"Boat" fire West Alton Sand bar

[chachee52]

Anyone over that way? Kind of sounds like the Dive is on fire. They called it in as boat fire, now they are saying "building" in the water.
They kept saying off duty FD were tryign to get "all the propane tanks off". Kind of sounds like the Dive

[thinkxingu]

Just came to post that a bunch of videos of The Dive on fire started popping up on my feeds. Here's one: https://www.facebook.com/share/1Js5TbG4dJ/

Edited to add that my wife heard everyone got off safely. This doesn't look good at all: https://www.facebook.com/share/r/1EYwVLLs1y/

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[barndoor]

It is the Dive

[Blue Thunder]

https://youtu.be/bXD-L3jje6Q?is=v4OBFfeblckTh0Eo

[8gv]

I the YT video linked above it seems that the fire boat at the 5 o'clock position is spending a lot of time spraying water everywhere but at the dive.

It leads me to the impression that it can only spray dead ahead, i.e, there is no aiming ability and the captain was having difficulty positioning the boat due to rototilling the shallow bottom with his props.

But...

The boat at the 2 o'clock position appears to be able to direct his sprayer in directions other than dead ahead.

Are any of you here in the know on this?

[garysanfran]

Has burned...Completely destroyed

[WinterHarborGuy]

Pearl Harbor….jeez.

[Riviera]

Originally Posted by 8gv

I the YT video linked above it seems that the fire boat at the 5 o'clock position is spending a lot of time spraying water everywhere but at the dive.

The crew of the fire boat may have decided to do the world a favor, and let it burn.

Seriously though, I’m glad nobody was hurt, and I feel for the owners in terms of any financial loss. (I imagine that would be a tough boat/structure to insure). That said, the Dive has been a safety hazard since day one. It has run aground due to insufficient power/mechanical systems, it has nearly sunk, and now it has caught fire. It has also left an environmental mess in its wake. Had anybody tried to float such a structure on USCG governed waters, it would have never gotten certified for commercial use. I am not usually a fan of over-regulation, but laws should be enacted to keep this sort of amateur built behemoth off of public waters.

At some level, I could understand the entertainment attraction of having this sort of business/structure on the lake. It is always nice to have another food and beverage option while out boating, particulary a novel one. I personally detested the aesthetic nature of the thing, and I never thought it was right that a business could effectively “claim” a section of lake (the West Alton Sand Bar) as its own sort of free “lakefront real estate”.

I hope the powers that be are able to clean up the mess, now and in the future. If this sort of thing were to appear on the lake again, I hope it is done to USCG commercial vessel navigation and life safety standards, and I hope any future business is prohibited from anchoring itself in public waters for business purposes.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Riviera

The crew of the fire boat may have decided to do the world a favor, and let it burn.

Seriously though, I’m glad nobody was hurt, and I feel for the owners in terms of any financial loss. (I imagine that would be a tough boat/structure to insure). That said, the Dive has been a safety hazard since day one. It has run aground due to insufficient power/mechanical systems, it has nearly sunk, and now it has caught fire. It has also left an environmental mess in its wake. Had anybody tried to float such a structure on USCG governed waters, it would have never gotten certified for commercial use. I am not usually a fan of over-regulation, but laws should be enacted to keep this sort of amateur built behemoth off of public waters.

At some level, I could understand the entertainment attraction of having this sort of business/structure on the lake. It is always nice to have another food and beverage option while out boating, particulary a novel one. I personally detested the aesthetic nature of the thing, and I never thought it was right that a business could effectively “claim” a section of lake (the West Alton Sand Bar) as its own sort of free “lakefront real estate”.

I hope the powers that be are able to clean up the mess, now and in the future. If this sort of thing were to appear on the lake again, I hope it is done to USCG commercial vessel navigation and life safety standards, and I hope any future business is prohibited from anchoring itself in public waters for business purposes.

Spot on.

While I've never commented on the seaworthiness of the vessel given my limited knowledge, I've been very vocal about my issues with The Dive profiting off of, and negatively impacting access to, public space.

I am, however, sad for the owners and those who have lost something they enjoyed...just not enough to miss it.

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[Slickcraft]

Now the owners will be faced with the difficult and expensive process of removal of the remains. I hope that they had insurance.

Alan

[TomC]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Spot on.

While I've never commented on the seaworthiness of the vessel given my limited knowledge, I've been very vocal about my issues with The Dive profiting off of, and negatively impacting access to, public space.

I am, however, sad for the owners and those who have lost something they enjoyed...just not enough to miss it.

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While the esthetics of this boat are certainly subject to taste, every marina with a commercial mooring field profits from public/state resource... And I am sure the Dive paid plenty for various licenses to operate (and collected meals tax) which went to the state.

