|
Home | Forums | Gallery | Webcams | Blogs | YouTube Channel | Classifieds | Calendar | Register | FAQ | Donate | Members List | Today's Posts | Search |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
|
10-31-2021, 01:26 PM | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lake Winni
Posts: 215
Thanks: 36
Thanked 130 Times in 38 Posts
|
Gunstock Expansion Plans
Any thoughts about Gunstock looking at a major expansion? I for one question their strategy considering skier participation has been in decline for the past 10 years. I went to Gunstock a few times midweek and the place was dead quiet Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. Maybe some basic upgrades on the lifts might be nice.
|
10-31-2021, 01:57 PM | #2 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
I haven't seen the whole plan, but since most of it will be done with private money... not really sure that the Gunstock Commission will get what it envisions.
|
10-31-2021, 02:35 PM | #3 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Rock Haven Lake - West Newfield, ME
Posts: 5,366
Thanks: 374
Thanked 1,053 Times in 493 Posts
|
__________________
|
10-31-2021, 03:32 PM | #4 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
I read the article, but that is all I had.
It appears that the hotel and mountain top restaurant would be a private partnership. And upgrading the road to the top would only be viable if those two (or at least one of the two) exist. Snow making and lift upgrades aren't really that controversial. |
The Following User Says Thank You to John Mercier For This Useful Post: | ||
DotRat (10-31-2021) |
10-31-2021, 07:33 PM | #5 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Tuftonboro and Sudbury, MA
Posts: 2,309
Thanks: 1,211
Thanked 976 Times in 603 Posts
|
I don't quite get it. With a vertical drop of only 1300', Gunstock is never going to match Loon, Waterville, and Vermont areas as a premier destination. Plenty of areas >2,000' are well worth the drive, especially if staying overnight
|
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to FlyingScot For This Useful Post: | ||
Sponsored Links |
|
10-31-2021, 08:43 PM | #6 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
Amenities
Quote:
Gary Kadaiesch (sp?) and family have a long history of developing and supporting the ski industry. He's the perfect one to lead this effort. |
|
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Descant For This Useful Post: | ||
BroadHopper (12-05-2021), lakewind (11-12-2021) |
10-31-2021, 10:27 PM | #7 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 219
Thanks: 1
Thanked 37 Times in 25 Posts
|
Moved on some years ago
We used to have season passes to Gunstock - over time they sort of raised the prices (expected to some extent) and reduced the benefits so for the last few years we get the Epic Pass.
Besides being cheaper, you get access to many New England very good resorts (including Stowe - albeit that one with some date restrictions) as well as many world class resorts out west if you can find a way out there (We do each year). No brainer for us. Can't understand/justify paying that kind of money $699 for such a tiny mountain with no partner resorts. Just Crazy! |
11-02-2021, 06:53 AM | #8 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Laconia NH
Posts: 5,547
Thanks: 3,162
Thanked 1,094 Times in 788 Posts
|
Gunstock
There is private money think Rusty Mclear. He is on the commission. So I'm not surprised.
Gary Kiedash (spelling) has an impressive resume regarding the ski industry. He even take credit at HEAD to bringing shaped skis to market! Tom Day, the present Manager of Gunstock retired from WV, and Gary convinced him to work for him. So I can see where this is leading to. Great if you have the terrain to support it, but being so close to the ocean you have a short season. Not a great idea. I grew up on Gunstock. What attracted me is the small mountain feel yet the big mountain skiing. Take a look at all the other resorts. Crowded during the week, mega crowds on weekends. It's been a decade that I enjoy skiing these mountains. Once they change Gunstock to a 'mega' resort, it will be a disaster. I may have to change to Tenney or Ragged Mountain. Both are great skiing! I even bought the Indy Pass and I expect to try a number of Indy ski areas. Tom made some significant improvements since he took over. Moving the ski rental shop from the cellar is a great step. Investment in ski grooming equipment and snowmaking is another. Prior season the snow sports park was the first to open for the season. Last winter, they were able to open the Panorama. This season Tom promised the whole mountain will be open on the first day! Bold statement! As a lifelong resident of Belknap County, I would like to see it cater to Belknap County not to the world.
__________________
Someday may never be an actual day. |
11-02-2021, 07:33 AM | #9 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,090
Thanks: 1,157
Thanked 2,011 Times in 1,239 Posts
|
Quote:
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk |
|
11-16-2021, 06:37 PM | #10 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 9 Posts
|
Quote:
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to rocket21 For This Useful Post: | ||
Winnigirl (11-17-2021) |
12-05-2021, 08:57 AM | #11 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lake Winni
Posts: 215
Thanks: 36
Thanked 130 Times in 38 Posts
|
Gunstock Presentation
Did anyone attend the Saturday presentation about Gunstock expansion? Curious to hear any responses.
|
12-05-2021, 09:24 AM | #12 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Laconia NH
Posts: 5,547
Thanks: 3,162
Thanked 1,094 Times in 788 Posts
|
Gunstock Master PLan
https://www.gunstock.com/community/master-plan/
As you can see, it will require purchasing private property and getting permission from the Belknap Conservatory Trust to make it happen. I did not attend as I was at a meeting in Concord at the same time. I was told that many who attended appear to be in favor. There will be a Youtube video of the presentation in the near future. It will be interesting if the video will present the Q&A section after the talk. Interesting is that the 'back side' that spills into the Weeks property was at one time the longest rope tow in history 'The Gunstock Hoist'. I faintly remember walking up and skiing down one of the trails back in the late 50's early 60's. It is pretty much now overgrown. http://www.nelsap.org/nh/hoist.html I can envision the expansion to the former Alpine Ridge ski area fairly easy. Gunstock purchased the land from Penny Pitou. Because of the terrain, I'm not quite so sure the value added. I can go on and on but I will leave it here.
