Handicap docks in wolfeboro...
 

No open spots except the Handicap Dock ......

I read this as the Handicap Dock remained as an official, legal HP Dock? Is this correct? I know there was a stir over this a couple of years ago. Thanks for any replies.

Stevie

Handicap docks in wolfeboro...
 

Nothing's really changed. The outside of the right hand dock looking in has blue paint on the posts and the sign says Handicap Parking. Per Dmv you can't use a handicap placard other than in a car and there is nothing for boating.

I did send two emails asking for clarification to Wolfeboro Town Hall and never got a response. Not wanting to get in a fight over a ticket, if there are not docking available, we will wait a short period of time and then leave to spend our money elsewhere.

I need to use a handicapped dock I think this is a great idea,I have never seen one before.Their has been times when we have had to wait for a wider dock because they are all around 2 feet wide and a wheelchair won't fit on it.Also I have used a placard for my snowmobile and my motorcycle and never had a problem with law enforcement, I am more worried about someone stealing it. For a car parking lot 10% of all spaces should be designated for handicapped parking and their is never enough because they hand out placards to anyone now a days!

I agree that handicap parking is a must. However, Wolfeboro went overboard designating a whole side of a dock to handicap boaters. I can't recall the last time I saw a handicap boater at the town docks. Plus, there is no way to get a wheelchair off that dock into a boat. There is a guy who is a real zealot about handicap rights in Wolfeboro and he spearheaded this effort. Again, I am fully supportive of handicap folks and I would be the first to give up my spot to someone in need but the allocation of a whole side of a dock that doesn't get used for weeks is stupid.

That is an outrage and is totally unacceptable. I hope you latch on to their leg like a pit bull and don't let go until one of the spineless drones actually has the integrity and fortitude to give you a clear, respectful answer. I'm sick of these local town politicians that think they are kings in a kingdom and treat the residents like 2nd class citizens. Furthermore, the local businesses (who are the victims of the fact that you took your $$ to another town) should also be outraged and demand action! :fire:

You can use your car handicap placard for boats.

This is Wolfeboro's Town Ordinance about the Dock:

Q. No boats, as defined in RSA 270:2, shall be docked in that area of the Town docks designed as accessible docking (handicap docking), unless such boat displays a windshield placard issued under RSA 261:88 or displays the international symbol of access. Docking spaces designed as accessible (handicap) shall be marked in accordance with the provisions of RSA 265:73-a by affixing signs to posts, docks or other areas so as to be clearly visible to anyone approaching the area by boat.
[Added 6-11-2008]

(1) The accessible (handicap) docking area shall be utilized only if a person with a disability is being transported in or is operating a boat to or from the docking area.

(2) The same time limit restrictions will apply to accessible (handicap) spaces as stated in Subsection L above.

(3) Any person convicted under this subsection shall be fined not less than $250.

http://www.ecode360.com/WO1661

Added the below comment:

E-mail Dave Owen (Town Manager) wolftwnmgr@metrocast.net about any concerns that you have with the Town Docks and he will give you all the info that you need or will guide you in the direction that would get your answer. I would be very surprised if he didn't respond.

With regards to public docks in general, the local business people need to drive their rules and use. They are paying taxes to pay for their construction and maintenance. The sole purpose of these docks is commerce. They want tourists to visit and spend money.

I go to the Weirs beach docks because they are the least crowded. Are they less crowded because they are crappy or because the destinations at the Weirs are less desirable? A little chicken and egg going on there, but that applies to the Weirs in general.

I would visit Meredith and Wolfeboro more if they had more docks but one more dock wouldn't really make a difference. They either need a ton more docks or better management of their existing docks.

It could be that adding more boats will not offset the cost of increasing the number of boats.

What does this mean? There is stairs? Big deal if there is, might be harder for someone in a power chair but I go up and down stairs all the time.

I also wheel right on my pontoon without any assistance.

Most people will wholeheartedly support special access for someone disabled. I think the rub in Wolfeboro is there is no difference between any of the docks. For something to be designated handicapped you would expect to see some type of aid for that person. IE: Ramp, Lift, closer proximity etc. but I am pretty sure all the docks in Wolfeboro are alike.

Wolfeboro Handicapped dock
 

We were in Wolfeboro a couple weeks ago on a weekend, and of course all the dock space was taken and there were a couple boats waiting. When our turn came up, my wife noticed that some of the posts on the handicapped dock were not painted with the blue paint that generally indicates a handicap spot. There are 4 or 5 posts at the beginning of the dock that are unmarked. We docked there for a couple hours to have breakfast. My wife has a knee replacement, a hip replacement and a valid Handicap placard, but obviously, we didn't have it with us.
The real question is, is this non marked open space a legal non handicapped docking space?

I don't know if that is a legal place to dock or not but remember:

...Any person convicted under this subsection shall be fined not less than $250...

So it won't be cheap to find out. I guess you could take time out from work and fight the ticket.