[FlyingScot]

I'm with Riviera. I hate to see an entrepreneur crash after investing so much time and $, but this whole thing was amateur hour from the start--I had assumed they already failed before I saw the article. In addition to the problems mentioned above, there were also licensing, docking, and location issues not addressed when they should have been, discussed here years ago. Any business is really tough, you gotta do as much homework as you can upfront.

[chachee52]

Listening to the scanner through this, someone down wind had the nerve to actually call 911 while the fire was still burning and ask when the "cleanup" would be completed because some debris and "oil" was starting to come near/on their beach.
Come one people!! The fire was still burning and an active scene at that time. There were also numerous other things going on at that time through the lakes region. Taking the time away from the dispatchers to listen to that while someone else was having a heart attack on a mountain that needed the National Guard to come with a helicopter to name just one other thing that was happening.
I realize that this person did not know of all the other things going on, but people need to think of these things before calling 911.

[retired]

I am amazed at how many boaters remained on the sand bar to watch the fire.
That's a very dangerous situation with embers flying and potential for an explosion. You would think Marine Patrol would have moved everyone out of harms way.

[Mr. V]

I wonder if The DIve was fully insured?

[WinterHarborGuy]

My kid refers to it today as “The Dove”.

Not the bird, but past tense of…yeah, you get it. Rude, I know.

[SAMIAM]

My guess is a fire in the ductwork…..smaller kitchen fires are easily contained. Once the ducts catch fire there is not much to stop them. Ducts are coated with grease from cooking and should be professionally cleaned at least once a year

[LIforrelaxin]

The Dive, was an interesting addition to the lake. I had my problems with it, but I also liked the idea. Mainly my objections to the Dive stemmed from the point that it didn't seem like the owners did adequate research before embarking on the project. Hence all the issues they had over the years. They learned a lot and so did we over the years.... At the end of the day, the Mount shouldn't be the only floating restaurant and venue on the lake.

With that said, the important part of this situation is that everyone was safe.... The environmental issues can be cleaned up.... The dive could recover and rebuild if they so chose..... and life will go on....

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

My guess is a fire in the ductwork…..smaller kitchen fires are easily contained. Once the ducts catch fire there is not much to stop them. Ducts are coated with grease from cooking and should be professionally cleaned at least once a year

SAMIAM, I read somewhere that there was an inspection completed within 6 months—if so, do normal "restaurant" inspections check duct cleaning history?

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[chachee52]

Originally Posted by retired

I am amazed at how many boaters remained on the sand bar to watch the fire.
That's a very dangerous situation with embers flying and potential for an explosion. You would think Marine Patrol would have moved everyone out of harms way.

Just an FYI, The propane tanks were all removed by an off duty Boston FD that was on board when the fire started (as heard by listening to the scanner). They kept reporting that that fire fighter "wasn't getting off the boat until the tanks were off".
The drone videos show that most of the boats were off the sand bar once everyone got there. I wasn't on the water that day so I'm just going by what I heard on the scanner and saw on the posts by others.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by chachee52

Just an FYI, The propane tanks were all removed by an off duty Boston FD that was on board when the fire started (as heard by listening to the scanner). They kept reporting that that fire fighter "wasn't getting off the boat until the tanks were off".

Hopefully, that guy has a lifetime of good karma.

I was in a bar in Boston a few years ago when "The Texan"—the guy in the famous Boston Bombing photo squeezing Jeff Bauman's femoral artery—walked in, and the place erupted.

Some people are just different when things go south—God bless them.

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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Hopefully, that guy has a lifetime of good karma.

I was in a bar in Boston a few years ago when "The Texan"—the guy in the famous Boston Bombing photo squeezing Jeff Bauman's femoral artery—walked in, and the place erupted.

Some people are just different when things go south—God bless them.

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My oldest daughter is like that, an RN. If she sees someone in need she's off to the races!

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

I wonder if The DIve was fully insured?

There is one person claiming over and over again on the various FB threads that it was not insured. I can't imagine them not having any insurance on it at all but could understand if they had business/general liability but not coverage on the vessel itself. Probably not an easy one to insure, but there is always some off brand carrier that will insure anything for a price.

We were sitting by the pool and could see the smoke rising when it went up. It's a bit south of us, not in our direct view.

[Riviera]

Originally Posted by codeman671

There is one person claiming over and over again on the various FB threads that it was not insured. I can't imagine them not having any insurance on it at all but could understand if they had business/general liability but not coverage on the vessel itself. Probably not an easy one to insure, but there is always some off brand carrier that will insure anything for a price.

I would have bet it was uninsured. It’s not really a boat, and it’s not really a building. It simply doesn’t fit into any typical insurance category. There may well have been “some” means of insuring it, but that would be some sort of specialty market, where underwriters look at the insured item on a case by case basis. That sort of insurance is typically associated with items of much larger value, where the relatively high premiums (as a percentage of the items value) can support the expensive task of custom underwriting. In the grand scheme of things, The Dive is (was) low value, so I suspect it was effectively uninsurable.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by TomC

While the esthetics of this boat are certainly subject to taste, every marina with a commercial mooring field profits from public/state resource... And I am sure the Dive paid plenty for various licenses to operate (and collected meals tax) which went to the state.