__________________
Someday may never be an actual day. |
12-05-2021, 04:47 PM | #13 |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 9 Posts
|
Here's a story on the meeting/proposal and a few additional maps:
Gunstock Presents $45.5 Million Expansion Proposal The auto road and cabins (overlapping the present-day Overlook and Belknap Range hiking trails) and mid-mountain hotel may raise some concerns. |
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to rocket21 For This Useful Post: | ||
Biggd (12-06-2021), BroadHopper (12-06-2021), Fargo (12-05-2021), GregW11 (12-06-2021), Loub52 (12-05-2021) |
12-06-2021, 08:37 AM | #14 |
Senior Member
|
So, why would anyone want to spend 45.5 million dollars, Belknap County money, to expand Gunstock ... www.gunstock.com .... when it's raining hard, today, Monday December 6 with more rain and warm temps predicted for opening day, next weekend, Dec 11-12?
For about seventy five dollars you can get an excellent pair of walking boots at the Skechers store in Tilton, and another $20 for "Yaktrax Pro" winter ice /snow traction walker elongated springs design at Ebay and you are good to go hit the Gunstock winter hiking trails. $75 & $20 for winter walking vs 45.5-million for ski area expansion? That's a big difference? ..... Shopping the local thrift store or Walmart, winter walking boots/shoes can be, maybe, a great value! ..... Downhill skiing is a conspiracy to get you to spend a lot of money, when you actually would get much more recreational benefit by walking up and down a NH mountain hiking trail in the winter. ..... ...... and maybe bring along a pair of ski poles from the thrift store for steep walking.
__________________
... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! Last edited by fatlazyless; 12-06-2021 at 10:24 AM. |
11-05-2021, 01:36 PM | #15 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 991
Thanks: 256
Thanked 280 Times in 169 Posts
|
I agree with you. I prefer Gunstock's low vertical drop because I am (or was) an intermediate skier. What made Gunstock attractive to me was that it's SMALL, MANAGEABLE, NEARBY, and used to be affordable for a day pass. I hated the overcrowding at Loon and having to take a train from one side to the other. Bigger is not better. Adding more trails to Gunstock would make it less rather than more attractive for me personally. This expansion will be the end of Gunstock's small, local flavor.
|
11-05-2021, 04:46 PM | #16 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Moultonborough
Posts: 741
Thanks: 4
Thanked 257 Times in 169 Posts
|
Quote:
On the downside, Loon did away with the senior break on midweek passes, nearly doubling the cost. |
|
11-05-2021, 05:01 PM | #17 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Rock Haven Lake - West Newfield, ME
Posts: 5,366
Thanks: 374
Thanked 1,053 Times in 493 Posts
|
__________________
|
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to mcdude For This Useful Post: | ||
11-02-2021, 09:43 AM | #18 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 143
Thanks: 16
Thanked 48 Times in 29 Posts
|
Quote:
If Gunstock can keep the old school vibe it has while adding some amenities to attract more tourists dollars more power to them. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
|
11-02-2021, 09:51 AM | #19 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,970
Thanks: 203
Thanked 621 Times in 416 Posts
|
Gunstock Expansion Plans
Not a skier, so I don’t know all the particulars, but why is the Gunstock ski area owned by the taxpayers? Would it not benefit the county if it was privately developed
Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app |
11-02-2021, 11:50 AM | #20 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Melrose, Mass.
Posts: 189
Thanks: 0
Thanked 183 Times in 52 Posts
|
Gunstock Expansion Plans
Imbued by the earlier years Penny Pitou, Egon Zimmerman, my family frequented the area often. The single chair lift / try me trail were outstanding for individual solitude. The old T-bar for Smith and Phelps, look at all of the great improvements that have been made over the years.
Last all season pass sometime around '68 or '69. It should be an asset to the County, and to day trippers from Boston going to "Gunny" for the day. I was ultimately very glad when the new double chair increased the uphill capacity. The old chair at one point used to give me nosebleeds at the highest span between pylons. What did I know at the time, just a snot nosed kid having a great time on the boards. Shall we talk about the Arlberg...... |
The Following User Says Thank You to Donzi Minx For This Useful Post: | ||
BroadHopper (11-03-2021) |
11-02-2021, 05:24 PM | #21 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Quote:
There were many more ski hills in the region, all privately owned... they no longer exist. The land will always be county-owned, but the business is a tough gig. |
|
11-02-2021, 08:36 PM | #22 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
Parallel?
As a parallel, Cannon seems to be doing very well. The issue, whether public or private ownership, is how to make money year round. There used to be a "Profile House" Hotel near Cannon, which as was often the case, burned. NH should allow a new resort hotel in that area. The plan to expand resort hotel at Gunstock is a great one and follows what has been successful elsewhere. Does the Arlberg site have enough land for a golf course? There are other nearby places that could compliment. The team in place is excellent at regional development. I hope they move forward with all due haste. Maybe Kimball's Castle will come back after all with increased regional activity.
|
11-02-2021, 09:18 PM | #23 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Quote:
|
|
11-03-2021, 04:39 AM | #24 |
Senior Member
|
Gunstock Mountain and Belknap County could maybe build a mountain hotel high up atop their mountain that is similar to the A.M.C. http://www.outdoors.org/destinations...ghland-center/ in Crawford Notch which is on the site of the old Crawford House hotel that burned down in 1977.