Me, I'll just shop elsewhere. Too bad a couple of nice restaurants in Wolfeboro and we love Black's.

No open spots except the Handicap Dock .......
 

I didn't mean to get people upset. I am a handicap person with severe respiratory illness and often need help. I can walk but only very short distances before having to rest. Ordinarily, a handicap spot is closest to a building or some access point.

I thought the handicap dock would have been closer to the parking lot / street area. If having the last dock designated as handicap access in order to accommodate a wheel chair, power scooter, etc., then I think it's worth it.

Stevie

You certainly aren't getting anyone upset. The frustration is seeing a whole dock unused for days on end. I think that a good solution to this problem would be to give handicapped boaters a special flag. Lets say a big white flag with a blue handicapped logo attached to a 3 foot pole. When a handicapped boater came into dock at a public area he or she would raise the flag and by doing so his/her boat would move to the front of the line for docking. This way the handicapped boater would always be granted immediate access to the docks but when there were no handicapped boaters all of the docks could be fully utilized. There has to be a better way to maximize this resource.

Why can't handicapped people wait like everyone else? I was under the impression handicapped parking was for easy access, not immediate access.

I don't disagree with your concept. I have thought of this as well. My suggestion was an attempt to find a middle of the road compromise. As stated in a prior post of mine, there is a crazy person in Wolfeboro who is over the top about handicapped rights and he is the reason for this mess. I think 99% of the folks on this site would do everything in their power to help someone with a handicap but most of us are also frustrated with a resource that goes unused for days on end. This fellow is an extremist and I think his actions in general are counterproductive.

Does this mean if the spots at Market Basket are not being used we should let others use them?

That is just ridiculous raising a flag. Why don't we just wheel around in a big clown suit as well.

I have never seen them before but agree something could be done, waving a flag is not the answer.

I have no problem with waiting like everyone else but if there are only 5 handicap spots and 100 regular spots, which line should I wait in? When I attend a sporting event I don't wait in the line to use the urinals I wait in the line for the handicap stall.

I don't understand your point, or the point in Wolfeboro. My understanding of handicap parking (as it is in vehicle parking lots) is to enable people with physical problems to park as close to the building or destination as possible. That certainly makes it easier for those with mobility issues.

Waving a flag to get the next available dock does not solve any access problem for the physically handicapped. All it does is move them ahead of other boaters who may be waiting for their turn to dock.

The blue docks in Wolfeboro that are the furthest docks away from the downtown, and area businesses, do not solve any access problems for the handicapped either. If the "rocket scientists" in Wolfeboro designed mall parking layouts they would put the handicapped parking on the side of the parking lot as far away from the building as possible.

Both "feel good" solutions do not accomplish any purpose relative to easing the access for the handicapped.

Very well said.

It appears that there was no thought put into how a handicap person was going to use these spaces.
IMO there should be more effort into designing boats for handicap people. Have ramps and lifts on boats that could be used by parking your boat at a ramp that was designed for these boats. It would be an expensive undertaking but at least it might be safer and make more sense then just leaving a section of a dock empty all summer like the ones in Wolfeboro.

My wife and I have gone to Wolfboro many times this season and have asked this questions many times. Now let me point out that I am a Physical Therapist and help many people daily. A couple points that I asked myself and on this post:
1)You can't compare the handicap parking spots at Market Basket to the docks. As pointed out, all the docks are exactly the same, they all are flat to the land, no steps. The spots at MB are located the closest spots to the doors (or at least as close as they can make them).
2) The comment "why can't the handicap people wait"? I think that goes into the point that all the docks are the same. The handicap spot at the docks are the furthest away from anything. So for the person with the respitory issue, these docks are worse for them.
3) I've been at the docks a few times this summer. Each time (except Sunday of Labor Day weekend) I've waited like most people. There has always been at least one boat at the handicap spot. Never saw any type of tag. And a Marine Patrol boat came and docked on the other side of the boat and didn't do anything.

So I guess I don't have any point, just a little observing that I have made. But as a PT I am a little confused about the dock space. I'm not saying there should note be handicap spots!!!!! I'm just confused of the location and the equality of all the spots.

Good grief! The AMC built a hut at the top of one of the Presidentals at huge extra cost to comply. As far as I know a group got their wheel chair bound buddy up there. Give the handicapped a break.

I was merely pointing out you would not park in a handicap spot in the middle of the week at Market Basket if their was availability.The spots at Market Basket are also out front so you don't get run over!!

I see cars parked at handicap spaces without a placard. Also found a few in the handicap access areas, one with a handicap placard. Fine for either is $250. Those I photo graph and send to local police departments. As to dock space, don't know too many on wheelchairs that boat, but if they do, it would be nice to insure a level transition from boat to dock.

I was responding to a proposal that handicapped boaters be given a flag that immediately lets them cut in line to get the next available dock space. I have no problem with reserved handicapped accessible dock space that's a convenient as possible to attractions on shore. I think the idea is great and would gladly vote for it.