Suppose every sandbar had one?

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by TomC

While the esthetics of this boat are certainly subject to taste, every marina with a commercial mooring field profits from public/state resource... And I am sure the Dive paid plenty for various licenses to operate (and collected meals tax) which went to the state.

Those marinas own the waterfront property, though, and in almost all cases, boaters have access to services and bathrooms.

I've used the analogy before, but The Dive was like setting up a hot dog stand on a hiking trail.

As an avid hiker, I'm equally critical of groups like AMC and their hut systems—especially the prices they charge for overnights in areas without other options—but they at least give back by providing water, emergency resources, emergency shelter, rest areas, etc.

The Dive just plunks itself on prime real estate, taking away access and negatively affecting the experience. More than once, we had to deal with belligerent groups and careless boaters leaving their vessels that were improperly/unreliably anchored, so we either avoided going or anchored on the outside edge of WAM.

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[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by chachee52

Just an FYI, The propane tanks were all removed by an off duty Boston FD that was on board when the fire started (as heard by listening to the scanner). They kept reporting that that fire fighter "wasn't getting off the boat until the tanks were off".

The drone videos show that most of the boats were off the sand bar once everyone got there. I wasn't on the water that day so I'm just going by what I heard on the scanner and saw on the posts by others.

Article about the off-duty firefighter on WMUR last night: https://www.wmur.com/article/off-dut...7pAtL3oHI5_1cQ

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[SAMIAM]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

SAMIAM, I read somewhere that there was an inspection completed within 6 months—if so, do normal "restaurant" inspections check duct cleaning history?

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Never had an inspection that included ductwork or history of cleaning that I know of….pretty difficult on the lake

[Lakes Region Guy]

Where did they tow the dive to?

[fatlazyless]

Maybe the M.V. Winnipesaukee Belle, a 65-ft replica 19th-century paddleboat with capacity of 120 to 150 passengers, operated by Mount Washington Cruises could occupy the Lake Winnipesaukee spot at the West Alton sandbar formerly 'owned' by the now destroyed 'The Dive' which was a 62-ft barge.

M.V. Winnipesaukee Belle never showed up on July 1 to its' Meredith town dock, and continues to be stored high up the repair, dry-dock ramp, out of the water on Center Harbor bay.

M.V. Winnipesaukee Belle has a bow mounted gangway that can probably be used by customers to access the Belle from the shallow sandbar water in West Alton, similar to The Dive.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Lakes Region Guy

Where did they tow the dive to?

It went into West Alton Marina. A few of the local contractors got together along with a dumpster company and were tearing it down to the bare barge. It may already be complete from the progress I saw on FB.

One of them mentioned there was no fire insurance. Had it sunk they were covered, but fire was not.

[Mr. V]

Isn't there something conceptually wrong with serving alcohol to boaters moored on the lake?

Given the strict BWI laws I would think this should be a non-starter, but then again the state motto is "Live Free or Die" so yeah, I guess NH prioritizes personal freedom to choose over public safety.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

Isn't there something conceptually wrong with serving alcohol to boaters moored on the lake?

Given the strict BWI laws I would think this should be a non-starter, but then again the state motto is "Live Free or Die" so yeah, I guess NH prioritizes personal freedom to choose over public safety.

Just the thought of all those people peeing in 2 feet of water keeps me away from sand bars when they are crowded!

[John Mercier]

Peeing is the least of it.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

Isn't there something conceptually wrong with serving alcohol to boaters moored on the lake?

Given the strict BWI laws I would think this should be a non-starter, but then again the state motto is "Live Free or Die" so yeah, I guess NH prioritizes personal freedom to choose over public safety.

Why? The only one BWI laws pertain to are the operator of the boat, not the passengers. It is legal in NH for the operator to drink and have an open container as long as they don't exceed the legal limit. The passengers can do whatever they please.

[TCC]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

Isn't there something conceptually wrong with serving alcohol to boaters moored on the lake?

I totally agree Mr. V, but is is really any different from serving alcohol to drivers parked in the parking lot of a bar (or a restaurant that serves alcohol)?

[Woodsy]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

Isn't there something conceptually wrong with serving alcohol to boaters moored on the lake?

Given the strict BWI laws I would think this should be a non-starter, but then again the state motto is "Live Free or Die" so yeah, I guess NH prioritizes personal freedom to choose over public safety.

Absolutely no difference between the Dive and any other bar/restaurant that serves alcohol in the State. They all serve people who drive, be it cars, bikes or boats. At some point, personal responsibility has to come into play.