Only build it so there's NO road for cars going up there, and hotel guests need to hike up the Belknap-High Line trail with their suitcase...... yahhhh! ...
__________________
... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! Last edited by fatlazyless; 11-03-2021 at 05:18 AM. |
11-03-2021, 08:00 AM | #25 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Laconia NH
Posts: 5,547
Thanks: 3,162
Thanked 1,094 Times in 788 Posts
|
Alberg
The old Alberg Inn site across from Gunstock has quite the history.
https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...9dac3e089.html There was a rope tow on the site in the 40s and 50s http://www.nelsap.org/nh/arlberg.html I knew Karl and his son and daughter, Rick and Kristine. Wonderful family! Spent many an evening after skiing at the Alberg with Penny Pitou ski instructors. Many Austrians such as the Buttingers and Zimmermans. Around 2010, I assist a developer in factfinding for the property. He imagines the Hotel and a condo complex in the back, both retail and residential. The Gunstock delegates were all for it. The sticking point is sewer access. The town of Gilford refuses to extend the sewer line in front of Alpine Ridge road up the hill to the Alberg property. The developer's father was the one who built Gunstock Acres, Cherry Valley condominium and Pier 4 at the Weirs. The Gunstock Inn started back when WPA was building the Belknap Recreation area in the 30s. The barack as it was called housed the WPA workers. It even had a rope tow on the hill in the back. Eventually became the 'club house' for Gunstock Acres HOA.
__________________
Someday may never be an actual day. |
The Following User Says Thank You to BroadHopper For This Useful Post: | ||
mcdude (11-05-2021) |
11-04-2021, 08:34 PM | #26 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 991
Thanks: 256
Thanked 280 Times in 169 Posts
|
Gunstock expansion
Just one thing I don't understand about this. In some years Gunstock has suffered heavily from lack of snow, warm days, and rain. If I wanted to make money, as Gunstock says its motive for the expansion is, I wouldn't invest in an industry that relies totally on cold weather. Of course, Gunstock has expanded their year-round activities, but this expansion seems to be about skiing.
|
11-04-2021, 08:42 PM | #27 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Alton Bay
Posts: 5,578
Blog Entries: 2
Thanks: 2,427
Thanked 1,938 Times in 1,072 Posts
|
An earlier thread
Perhaps you missed an earlier thread on this subject. See the thread here:
https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums...ad.php?t=27566 Dave
__________________
I Live Here... I am always UPTHESAUKEE !!!! |
The Following User Says Thank You to upthesaukee For This Useful Post: | ||
trfour (11-04-2021) |
11-04-2021, 09:26 PM | #28 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
The ability to make snow changes the outcome.
Activities that rely on natural snowfall tend to suffer and those people go looking for something else to do. |
11-05-2021, 01:43 PM | #29 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 991
Thanks: 256
Thanked 280 Times in 169 Posts
|
Snow making depends on cold. The ski season is shrinking at both ends. UNH has done research on the impact of climate change on the ski industry, and it doesn't look good.
|
11-05-2021, 05:47 PM | #30 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Quote:
If I am reading it right, Gunstock's November 1st report is a base of 10-16"... I am only in Belmont, and can state for certain that our base is 0". |
|
11-05-2021, 07:08 PM | #31 |
Senior Member
|
..... bring back the rope tow!
Bring back the rope tow, tee bar, and Poma platter pull lifts.
All these new chair lifts that slow down to let you on and off are so incredibly boring and NO CHALLENGE to ride! While hanging on to a rope tow going up the steeps can be too strenuous for some, it made riding the tee bar seem like easy-peasy! Helloooo Gunstock ...... tear down those chairlifts and replace them with a vintage rope tow, tee bar and platter pull ....... just like 1965. Riding these old lifts up the hill was just as much fun and challenge as skiing down the slopes.
__________________
... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! |
11-11-2021, 01:15 PM | #32 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Saunders Bay
Posts: 99
Thanks: 130
Thanked 20 Times in 15 Posts
|
Petition - Belknap County Residents for Gunstock Ski Area
Gunstock Ski Areas is a vital part of Belknap County. It is a major employer and contributes to the local economy far beyond it's borders. It is vitally important that we do not open ourselves up to the possibility of the area being taken out of the hands of the people of Belknap County and sold to corporate entities who do not have our best interests in mind. We are asking all residents & taxpayers of Belknap County to please join us in our fight to save Gunstock Ski Area.
https://sign.moveon.org/petitions/be...s-for-gunstock |
The Following User Says Thank You to Winni P For This Useful Post: | ||
Winnigirl (11-11-2021) |
11-11-2021, 01:45 PM | #33 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Tuftonboro and Sudbury, MA
Posts: 2,309
Thanks: 1,211
Thanked 976 Times in 603 Posts
|
Quote:
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to FlyingScot For This Useful Post: | ||
DotRat (11-11-2021) |
11-11-2021, 03:24 PM | #34 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Saunders Bay
Posts: 99
Thanks: 130
Thanked 20 Times in 15 Posts
|
LDS Articles
Not sure why these are not coming up as links but here are a few articles from the LDS explaining the situation.
