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05-18-2008, 11:51 AM | #1 |
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Lake Markers
Hi Folks!
I'm relatively new to boating (4th season coming up). I've spent a lot of time on Winnepesaukee (even tho I live near Boston). Most of the people I meet are very nice and helpful. That's the main reason I come up (to get away from the city stress and be around people who act like they enjoy their lives)! Boating on the big lake is a blast! In my efforts to NOT be considered "Captain Bonehead", I've talked to a lot of people, studied maps, taken courses and used common sense when in the water. One thing that continues to baffle me is the meaning of the white/black and white/red markers. When I encounter them, I tend to consult the map, or use common sense. So far, that's worked ok. But I could be just "lucky." The language in the NH boating book describes how to navigate depending on direction of travel. The challenge I have is that I never remember it! If anyone has another way of describing how to handle those markers, it would be very helpful. Thanks so much! Jon Last edited by jonfinn; 05-18-2008 at 12:51 PM. Reason: typo! |
05-18-2008, 12:23 PM | #2 |
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Lake Markers
This is how I was told and how I remember:
Red is hot. It is hot in the south and west so go south or west of a red marker depending on your direction of travel. Black is cold. It is cold in the north and east so go north or east of a black marker depending on your direction of travel. The exception is if they are solid red or black. Then it is a channel and you need to go between them. |
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05-18-2008, 09:42 PM | #3 | |
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05-19-2008, 12:16 AM | #4 | |
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I'm generally not a fan of shortcuts, because in the long run they don't work. I always check what I see against the chart if I'm not familiar w/ the area (its also useful, at times, to watch what other boaters do). But If I have a quick way of deciphering what the markers are saying, then I have a little more confidence. Thanks for your help! I'll be reading this forum for more "anti-bonehead" tips! Jon |
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05-19-2008, 07:40 AM | #5 |
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And then there is the method I made for my own use.I use the alphabet.
Black (b) is closer to North (n)and East(e) Red (r) is closer to South(s) and West (w)
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05-18-2008, 01:21 PM | #6 |
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Here's a link to the Boat-Ed website for NH. The markers you reference are toward the bottom.
http://www.boat-ed.com/nh/handbook/markers.htm The trick I use to remember which side to pass on is that the red-topped markers are hot like the Southwest, so a boater is supposed to travel south or west of that marker. That leaves north or east for the black-topped markers. |
05-18-2008, 01:41 PM | #7 |
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Nor-easter
I like rose's trick.Mine is just the opposite, black and white remind me of the clouds when we have a Nor-easter. So north and east of black or south and west of red. Hope this helps.
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05-18-2008, 03:31 PM | #8 |
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I just remember BEN--black go east, north.
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05-18-2008, 05:42 PM | #9 |
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Rose, that is the one thing I got out of the class. The instructor said to remember red by the warm states south and west and the black by the cold , north and west. I thought that was a good way to remember. Of course you have to have a compass orrrr-a good sense of direction!
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05-18-2008, 06:54 PM | #10 | |
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That's what husband's are for
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I hate to admit it, but my older brother taught me the trick with the markers. |
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05-18-2008, 07:08 PM | #11 |
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Jon,
Most of the time (95% or so) the object being marked is on the shore side. As you have figured out it's the other times that are the problem. Most of us follow our location on a chart until we become familiar with an area. The chart will show which side to pass on. The other problem is that this forum has identified a few markers that don't follow the standard red black logic. The chart is the safest way to stay off the rocks. Enjoy your summer. |
05-19-2008, 08:31 AM | #12 |
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I find this to be the easiest to remember.
RED___Wool___Sweater RED__pass West or South |
05-19-2008, 08:48 AM | #13 |
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Dont be embarassed to keep referring to your chart or chart-plotting GPS to be certain. That's my habit in any tight spot.
If you dont have your chart handy for some reason, you can also watch to see what other boats are doing. With luck they'll know what they're doing if you arent sure of your self. The other boater's competence cant be guaranteed but if they dont hit anything there's a good chance they guessed right. Good luck! |
05-19-2008, 04:58 PM | #14 |
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Alphabetic order does it for me
(B) lack
(E) ast (N) orth (R) ed (S) outh (W) est |
05-19-2008, 06:42 PM | #15 |
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Jonnfinn ----
BEWARE !! I too use the rule of thumbs (color associations) mentioned above -- but remember it is a "rule of thumb" -- it will work 95% of the time. There are however a couple of "confusing" situations out there and the Map is your best ally. A perfect example of this (at least for me) is the black top's near FL# 30 (near Mink & Little Camp ilses). After time, I fully understand it's logic today, but at first it was an inigma as to where to safely boat.
