Food poisoning story

[SAMIAM]

Two years ago I was at work and someone knocked on my office door.It was a very angry man who said that he and his wife ate in my restaurant a week before and started throwing up blood before they got home.Both went to the hospital and had not worked since.He told me that he'd been advised to see a lawyer but decided to see me first because I would want to make things right for hospital expenses and lost work.I told him I was floored by that....first time in 30 years that this had happened.I also told him that we are well insured and that if we,in fact ,had had made them sick that I would leave no stone unturned to make things right.
I checked his slip and they both had a beef pot pie special,37 were sold that night and 5 employees had them as their meal on break.No one got ill and the night manager reported that they were all made fresh that day and temped going out at 150 degrees.
I contacted my insurance agent at the Foss agency in Moultonborough and he checked with LRGH and found that they had not been there,as he said.He then ran a check on them and found out that they didn't miss work.....because they were both unemployed.
Don't need to tell you what I told him when he came back to see me.
I was just thinking what would have happened if he had gone on the forum with his story before I had a chance to check it out.

[chipj29]

You would be surprised how often that scam is pulled. Many years ago when I started my career as a young restaurant manager, I got a phone call with a similar story. Eager to please the customer, as well as the boss, I did what it took to get the guy and his family to come back. Well doing what it took costed the restaurant upwards of $100. Come to find out that this guy had pulled this scam at many restaurants in the area. Call me sucker...but it never happened again.

[JDeere]

And the point of this thread is?

Oh....I get it all dinners are scam artists and the restaurants are always clean and correct.

I got news for you...I worked in the food industry for 7 years and what goes on behind closed doors is disgusting. Amazing more folks do not get sick.

[twoplustwo]

SIA can ***** your seven years (heck, I can ***** them) and is well aware there are bad restaurants as well as bad diners. More than one perspective is a good thing in food and in life.

Why the anger? A little Post Traumatic Restaurant Syndrome? There are treatments available for that...

[JDeere]

It was a simple question. What was the point of the post? My read was that all restaurants are good and any dinner that has a bad experience is the person in the wrong.

Seems anytime that someone posts a negative review of a restaurant in the Lakes region there is a cadre of folks that will defend the restaurant regardless of the story.

[Argie's Wife]

Seems to me that the "negative" threads just evaporate...

Maybe we should consider that if a restaurant isn't mentioned at all on the forum that it means it's not good?

I often refer people (locals) to this site when they ask me what's new and what's recommended in the area...

Maybe I need to throw in a disclaimer: "Restaurants NOT mentioned on this forum can be considered not good because if anything negative happened, no one will even know."

[twoplustwo]

The restaraunt where I work got the crap kicked out of it on this forum a few months back, those posts certainly haven't evaporated. Neither have quite a handful of negative reviews posted in the past six weeks on this forum.

SIA recounted a story that happened to him that relates to a recent negative review, it's point made sense to me and is contained in the last sentence of his post. What was a scam could have been very damaging to his business; a recent scathing review of the Lobster Pound had people talking bad milk, food poisoning, and health dept when the owner's reply shed a lot of light on what actually happened, but not before damage was done.

No matter how many times I read SIA's post, I don't see "... all restaurants are good and any dinner (sic) that has a bad experience is the person in the wrong." anywhere in it. I see one guy recounting one story that applies to recent posts in this forum. That broad brush you're putting in his hand seems to fit in yours.

[SAMIAM]

JDeere,the point of the post was......know what you are talking about before you trash someone's livelihood.Go right to the ER for a test....if it comes back positive,absolutely.....report it.Some of those illness' have several days incubating ,so you could get sick leaving a restaurant on friday after contacting it much earlier in the week.I'm not saying all restaurants are good but I do disagree with your comment about what goes on behind closed doors.Every restaurant must have a person on duty who is Safe Serve certified......Board of Health inspections are very tough.
Of all the stories I have heard on this forum and elsewhere about people getting sick at a restaurant in this area , not one has been confirmed by a doctor.

[NightWing]

I had an experience a few years ago that I won't call food poisoning, but I will call it a food related event.

I won't mention the name or the town of the establishment, other than it was a fast food chain.

I stopped in to get a serving of my favorite soup, cream of broccoli cheddar. Sometimes they ran out, so I asked if any was available. The counter person said he would check and I watched him lift the lid, tip the container on its side and proclaim, "Yeah, I can get a bowl out of here." I could see that the stainless steel container had a build up of dried soup about an inch or so thick all around the rim. However, I was really hungry and thought it must be like this all the time. Besides, the massive sign outside indicated a popular chain that wouldn't sell something that wasn't good.

The young man ladled out my soup and put the bowl on my tray. It smelled soooooooooo good. I asked for crackers and a soda and paid for my order. As I was taking my tray away from the counter, I heard the manager yell to the kid to throw the rest away because it had been in and out of the cooler and reheated enough.