https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...QEv36Gnw_3_ZNk https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...a8d654e8f.html |
11-11-2021, 04:25 PM | #35 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Tuftonboro and Sudbury, MA
Posts: 2,309
Thanks: 1,211
Thanked 976 Times in 603 Posts
|
Whoa! I agree that Silber, Sylvia, and Ness are behaving terribly. Silber's definition of "cause" and Sylvia's definition of criminal are comical. Even funnier is the delegation's statement that Ness did nothing improper because his software was not purchased. Throw these bums out!
|
11-11-2021, 01:45 PM | #36 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,970
Thanks: 203
Thanked 621 Times in 416 Posts
|
Would those same jobs and community benefits you write of be still there if it was run by a private company? Just think of the taxes they would pay that are voided today
Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app |
11-11-2021, 07:09 PM | #37 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Quote:
The businesses that rent space on the land would pay taxes to the State as current business on the property does. The new land renter would pay to the County a rent... and that would need to be at least as large as the current payment to the County. |
|
12-06-2021, 09:48 AM | #38 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Alton Bay
Posts: 5,578
Blog Entries: 2
Thanks: 2,427
Thanked 1,938 Times in 1,072 Posts
|
From the Union Leader 12-6-2021
From today's Union Leader newspaper, 12-6-2021:
https://www.unionleader.com/news/bus...497f23466.html Dave And in case the link doesn't work: GILFORD — A plan that would significantly expand facilities at the Gunstock Mountain Resort got a warm response from a near capacity audience in the Base Lodge on Saturday that included Penny Pitou, the first American skier to win a medal in an Olympic downhill event. The turnout came on the heels of an equally well-attended Nov. 16 meeting of the Belknap County Delegation, at which the delegation was ostensibly poised to remove three of the five current members of the Gunstock Area Commission: Chair Brian Gallagher, Gary Kiedaisch and Rusty McLear. Earlier this year, the commissioners asked the delegation to unseat fellow Commissioner Peter Ness over allegations that Ness had an apparent conflict of interest in trying to sell Gunstock a software system his company had developed and because he was verbally abusive to employees. In a motion filed in Belknap County Superior Court for an emergency injunction to prevent their removal at the Nov. 16 meeting, Gallagher, Kiedaisch and McLear said the delegation’s effort to replace them was retaliation for their wanting to remove Ness. Judge James O’Neill III denied the motion, but scheduled a hearing on the matter for Dec. 23. Opened in 1937 as the Belknap Mountains Recreation Area, Gunstock is located on land owned by Belknap County and its operation is overseen by the Gunstock Area Commission, whose members are appointed — and can be removed — by the delegation. Made up of Belknap County’s 18 New Hampshire House of Representatives, the delegation is seemingly divided on whether to privatize Gunstock. Under the proposed master plan, Gunstock, among other improvements, would see an increase in skiable terrain; get a new lift and a toll road to the summit; and possibly have an on-slope restaurant and hotel. Tom Day, who is Gunstock’s president and general manager, said the vision being presented Saturday represented “a long-term project and a long-term investment” for the mountain. “We’re not going to go and do something we can’t pay for,” he stressed. Several speakers said the expansion proposed by the master plan would ease overcrowding while getting more people to the summit, which would be great for visitors and also for Gunstock’s bottom line. McLear, who developed the Inns at Mill Falls and Church Landing in Meredith, which he sold earlier this year, said the Gunstock Area Commission has ideas regarding a hotel at Gunstock. Gunstock is already “a great ski area,” McLear said, and the challenge is to “build the right kind of hotel” that would enhance it further. Asked if the hotel would generate money for Belknap County, Kiedaisch replied that “there would be a couple bites of the apple” including lease income that would go to the county and a percentage of the hotel’s revenue that would go to Gunstock itself.
__________________
I Live Here... I am always UPTHESAUKEE !!!! |
12-06-2021, 11:07 AM | #39 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,090
Thanks: 1,157
Thanked 2,011 Times in 1,239 Posts
|
Ummm...I've hiked Gunstock a few times and, like, it's not that big. Where will the "toll road" go, and how big a deal would a hotel at, what, 1,500 feet be? We're not talking about a Summit House or anything like that, right? What am I missing here?!