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05-19-2008, 07:45 PM | #16 |
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OK, please explain FL#30 to me. Why is it there, it seems safe on all fours sides. Is it just a single rock?
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05-20-2008, 06:48 AM | #17 |
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It's shallowish and there's a rock south of it between it and Mink. Pass that one on the north side. The confusing one (for me) is the black topped spar just northeast of FL30 and it's companion balck topped spar. You need to pass between the two black topped spars to be safe.
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05-20-2008, 07:24 AM | #18 | |
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Which way did they go?
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Dave, I thought that North of FL 30 on the side of Mark is one red top closer to the island and a black top "companion" to the right of it. If those are the two markers you are thinking about, I thought you needed to pass outside the black top marker, or between the red top and the island. I thought the shallowest area is between the two markers. You wrote that it is 2 black tops and I don't see them on my chart therefore I'm not sure we are talking about the same place. It is true that passage past markers is not always by the intuitive route. Check the chart.
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05-20-2008, 12:23 PM | #19 | |
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(That spot is a lot more clear on my old Duncan chart) Ken |
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05-20-2008, 12:51 PM | #20 | |
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That route is my prefered way from Center Harbor to Weirs Beach/Meredith, just to avoid the no wake at the north end of Bear. I also route around the north side of Eagle to avoid the no wake at FL2. |
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05-20-2008, 12:12 PM | #21 | |
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For the longest time I had a mental block on remembering which sides to pass on which color buoy until I was able to remember "BEN" Black - East/North. One thing finally dawned on me that made it a lot easier to understand how buoys are placed. That is, just because a bouy has a certain color top, doesn't mean you can safely pass on BOTH of two sides of it. For example, a black topped buoy means pass to the east or north, but it doesn't mean you can safely pass on BOTH the east and north sides - that all depends on what its marking and where that hazard is. Once I figured that out, it made it a lot easier to figure out what was right and wrong. A perfect example are the 3 black buoys lined up on the north side of Eagle Island. You'd better NOT pass to the north side of the first two! One thing for sure is the lake will either keep you on your toes or it'll take your prop. Ken |
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05-20-2008, 12:55 PM | #22 |
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You know, I see boats blast through that area on the north side of Eagle all the time. Makes me wonder just how bad it is in there; not enough to gamble though.
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05-20-2008, 02:06 PM | #23 | |
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A good reminder for jonfinn and other folks not to assume that other boats are taking an acceptable course. |
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05-20-2008, 02:54 PM | #24 | |
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Ken |
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05-20-2008, 06:48 AM | #25 |
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I believe it is ok on all sides.Based on the Bizer chart,the depth does go down below 6 ft on the south side of FL 30,which I think is why the charts show the main route around the north side.Bizer does not show any rocks in that area.
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05-19-2008, 08:26 PM | #26 | |
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Yeah. Agreed. It's not so much that I care what anyone thinks. My concern is that if I spend TOO much time loitering in a certain area while I figure out what I'm doing, that's also not a good thing. I've run in to a few situations when it took me a moment to wrap my head around what the markers are saying vs. what the chart says. When they match, I feel like I can navigate pretty confidently. If they don't match, it usually means I don't understand what I'm looking at yet. I suspect people boating for a lot of years will understand this thought: I've learned a lot about boating over the last couple of years. But mostly, I've learned that I need to learn a lot more! Yikes! what did I get myself in to???? Thanks for all your input. Helps enormously! |
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05-20-2008, 05:28 AM | #27 |
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we live in the North East, so I just remembered that one is black. Once you have your own way to remember it's easy.