Woodsy

[Descant]

Wow! Talk about a change of subject matter! Meanwhile, back to the fire?

[DEJ]

Originally Posted by Descant

Wow! Talk about a change of subject matter! Meanwhile, back to the fire?

Glad there will be less BUI issues going forward.

[retired]

Maybe all the people drinking at the sandbar could have peed on the fire to put it out.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by retired

Maybe all the people drinking at the sandbar could have peed on the fire to put it out.

I'm sure some of it ended up on the fire!

[garysanfran]

Originally Posted by retired

Maybe all the people drinking at the sandbar could have peed on the fire to put it out.

Didn't help the Lake level at all...

[tis]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I'm sure some of it ended up on the fire!

Thanks for that.

[map]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

I wonder if The DIve was fully insured?

I heard only liability.

[Mr. V]

Originally Posted by map

I heard only liability.

Well then, I suspect that's the last time you'll see such a thing on the lake unless the owners have very deep pockets and are emotionally invested in returning.

Interesting how The Dive became pretty much a "love it or hate it" issue.

[fatlazyless]

This seems like a great opportunity for the 65' M.V. Winnipesaukee Belle to go to the infamous Small's Cove sandbar in West Alton and run a similar operation as the destroyed The Dive. Mount Washington Cruises owns a large dock in nearby Alton Bay where the Belle could dock at night and be staged and serviced for the next day down at the Small's Cove sandbar.

Like right now, August 1, the Winni Belle is still sitting on its dry dock ramp in Center Harbor after undergoing a two year refurbishment, or something.

Winni-Winni-Winni Belle ...... www.facebook.com/Winnipesaukee.belle.cruise/ .... West Alton Sandbar is looking for .... .... YOU!

[rsmlp]

Why, pray tell are you up at 4:00am posting?

[GodSmile]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

This seems like a great opportunity for the 65' M.V. Winnipesaukee Belle to go to the infamous Small's Cove sandbar in West Alton and run a similar operation as the destroyed The Dive. Mount Washington Cruises owns a large dock in nearby Alton Bay where the Belle could dock at night and be staged and serviced for the next day down at the Small's Cove sandbar.

Like right now, August 1, the Winni Belle is still sitting on its dry dock ramp in Center Harbor after undergoing a two year refurbishment, or something.

Winni-Winni-Winni Belle ...... www.facebook.com/Winnipesaukee.belle.cruise/ .... West Alton Sandbar is looking for .... .... YOU!

Have another look at the Center Harbor dock FLL.

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by GodSmile

Have another look at the Center Harbor dock FLL.

Aug 9 ...... eight days later and the Winni Belle has never left its Center Harbor, Mt Washington Cruises private dock, there. Hey, at least it is now IN the water.

Could be that cruise management has nixed the 2026 Meredith Town Dock, Winni Belle cruise schedule because it never happened, and is now wondering what the heck to do with the Winni Belle.

You know ...... is it a cruise boat ..... or is it a white elephant ..... or what?

[retired]

I was never a patron of the dive, although I have gone by it many times in my boat. I wonder how profitable it was. Its customer base was somewhat limited by the fact it was only accessible by boat, and "parking" was limited. I haven't seen any report from the state fire marshal on the exact cause of the fire. Is it possible it was self-inflicted for the insurance money? A financial bailout for a failing business? It makes one wonder.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by retired

Is it possible it was self-inflicted for the insurance money? A financial bailout for a failing business? It makes one wonder.

I was told that the fire started in grease in a kitchen vent. I also learned that although they had insurance if it sank there was no insurance for fire.

Your question about "self inflicted for insurance money" is not well thought out. If someone wanted to do that it wouldn't happen during the day when it was occupied with patrons and staff. "Insurance fires" usually start about 3 AM when no one is around to notice, call the fire department, or attempt to extinguish it.

[Outdoorsman]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

I was told that the fire started in grease in a kitchen vent. I also learned that although they had insurance if it sank there was no insurance for fire.

Your question about "self inflicted for insurance money" is not well thought out. If someone wanted to do that it wouldn't happen during the day when it was occupied with patrons and staff. "Insurance fires" usually start about 3 AM when no one is around to notice, call the fire department, or attempt to extinguish it.

Thanks for that answer

[thinkxingu]

The Dive owners posted today that they won't rebuild but that the engines and barge/hull and/or name/social media presence are available for purchase.

Facebook post here: https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1CN9DXzqBV/

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[retired]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

I was told that the fire started in grease in a kitchen vent. I also learned that although they had insurance if it sank there was no insurance for fire.

Your question about "self inflicted for insurance money" is not well thought out. If someone wanted to do that it wouldn't happen during the day when it was occupied with patrons and staff. "Insurance fires" usually start about 3 AM when no one is around to notice, call the fire department, or attempt to extinguish it.

Sorry, I don't know much about arson.