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk |
12-06-2021, 01:24 PM | #40 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,412
Thanks: 216
Thanked 782 Times in 464 Posts
|
Quote:
I am sure a hotel would be situated to have great views of the lake and help to make it more of a destination than a day trippers mountain. |
|
12-06-2021, 01:49 PM | #41 |
Senior Member
|
Despite being the only county owned ski area out of 3143 different counties in the 50-states, Gunstock has a lift ticket price of $96/day. Prime time NH ski ticket prices: Bretton Woods-$119, Loon-$115, Mount Sunapee-$114, Wildcat & Attitash- maybe $110(?), Waterville Valley-$110, Cannon-$99, Gunstock-$96 ...... Abenaki in Wolfeboro-season pass $50-resident/$125-non resident, no day tickets this season
Do you get what you pay for, and is it worth their high lift ticket price? ....... www.gunstock.com/explore/webcams/ ..... www.waterville.com/cams/ ...... www.loonmtn.com webcam, find it-bottom-ski & ride..... https://www.cannonmt.com/mountain/webcam-daily-photo ..... http://www.brettonwoods.com/Activiti...cams/live_cams ..... http://www.mountsunapee.com/the-moun...tain-cams.aspx ...... http://www.attitash.com/the-mountain...tain-cams.aspx ..... http://www.skiwildcat.com/the-mounta...tain-cams.aspx .... www.whaleback.com ... http://www.wolfeboronh.us/abenaki-sk...ki-area-videos ........ Is really something that the small, local Abenaki in Wolfeboro with an old 1950's style rope tow has the most happening video page by like a hundred times more happening than all the big-money areas, put together ...... ski the best at Abenaki! Last week I purchased an everything-everyday season pass for Gunstock and it only cost me $49 for the whole winter season. I know a super steal-of-a-deal when I see one, even though it has become somewhat normal now for NH ski areas to be at 33% open slope operation or LESS for the last week of the year, Christmas week ..... if they get LUCKY with a cold December blast of wintry weather! Do they reduce their Christmas week lift ticket prices, down by 66% ....... from $96 down to $32...... no, they do not. Something tells me this $49-everything Gunstock pass for age 70-79 will NO longer exist next year? ... The weather has become too WARM for making good snow in much of December! .... Gunstock already has winter camping for skiers skiing the mountain...... www.gunstock.com/camping/winter-camping/ ..... so, what the heck they need a hotel for? Cannon Mtn, owned by the State of NH, has winter camping for skiers skiing the mountain, too..... www.cannonmt.com/amenities/winter-camping-rvs ...... for $25/night with room for seven rv's, and Cannon is a real 4081'-high mountain as opposed to just a big hill like 2244' high Gunstock ....... and you never hear that Cannon wants to build its own hotel .... do you? ...... no, you don't!
__________________
... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! Last edited by fatlazyless; 12-24-2021 at 09:32 AM. |
12-06-2021, 02:09 PM | #42 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Tuftonboro and Sudbury, MA
Posts: 2,309
Thanks: 1,211
Thanked 976 Times in 603 Posts
|
Quote:
Poll for people who live an hour or more from Gunstock--can you see choosing Gunstock for a weekend instead of your current fave? |
|
12-06-2021, 02:22 PM | #43 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,090
Thanks: 1,157
Thanked 2,011 Times in 1,239 Posts
|
Quote:
Also, isn't "vertical drop" and "elevation gain" the same thing because Gunstock claims 1,340' vertical drop, but all the lit shows an elevation gain of 1,150'. I think Gunstock uses the lowest point of the parking lot/basin for that hooey. Like I said, I'm cool with doing stuff, but let's be realistic about what Gunstock is. Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk |
|
12-06-2021, 03:23 PM | #44 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Alton Bay
Posts: 5,578
Blog Entries: 2
Thanks: 2,427
Thanked 1,938 Times in 1,072 Posts
|
Year Round
Just remember that Gunstock is not just skiing, it is a year round resort.
Zip line to the bottom chairlift to the top. Just a thought Dave
__________________
I Live Here... I am always UPTHESAUKEE !!!! |
12-06-2021, 04:13 PM | #45 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,090
Thanks: 1,157
Thanked 2,011 Times in 1,239 Posts
|
Quote:
What do I know, though? The people involved are much smarter than I am with this stuff, so let's see how it goes! Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk |
|
12-06-2021, 05:36 PM | #46 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Alton Bay
Posts: 5,578
Blog Entries: 2
Thanks: 2,427
Thanked 1,938 Times in 1,072 Posts
|
Not all they have
Quote:
Dave
__________________
I Live Here... I am always UPTHESAUKEE !!!! |
|
The Following User Says Thank You to upthesaukee For This Useful Post: | ||
BroadHopper (12-07-2021) |
12-06-2021, 05:51 PM | #47 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
Drive past ?
I was skiing at Crotched Mountain shortly after it reopened. The happy parking lot attendant asked where people were from. Then ha said "Thanks for driving past X and Y to come here today." A new lodge, drssing areas, renta shop, etc and everybody happy even before they got close to the lifts. Skiers, like golfers, want to try out different terrain, views, and appreciate up to date facilities, rides from remote parking, good marketing, etc. Year round activity is also a plus. Small areas have not survived with out merging (Mittersill, Mt Rowe). Take a look on the web for "Lost NH Ski areas. Scores are closed. The commissioners who are looking at this are not inexperienced in the industry; such projects are multi-year. Look at the time line for The Balsams. Maybe somebody will make a second attempt at Kimball's Castle?
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Descant For This Useful Post: | ||
upthesaukee (12-06-2021) |
12-07-2021, 09:16 PM | #48 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 9 Posts
|
Quote:
Gunstock is unique, in that it is the only remaining ski area in Belknap County, and it can use the county's finances to keep it afloat in tough times. Growth is not always a winning proposition in the ski industry, particularly if the ski area takes on significant debt and prices itself out of its core market. In fact, the "build and they will come" mantra has led to many bankruptcies and closures in the ski industry. Over the years, examples of expansion-and-bankruptcy in the region include Tenney, Crotched, Temple, Ragged, and King Ridge. Other areas in the state have remained popular and viable without dramatically expanding their footprint, such as McIntyre, Pats Peak, and King Pine. |
|
12-07-2021, 09:53 PM | #49 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
Closures
Quote "Over the years, examples of expansion-and-bankruptcy in the region include Tenney, Crotched, Temple, Ragged, and King Ridge. Other areas in the state have remained popular and viable without dramatically expanding their footprint, such as McIntyre, Pats Peak, and King Pine."
