years what with the global warming.

It seems to me ...... that there otta be a law against this new tax law!

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

1913-2017: unlimited local prop tax deduction off your federal taxes ..... effective for tax year 2018: $10,000 maximum limit on same ........

So's, only seems fair for the $10,000+ prop tax payer, now under attack from the fed, to have the option for renting it out maybe two or three of those rainy June-July weeks for something like $3000/week and let someone else go play in that cool, clammy June-July lite misty rain that's been present for the last ten years what with the global warming.

It seems to me ...... that there otta be a law against this new tax law!

That tax change on real estate tax deduction will have zero effect on rich people buying or building multi million dollar homes in the lakes region. Most of those McMansions are empty 90% of the time, not rented for extra income to pay taxes.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Biggd

That tax change on real estate tax deduction will have zero effect on rich people buying or building multi million dollar homes in the lakes region. Most of those McMansions are empty 90% of the time, not rented for extra income to pay taxes.

I agree tax law will have ZERO effect on the McMansions. Many of these larger homes are not individually owned but you in LLC’s or another corporate structure for many reasons and this is an avenue to still receive the full property tax deductions plus deduct other expenses.


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[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Biggd

That tax change on real estate tax deduction will have zero effect on rich people buying or building multi million dollar homes in the lakes region. Most of those McMansions are empty 90% of the time, not rented for extra income to pay taxes.

One other thing to consider: If the property taxes are say $20,000 per year and the property use is 50% rental, half of the tax bill is deductible as a business expense and does not affect your $10,000 limit. If the house is 100% a rental property then the entire tax bill is a business expense and does not come into play with the $10,000 limit.