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06-07-2009, 07:23 AM | #28 | |
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There are many wanys to navigate the lake safely and they all have been mentioned here at some point. Common sence seems to be the most impportant. But the little sayings to remember south and west for red..etc are good too. But having a (current) naviagational chart and using it. I don't care how well I know the lake, that chart is always out on the dashboard in front of me when underway, for at the very least a wuick refference. The only exception is when we're in Winter Harbor near our dock, or waterskiing, or something like that. Also, a good rule of thumb, when in doubt: hug the marker...they are set up to allow for a degree of safe passage even if on the wrong side (only to an extent). |
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06-07-2009, 07:41 AM | #29 | |
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You know, I've used this technique many times in the past, but never really thought about the markers being set that way on purpose. Thanks for posting. |
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06-07-2009, 04:20 PM | #30 |
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You know, C Duff, I always use to believe that hugging the buoys was a good idea too, but one year in the fall we did that and hit a rock. That was the year when the water was very low in the fall, a few years ago. I think what happens is when the buoys move with the ice, the MP does not remember exactly where they were and put them back in the wrong place. It was a stainless prop so was a very expensive accident!
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06-07-2009, 06:53 PM | #31 | |
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I have been boating on the lake for nearly 20 years and can't for the life of me navigate using a compass and the rules. It might be fun to learn but I really don't think it's necessary. I just rely on the Bizer chart and at a glance there is NO confusion what side to be on. I guess if I lost my chart I would be SOL though!! |
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06-07-2009, 07:01 PM | #32 |
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Oooooh not a good idea! The markers do shift with ice and occasionally end up closer to the hazard. When in doubt turn around and go back the way you came. Hugging the markers could cost you a prop, drive, hull.
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06-08-2009, 07:00 AM | #33 | |
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06-08-2009, 07:33 AM | #34 |
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.........................
Do not hug markers! It's is correct that shifting occurs etc. and your approach is to keep 75' from the marker to allow for safe passage.
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06-08-2009, 11:26 AM | #35 | |
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10-09-2011, 09:44 PM | #36 |
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B&W Marker Near Goose Egg Rock
In all the years I've been on Winni, until today, I had never gone over to look at Goose Egg Rock. It's not far from our place in Senter Cove. It appears to be a single, large rock without much else around it. There is a black & white buoy about 40 feet from it but the rock appears to be south east of the buoy. This places the rock kind of IN the boat path. The rock is currently about 3-4 inches below the waterline. There is fairly fresh blue paint on the rock indicating a recent "hit". I think Marine Patrol should relocate this Black and White closer to the rock and so that Goose Egg Rock is clearly south west of the buoy.
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05-06-2009, 08:08 PM | #37 | |
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Addtional Stripe on the Red Top
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We learned about these important features and hints at the NH Boating Safety class along with many other important rules of navigation (right of way, safe passage, etc.) from a seasoned instructor. We were also taught the red-hot-south-west and black-cold-north-east in that classroom session and it is good to see other perspectives in this forum. These are known as the Cardinal marking system and are only used by a very few states ( I think). It works for us here with all those pieces of the Granite State lurking about just below the surface. Jofinn, you say you took some courses but I might suggest that if you do most of your boating here in NH that you should seriously consider a NH state classroom course. You just can't get this type of info on the internet in the depth and understanding that you get in a classroom. Additionally you get the facts on NH laws not some hearsay from other folks. I hear the prices for the classes may increase soon though. Still a bargain for safety on the water. And I think it was mentioned, don't think the other guy barreling through is always right. I've seen some with shallow draft-on-plane (read jet ski's) cut the markers just to confuse those pondering their course. Those folks know their waters. BTW it is not illegal to travel on the "wrong" side of the marker as anglers, and paddlers do it all the time for their purposes. However if you do, hope you have deep pockets for your marine mechanic just in case. Nothing beats a compass of any kind on board and a chart is golden. |
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06-05-2009, 09:38 AM | #38 | |
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I have taken some courses here in Boston area, and I will definitely take courses in NH too when time permits. I'm hoping someday to retire in the lakes region actually. Lastly, it's very doubtful I'm gonna blindly follow someone without knowing the area, or following the chart and markers. The one time I was careless, I was renting a boat from Thurston's. I took a big chunk out of the skeg and it cost me around $600. Lesson learned. I was lucky actually. See you on (hopefully) the right side of the markers! I'll be the guy in the little bowrider with the big grin! |
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06-06-2009, 06:17 AM | #39 |
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