Right, and some have reopened. (McIntyre, as a municipal park is different) In any event, many businesses operate under capitalized and somebody else takes over with a lower entry fee or better capitalization and becomes successful. It's a complex issue, but leasing Sunapee (low entry fee) and applying the income to Cannon appears to have been a success for both areas. New, aggressive management at both was a plus. |
12-08-2021, 07:04 AM | #50 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Laconia NH
Posts: 5,547
Thanks: 3,162
Thanked 1,094 Times in 788 Posts
|
Saddleback
Saddleback in Maine is at the leading edge of modern development. Many if not all ski resorts are looking to see how this works out. So far it is a winning combination of sustainability and social responsibility.
Arctaris Impact Investors is one I would trust if the County Delegates decides to sell the property, at the very least manage future development. The investors are a lot more socially responsible than the current management. https://www.yahoo.com/now/saddleback...162200148.html
__________________
Someday may never be an actual day. |
12-08-2021, 06:44 PM | #51 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Quote:
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to John Mercier For This Useful Post: | ||
Descant (12-08-2021) |
07-20-2022, 08:25 PM | #52 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 151
Thanks: 48
Thanked 61 Times in 35 Posts
|
Get your rock skis sharpened
Now that the new Gunstock Commission got their way and managed to get the entire Gunstock management team to resign, we can all look forward to the money we paid for our season passes to go towards paying for the Delegations legal fees that went 150% over budget.
|
07-20-2022, 09:31 PM | #53 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 151
Thanks: 48
Thanked 61 Times in 35 Posts
|
Get your rock skis sharpened
Now that the new Gunstock Commission got their way and managed to get the entire Gunstock management team to resign, we can all look forward to the money we paid for our season passes to go towards paying for the Delegations legal fees that went 150% over budget.
|
07-21-2022, 06:10 AM | #54 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Laconia NH
Posts: 5,547
Thanks: 3,162
Thanked 1,094 Times in 788 Posts
|
Preparing for a major shut down
With an experienced management team out of the way, I expect the Gunstock crew to be following suit. The Free staters will now have the opportunity to privatize the mountain. They can't sell the land as the land was deeded by the feds and that will be beyond the free staters unless they succeed in breaking NH away from the US.
The next step is the privatization of the County Home, Prison, and Sheriff dept.
__________________
Someday may never be an actual day. |
07-21-2022, 07:28 AM | #55 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Tuftonboro and Sudbury, MA
Posts: 2,309
Thanks: 1,211
Thanked 976 Times in 603 Posts
|
Ugh, but obviously not a surprise. When does the governor or some other group of responsible adults step in?
For those interested in stopping the commission before they do permanent damage--I was sent this website via email. I do not know these folks, but the whole thing is an important reminder that rational Republicans and rational Democrats have much more in common with each other than the extremists in either party https://www.citizensforbelknap.org/ |
The Following User Says Thank You to FlyingScot For This Useful Post: | ||
SailinAway (07-21-2022) |
07-21-2022, 10:35 AM | #56 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 991
Thanks: 256
Thanked 280 Times in 169 Posts
|
Thank you for posting an update on the Gunstock debacle. I've just contacted Citizens for Belknap to volunteer my services. My motive: to stop the Free State Project. They remind me of Putin in Ukraine---taking over an autonomous region because they can, without regard for the values of local residents. Review what happened recently in Croydon to understand that the Free State Project concerns us all.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/10/u...-politics.html |
07-21-2022, 10:49 AM | #57 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Sorry, I am an extremist on this issue.
I think we should privatize as much of the operation on that mountain that we can. I don't think any private group has ever offered to take over the alpine ski operation, or any of the trails. But retail, food, and accommodations should be as private as possible... supported by private investment, and paying a healthy rental fee to the mountain for the opportunity. I just don't think the delegation is really on board with that... |
07-21-2022, 11:41 AM | #58 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Tuftonboro and Sudbury, MA
Posts: 2,309
Thanks: 1,211
Thanked 976 Times in 603 Posts
|
Quote:
I agree there's a fair debate about public vs private, and that there may be certain deal structures that are better for both the town and the skiers. But don't you think Sylvia and Co are operating in bad faith? (the software, the legal fees, their treatment of highly qualified board members, the utter disregard for a competent management team) Do they really seem like the guys who are going to do what's best in general? We need skilled professionals figuring this out, not ideologues Last edited by FlyingScot; 07-21-2022 at 12:43 PM. |
|
07-21-2022, 12:42 PM | #59 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 32
Thanks: 7
Thanked 48 Times in 19 Posts
|
Governor Sununu sides with the Gunstock management team
He drafted an open letter to the Citizens of Belknap County, including calling for Sylvia, Silber, and Hough to be "removed from their positions and replaced with good people". Full letter attached. Good for the Governor to take this public stand to defend a jewel of Belknap County. True republicans like Sununu (an excellent Governor) should be just as irate at those responsible for this mess as independents and democrats. I know I am.
https://www.governor.nh.gov/sites/g/...p-gunstock.pdf |
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to TheVoiceOfReason For This Useful Post: | ||
07-21-2022, 03:19 PM | #60 |
Senior Member
|
Statement of Rep Norman Silber, Belknap 2: Gilford & Meredith
Statement of Norman Silber in response to resignation of Gunstock Mountain Resort management team
July 21, 3:30-pm, 2022 http://www.wmur.com/article/statemen...staff/40681060 This is so over my head that I have nothing intelligent to say, as usual, and leave that to anyone who knows what they are talking about? ..... How's about a downhill ski race between Rep Norman Silber and Gunstock guy, Tommy Day, and the winner becomes King of the Mountain! ...
