Early ice damage

[winterh]

What is it that makes that happen? I run bubblers because I was under impression that once iced in the rising lake level in spring would pull the pilings up with it but thats not what happened here. This is way to high for it to be the rising lake.

[fatlazyless]

It seems very unusual.

Maybe the deep freeze temperatures of last week got conducted down the wood piling, freezing the existing moisture inside the wood piling which increased its' buoyancy by 10%, and at the same time the now frozen piling has less surface friction between the piling wood surface and the lake bottom causing the lake bottom to lose its' grip allowing the piling to rise up vertically, held in position by the ice surface.

Probably, some part of the piling is still sticking into the lake bottom, otherwise it would be a leaner or be tipped over, but would not be 90-degree vertical, as it is.

[Rusty]

For the fun of it I thought I would rotate the piling upright.

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

It seems very unusual.

Maybe the deep freeze temperatures of last week got conducted down the wood piling, freezing the existing moisture inside the wood piling which increased its' buoyancy by 10%, and at the same time the now frozen piling has less surface friction between the piling wood surface and the lake bottom causing the lake bottom to lose its' grip allowing the piling to rise up vertically, held in position by the ice surface.

Probably, some part of the piling is still sticking into the lake bottom, otherwise it would be a leaner or be tipped over, but would not be 90-degree vertical, as it is.

.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?

....... of course, I am!

[Pricestavern]

You know, if you went to Walmart and got a large number of their very fine noodles, you could rig a collar for the piling so that it remains vertical...

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?

....... of course, I am!

How about, you just pat yourself on the back and we will end it at that.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?

....... of course, I am!

If you can answer this easy physics question than I'll agree that you are the "greatest" thinker known to mankind:

A block of hardwood is floating easily on the surface of a lake. As a storm approaches, the density and pressure of the air above the lake begin to decrease. As a result of this decrease in air pressure and density, the block of wood

(A) moves upward slightly and floats higher in the water.

(B) continues to float just as it did before.

(C) moves downward slightly and floats lower in the water.

(D) sinks to the bottom of the lake.

[DickR]

Originally Posted by Rusty

If you can answer this easy physics question than I'll agree that you are the "greatest" thinker known to mankind:

A block of hardwood is floating easily on the surface of a lake. As a storm approaches, the density and pressure of the air above the lake begin to decrease. As a result of this decrease in air pressure and density, the block of wood

(C) moves downward slightly and floats lower in the water.

The log is buoyed up by the sum of two forces, the weight of the water displaced and the weight of the air displaced. Together they equal the weight of the log. With the weight of the now lower pressure air reduced, the log sinks ever so slightly. The buoyant force of the air displaced is further reduced because the volume of air displaced is reduced by this sinking, while the buoyant force of the water is increased due to more of it being displaced. One could calculate the increase in depth if given the densities of the log, water, and air before and after the pressure change. A bigger challenge would be to determine how to measure such a tiny change in immersion.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?....... of course, I am!

Logic—not your strong suit.

I submit that the rings of ice suggest that the piling (which appears light in color and was likely installed last season) remained buoyant, warmed the water around it during bright, sunlit, days, and floated up a few inches every day for a week. Darkness found it frozen-in again nightly—freezing a new "ice-collar" around it every night.

This happened several days in a row—which accounts for the multiple "ice collars" that have collected around the piling.

So, don't expect this piling to be vertical in April.

[fatlazyless]

You know this piling or post is probably a big, 20-25' long, soft wood, pine tree which got pounded into the lake bottom by a pile driver rig with a crane lowering a big heavy weight upon it. Much like sharpening a pencil, the narrow end of the piling gets sharpened to a point by a chain saw before being pounded into the lake bottom.

The piling gets pounded into the lake bottom for maybe six feet ..... so what could make the lake bottom lose its six foot long grip on the piling ..... to allow it to float straight up while being held in position by the surface ice?

Isn't it likely that some of the piling is still stuck into the lake bottom otherwise it would either be a leaner or have toppled over. So, it seems to me, that it is being held by both the ice surface, and the lake bottom. Something caused it to float upward but not enough to be totally out of the lake bottom.

So, vas ist das something?