Dumb and dumber..................I ate the soup, thinking how lucky I was to get the last serving. I took the tray back and left to continue my drive home, about 70 miles.

It was less than an hour before my stomach started doing flip flops. I started to sweat, had violent cramps and had to stop at the side of the road for a Technicolor yawn. Over and over. I almost passed out. I finally made it back to my vehicle and continued the drive home. My insides hurt like hell and I was afraid it would start again. I made it home, had another episode and, by then, I was so cramped up, I couldn't stand. I was actually scared about what was happening to me. I went to bed and slept halfway into the next day. When I woke up, I was OK and the sweating had stopped. I was weak and really reluctant to eat anything, so I drank a little tea and laid low that night.

Food poisoning? I didn't seek medical attention, so I can't be 100% sure. I will say that my last bowl of cream of broccoli cheddar soup did not agree with my body and that WAS my LAST bowl, ever.

I didn't visit or call the place to complain or anything. I just chalked it up to one of those rare events that can happen with any food if it isn't handled properly.

[jeffk]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

JDeere,the point of the post was......know what you are talking about before you trash someone's livelihood.Go right to the ER for a test....if it comes back positive,absolutely.....report it.Some of those illness' have several days incubating ,so you could get sick leaving a restaurant on friday after contacting it much earlier in the week.I'm not saying all restaurants are good but I do disagree with your comment about what goes on behind closed doors.Every restaurant must have a person on duty who is Safe Serve certified......Board of Health inspections are very tough.
Of all the stories I have heard on this forum and elsewhere about people getting sick at a restaurant in this area , not one has been confirmed by a doctor.

... it's not that straightforward.

I am not a doctor, and would guess most others on the forum are not either, so what I say is culled from reading, not expertise.

Food poisoning symptoms can develop in minutes or days later based on the type and amount of the contaminant, and your personal susceptibility. In addition, there are several infectious diseases that produce similar symptoms.

For most forms of food poisoning the treatment is time, i.e. the patient recovers on their own. Most people probably feel better shortly and never get treatment.

This all seems to me to be a mess as to what you may have eaten, when, and where. The toxic sandwich you are 2 days ago could cause symptoms right after your lunch today. Even diagnostic tests could only show that, indeed, you have food poisoning but where and when you got it are speculative; usually determined via investigations and other people reporting symptoms. Then the source is isolated. This is only done for serious, multiple victim incidents because it is simply too resource intensive to do.

So to demand real "proof" of food poisoning seems to raise the bar to the point that most incidents, real or not, would NOT be identified.

So what should be done? If someone suspects they may have food poisoning from eating out they should tell the restaurant owner. The owner should review his store of the foods that were eaten. If he suspects a problem he should dispose of the food, report it, and apologize to the diners. The owner should recognize that when someone is struggling with physical illness that they are not going to be too receptive to someone trying to explain that it may not be the restaurant's fault. This is not particularly fair to the restaurant owner but would seem to come with the territory.

In the recent case at the Lobster Pound, as best we can be sure, it seems the owners tried to do the right thing. Unfortunately, with two kids vomiting in the car, it seems the Dad was a bit frazzled and tempers flared. Maybe the owners were too busy defending themselves to offer the sympathy needed. Maybe the Dad was too angry to listen to reason.

WE will never really know.

I understand that bashing someone's business without proof is painful and damaging. About the only thing that can be done is to offer a counter explanation and hope that people will understand. This is what the owners did and from most of the responses the people on this forum had a reasonable response.

I think that's about as good as it's going to get.

[Newbiesaukee]

In this day and age, we are all aware of scams that people pull. Additionally, food poisoning, as was pointed out, comes in all shapes and sizes. Most food poisoning is self-limited and requires no care. Even when it occurs it can be difficult to prove. Yes, one should notify the restaurant and the restaurant should be grateful for the information. Unfortunately, some restaurant managers can be defensive in this situation and, as SAMIAM pointed out, there is some justification for caution.

The point is, it really isn't as simple as it should be and that is the shame.

Nightwing's symptoms are exactly what one sees in staph food poisoning which is caused by a "toxin" produced by the staph germ. It doesn't prove it, but it is highly suggestive. I had staph poisoning once in a 5 star hotel which initially denied it could have happened, then offered me a free meal which I did not accept. All I really wanted to do was to notify them. I was not looking for compensation of any kind. And I was staying in the hotel. Of course, not in NH.

We should be careful with negative comments, particularly when reputations are at stake. But we should all be free to make negative comments if we are very clear of the point we wish to make.

[JDeere]

I have had the "pleasure" of having food poisoning a few times. The attacks at both ends of the body make it impossible to get to a doc and what would the point be? To confirm what?

My objection to the Samiam post is his constant defense of any negative criticism toward a restaurant. This section of the forum is for people to praise, criticize or whatever.

I said I worked in the food industry and I saw the kitchens of 100+++ restaurants as well as food manufacturers and although some were clean I would not say that was anywhere close to the rule. If the guy said he got sick then I would tend to believe him....and not think it a scam for a free dinner.