__________________
... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! |
The Following User Says Thank You to fatlazyless For This Useful Post: | ||
Loub52 (07-21-2022) |
07-21-2022, 05:12 PM | #61 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Quote:
The delegation, each as an individual, is supposed to look out for the interests of the population within their districts. Though I have voted for Mike every time he has run... I am not feeling that he has my best interests at heart with his latest legislative endeavors. He hasn't taken the time or effort to lay out how more dollars going into a property that I am a stakeholder is bad for me. It is possible a defining reason exists... but he should earn my vote again by explaining that reasoning. |
|
07-22-2022, 01:46 AM | #62 |
Senior Member
|
There's a lot to read here ..... http://www.nhpr.org/nh-news/2022-07-...gns-commission .... from NHPR, New Hampshire's largest news organization.
All I will say is that downhill skiing is for people who are too lazy to go cross country skiing, or go winter hiking, and will pay $104 for a seven hour, 9am-4pm chair lift ride to get up the mountain. For $104 you can own an excellent pair of winter walking boots (Plymouth Ski & Sport) and a good warm pair of winter mittens (Rand's Hardware-Plymouth) and go walk a trail in the nearby https://belknaprangetrails.org/belknap-range-trail-map/ or up in the White Mountain National Forest that has good cross country skiing and hiking for $30/year with your car windshield parking sticker. Besides all that, an enclosed chairlift is a good place to catch a virus from another downhill skier as you sit there, protected from the wind, inside your enclosed bubble chairlift.
__________________
... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! Last edited by fatlazyless; 07-22-2022 at 08:08 AM. |
12-08-2021, 12:20 PM | #63 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 9 Posts
|
McIntyre is leased by a private operator.
Quote:
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to rocket21 For This Useful Post: | ||
I.C.Isles (07-20-2022) |
07-24-2022, 10:57 AM | #64 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
Is this right? The commissioners and management team were "forced out" and the area is closed? Now, refunds will be due, and revenues will be lost. Fall season passes will drop off or cease completely. The list goes on. If current delegation members (State Reps) are opposed in the September primary, that's your chance to nominate somebody else, and in November you can change the entire slate, or at least get rid of some of them. Unfortunately, the numerous websites that detail state rep voting records focus on state house votes, and tracking down how reps voted in their dual capacity as county delegates is harder to evaluate. I guess somebody would have to comb through the minutes of the County Executive Committee meetings.
|
07-24-2022, 12:32 PM | #65 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
I think the number of seats for each of the districts means that they will win their primaries.
Mike is being challenged by Travis. I like Travis... native born. And being younger, I see him more as the future of our area. I voted for them both in the last election... but they were in different districts. As an Independent, I have never voted in the primaries. I think it is up to the party to get its candidates and positions in order. So I can't honestly tell you which one will be the Republican candidate come November. |
07-24-2022, 01:18 PM | #66 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 9 Posts
|
Quote:
Prior to the closure, the ziplines were open Thursday-Monday. The Mountain Coaster was already closed for mechanical repairs. Special events are still proceeding as planned and the campground remains open. Ski season is 4+ months away. |
|
07-24-2022, 01:23 PM | #67 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
I think Descant meant the original commissioners... not the replacements brought in by this delegation.
Four months might seem a long way off... but I am working a lumber yard and already working on our winter plans and buys. Retail operations generally plan at least a season ahead. |
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to John Mercier For This Useful Post: | ||
07-24-2022, 02:02 PM | #68 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
Yes, plan ahead. A lot of ski passes are sold in the summer and early fall because of deep discounts that disappear as snowfall approaches. Gunstock, and others, are no longer just ski areas. Adventure parks, campgrounds, and other year round activities are the norm. Getting people on site regardless of ski conditions is important which is why so many places add townhouses, condo's hotels, etc. This is hospitality industry, no longer ski industry.
|
07-24-2022, 04:53 PM | #69 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 9 Posts
|
Quote:
Under prior management, they ran the summer attractions 7 days a week. Gunstock got by without them in 2020, and now they've been curtailed to Thursday-Monday, with some attractions being abandoned completely (Segways, E-Bikes, Water Wars, Summer Tubing, etc.). It's now basically the ziplines/treetop tour/mountain coaster. That's not to say that Gunstock should be a ghost town in the summer, but the millions of dollars in summer investments haven't necessarily been a profit center. |
|
07-24-2022, 05:14 PM | #70 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Were those investments from the county or private?
Privatizing items like that would be what I would suspect. |
07-24-2022, 05:26 PM | #71 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Ice in = CT / Ice out = Winnipesaukee
Posts: 459
Thanks: 123
Thanked 279 Times in 147 Posts
|
My family and I enjoyed an afternoon at Gunstock last fall...some hiking and the zip line. It was quite busy but not overwhelmingly so. A low-stress way to have some fun. We were thinking of doing the zip line again later this summer but with everything I'm reading here, I'm putting the kibosh on that. Why?
Safety. I felt safe last fall, but I'm not so sure now. You don't lose a lot of key leaders at once and expect the experience to be the same as before. While you'd hope safety would be the last thing to be compromised, I'm not putting myself one hundred feet in the air unless I feel reasonably secure about doing so. As of now, I don't. |
07-25-2022, 05:08 PM | #72 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 151
Thanks: 48
Thanked 61 Times in 35 Posts
|
This Tue. July 26th, at 10am the GAC will be meeting to discus whatever…meanwhile 7 senior managers, 3 department managers and some others have resigned. The mountain remains closed and not one public statement has been put out what the GAC plan is and when Gunstock will reopen. When will they get it, no one wants to work for the current GAC “leadership”. Time for Ness and Strang to go to back writing wills and handing out aspirins and let qualified people run a profitable business.
|
07-25-2022, 05:42 PM | #73 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
Quote:
|
|
07-25-2022, 09:29 PM | #74 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
I doubt that is going to happen the current GAC was put in place by the delegation.
|
07-25-2022, 11:11 PM | #76 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2021
Posts: 3,186
Thanks: 2
Thanked 565 Times in 463 Posts
|
Opposed yes. But the number of seats in each of their districts suggests that they have a very good chance of reelection.
Personally, I would just like to know what the long term game plan is. If operations are totally taken by a private company... what is the purpose of the GAC... and would any private company be willing to invest the time and resources under that construct? |
07-26-2022, 05:20 AM | #77 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 9 Posts
|
Quote:
|
|
07-26-2022, 05:52 AM | #78 |
Senior Member
|
Hey y'all ..... just look-ee here .... this latest Gunstock bru-ha-ha done made it into www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunstock_Mountain_Resort ...... where it says ....
"On the night of July 20, 2022, the entirety of the resort's management team resigned due to overreach by thr Gunstock Area Commission after members of the commission tried to take a "larger stake of control" over the daily operations of the resort along with accusations of disrespecting the resort's staff. The following day, the resort closed "until further notice". Seems that Gunstock would be a nice spot to build a gambling casino run by the NH-Lottery with all profits, after expenses, going to fund local NH public schools. This would be a year 'round activity, gambling, and attached eating and entertainment, in all 12-months and daily weather. And, you can bet it would be a busy happening place-to-go ..... long time home of the Belknap Indian Lost Nation tribe ...... ugh! ...... to that! ...... holy cow-a-bunga! ..... such a stupendous suggestion! ....
__________________
... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! |
07-26-2022, 03:48 PM | #79 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Merrimack and Welch Island
Posts: 4,189
Thanks: 1,275
Thanked 1,568 Times in 1,018 Posts
|
WMUR reported at 4:00 pm that resignations were requested from Strang and Ness, who then walked out of the meeting. No indication at that time of a response. It appears from the WMUR vignette that management will return if Strang and Ness are gone. We shall see.
|
07-27-2022, 06:19 AM | #80 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Lakes Region
Posts: 148
Thanks: 131
Thanked 27 Times in 21 Posts
|
That is correct. I was there at Gunstock yesterday. 300 residents and employees on hand. Two of the commissioners and the crowd urged Strang and Ness to resign which would lead Gunstock management to come back. They didn’t sign resignation papers they were handed, and eventually they both walked out prior to the meeting being formally adjourned or listening to public comment. Here’s a recap.
https://www.wmur.com/article/gunstoc...eting/40723461 Last edited by Leoskeys; 07-27-2022 at 12:03 PM. |
08-02-2022, 06:56 AM | #81 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Gilford, NH and Florida
Posts: 2,949
Thanks: 667
Thanked 2,177 Times in 914 Posts
|
Changes are happening
Monday night meeting. Gunstock opens.
Strang resigns. New Commissioner Denise Conroy sworn in. https://www.wmur.com/article/new-gun...-8122/40776657 |
The Following User Says Thank You to TiltonBB For This Useful Post: | ||
Biggd (08-02-2022) |
08-02-2022, 09:41 AM | #82 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Moultonboro, NH
Posts: 2,896
Thanks: 469
Thanked 682 Times in 380 Posts
|
Now the question of what happens with this oft mentioned audit that will embarrass everyone. I suspect it disappears.
|
08-02-2022, 10:48 AM | #83 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Tuftonboro and Sudbury, MA
Posts: 2,309
Thanks: 1,211
Thanked 976 Times in 603 Posts
|
We haven not heard any evidence or even credible assertions that an audit will embarrass the management team. Let's all just breathe a sigh of relief that the lunacy appears to be over, at least for now
|
08-03-2022, 05:10 PM | #84 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 231
Thanks: 75
Thanked 142 Times in 79 Posts
|
Stowe expansion 1990
From Gary Kaidasch April 1990
He said there are no plans for real-estate or condominium developments on the mountain. “We’ve seen the sins of those ways,” he said. He said the company is committed to running the mountain based on its services, namely skiing. |
07-25-2022, 09:32 PM | #85 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: the left coast (Portland)and West Alton
Posts: 1,361
Thanks: 63
Thanked 245 Times in 166 Posts
|
Sort of "a spider on the wall" as to this issue, but all I can say is "Wow: you asked for it, you got it."
When you vote idiots into office they do idiotic things.
__________________
basking in the benign indifference of the universe |
07-27-2022, 07:26 AM | #86 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,090
Thanks: 1,157
Thanked 2,011 Times in 1,239 Posts
|
I just spent the last half hour trying to figure this thing out, and, man, what a mess.
Sent from my SM-G990U1 using Tapatalk |
Bookmarks |
|
|