[SteveA]

To me,as a "traveling salesman" for more than 30 years, it seems that food poisioning is rare. I'll bet I have eaten 9,000 meals in hotels, fast foods, chains and "fancy" places.
The math on the 9,000 is conservative. 30 years X 150 days per year X 2 meals per day. I can recall only 3 times I really believe it was "something I ate" that had me over the bowl in the hotel. ( and one of the three was after a meal with customers in a Texas BBQ place that the receipt told me our group of 4 had 16 Lone Stars, and a few shots of something with a worm in the bottom of the bottle)

I posit that the industry is very aware of food safety. This is an interesting link.

http://www.restaurant.org/foodsafety..._pathogens.cfm

I suspect that at any given time the number of people that go to restaurants already sick, aren't any different than the number of people and kids that go to work or school already sick.

Maybe Occam's Razor has it right. Lot's of people that claim food sickness from the last meal they ate, maybe were sick when they ate it?

Occam's Razor
one should not increase, beyond what is necessary, the number of entities required to explain anything

http://pespmc1.vub.ac.be/occamraz.html (complete web entry)

[JDeere]

Maybe.................but when everyone who ate the same thing gets sick I am thinking it is Food P.

I also think that different folks have different tolerance levels.

PS: The links do provide useful info.

[sa meredith]

SteveA...in a million years, I never thought I would find a reference to Occam's Razor in this forum....very nice, Sir. Bravo! I might also add, I find the reference quite appropriate/ applicable to the topic.
For some reason, it is one of the few things I learned in college that stuck.
I believe a very simple meaning is "the most obvious answer to a perplexing situation is usually the correct answer". Don't worry about all the extra stuff "Shave (as in razor) it off.
Anyway...along those same lines, I offer this story from Friday afternoon/night.
As a disclosure, I wish to state ahead of time, I did not captain the boat, and did not drive any motor vehicle that day...
Started out docked in Meredith Bay for breakfast, and then back to boat for 2 Bloody Mary's. Later took a nice boat ride over to Wolfeboro , a bit of shopping, then the Upper Deck for lunch, and several Captain and Cokes. Left there, took a cruise over to the Weirs, Crazy Gringo for a Margarita or 2..very nice.
And lastly, put boat away in Paugus Bay, and stopped at TBones for early dinner, and a cocktail or two more.
Soooooo....Saturday morning I felt like I had been run over by several trucks, and swallowed a hand full of cotton. I mean, just plain sick!
Now, apply Occam's Razor to this story...All the drinks had ice. Clearly I had some bad reaction to too many ice cubes.
Or perhaps one of the restaurants served me a bad one?

[SAMIAM]

Good point STEVEA....and a word to JDeere....I have seen many of your posts and have found them to be thoughtful and articulate........I never meant to suggest that we shouldn't critique restaurants.....just saying that something as serious as food poisoning should be verified because it is so damaging. Think about the recent salmonella scare with tomatoes all accross the country.Many small producers were put out of business only to find out that it was jalepeno's from Mexico.

[jeffk]

Originally Posted by sa meredith

...
Now, apply Occam's Razor to this story...All the drinks had ice. Clearly I had some bad reaction to too many ice cubes.
Or perhaps one of the restaurants served me a bad one?

I'm sure you had ice in your drinks all day long without ill effects.

It's obvious what you are having a bad reaction to is ...........

SLEEP!

Party all night long.

[Rose]

Originally Posted by JDeere

I worked in the food industry for 7 years and what goes on behind closed doors is disgusting. Amazing more folks do not get sick.

It doesn't even have to be behind closed doors. A co-worker and I decided to go to Johnny Rockets one day for lunch. We got there before the doors opened, but we could see some of the employees setting up. I saw one guy in the grill area stick his finger up his nose. Needless to say, we left and since then I call the restaurant Johnny Snot Rockets.

[Newbiesaukee]

Food poisoning is not rare. The CDC estimates 76 million cases a year in the US.Lots of references, but this is one: http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/artic/...ness_niddk.htm

[Argie's Wife]

So, it sounds like the owners of the Lobster Pound came online to give their side of the story, no?

I just read it and it seems they acted appropriately. They apologized, offered to assist the customer (which he refused), and checked their food storage and freshness. We can speculate on the cause of the children's illness until the cows come home but assuming the family didn't go to the ER or walk-in clinic to get a diagnosis/treatment, then it's all just guesses...

As far as the motives of the dad who posted here goes... he doesn't seem to be looking for money or anything more than telling us his side of the story and what happened to his children. I won't argue with anyone who is giving a personal account of something and try to convince them otherwise but his response to the owner's offer to help was... well... a little over the top.

Hats off to the owner for stepping up and explaining his side of the story... I hope the mods leave that thread up or lock it so that others who visit here infrequently can read it for themselves.

[hilltopper]

It's in another thread. Look for a post by user "mike ray".

http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/...4&postcount=74