I think what Wolfeboro did is absurd. The docks they choose to paint blue and reserve are the furthest from attractions and offer absolutely no accessibility advantage over any other dock that's there. It's like reserving the furthest parking spots from the grocery store door for handicapped parking and not making them any wider than normal

I recommend that you wait in whatever line will get you relief the quickest and easiest.

While on this subject...
 

I've often wondered why the handicapped parking spaces on Elm Street in Manchester do not have to pay for parking, while all other spaces do have to pay? I understand that people with handicapped placards or plates have "physical" conditions that warrant the handicapped status, but why do they also get financial privileges as well? Can someone explain? (Not looking for a fight, just asking a question)

Cars with handicap plates or placards can park free at parking meters also. Federal law. Guess its because the handicap space may already be taken.

Please post the Federal Law that says that.

Thank You

This is governed by state, not federal law.

State, Federal, city, town, does it really matter. The politicians make the rules for all of us to follow.

And that makes it right?

Common sense
 

I think the point here is that the way Wolfeboro has implemented their handicapped boat parking has resulted in nothing more than reserved parking for folks with a handicap placard.

Ease of access for handicapped persons hasn't been improved in any way. The problems of loading and unloading are in no way eased by signs or blue painted pilings on an otherwise identical dock.

It seems to me that common sense has once again been sacrificed at the altar of political correctness, in the temple of "See, I care more than you do."

answer for Rusty
 

Rusty If you wade through the Americans with Disabilities Act there may be some info for you there. Unless you or someone close to you has a disability, then you can not appreciate the convenience of automatic doors. Try and go to a McDonalds in a wheel chair, alone. Or try to enter any restroom, with their heavy doors, even with a walker. And if that isn't bad enough, try it with someone who is legally blind.
my 5 cents worth.

Thanks RailroadJoe.

I think that all American citizens (and that includes politicians)want to help make adjustments for people with physical or mental disabilities.
We have a long way to go but I think in most cases we are all trying to do what we think is appropriate.
To the boater who can't find a spot at the Wolfeboro Docks this might not appear to be true. But if you sat in the seat of the Wolfeboro Board of Selectmen while this issue was be proposed, I wonder what we might have done different. Your damned if you do and damned if you don't.

They should have some kind of manual hoist or bar hook at the handicap dock to assist with getting someone in a wheel chair in and out of a boat. They have one of these at the Glendale docks and it does not look very expensive and would be a good thing to add to make it a REAL handicap assistance dock.

Dan

I have not seen the "Handicap Hoist" referred to at the Glendaale docks so I can't offer an opinion as to it's functionality.

Wheelchair vans are common enough and seem to work fine..Owned and Operated by the owner of the van, who has been instructed as to how to use that particular device. On rare occasions I have seen them in use. Each one is tailored to the persons particular challenge.

I would think such a generic (one size fits all) device "Owned" by the town would pose a real liability risk to the town, if say the private individual in a wheelchair was accidentally dropped into the lake...whether through operator error, mechanical malfunction, or just plain bad luck. :look: NB

PS: It's not like you are transfering a person in a wheelchair from an stationary van to a solid parking lot. Small boats have a nasty and oftentimes unpredictable habit of Moving when weight is transferred around.

Very true. The individual who led the charge for handicapped docking played the "handicap card". It is very similar to having someone playing the "race card".

A the Glendale dock there is the base for a Hoyer lift. These lifts are routinely used to lift wheelchair bound people. The actual lift is not visible at the dock.

There was an article in the local paper about this a few years back.

Hoyer Lift: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoyer_lift

Check Legal Issues at the end of the article. NB

The accessible dock space was one of the many requirements in a lawsuit brought against the Town of Wolfeboro by a citizen through (the only avenue for lawsuits on accessibility issues) the Federal Department of Justice. There was no option but to have a space properly designated per ADA standards (good, bad or ugly). The selectmen, citizens and businesses had no leeway or say in the matter.

Handicap docks in Wolfeboro...
 

"Heaven" is correct, and I might ask a question that I have heard others ask, "Just exactly how did the person(s) who needs the handicap dock in Wolfeboro get into the boat in the first place?"

I know that one answer is that "they" had an assistance device at their own dock, I get it, but I doubt this is the case in every case, and is Wolfeboro the only port on the Lake they visit?

One of my neighbors up here at the lake has one on their boat. They bought one of the first deck boats that I saw on the lake, and the Hoyer is located right on the bow of the boat.

This is not mine but here is the setup you are talking about..

Glendale
 

Here is what Glendale has at their dock...

"Just exactly how did the person(s) who needs the handicap dock in Wolfeboro get into the boat in the first place?"

As Chachee said, not all disabilities are the same, not everyone with a disability requires lift assistance. Suppose you broke a leg and were in a full leg cast and wheelchair temporarily, but still wanted to get out on the lake, you would be entitled to a space that hopefully would accommodate your chair and give you space to move around to move yourself to the boat safely.
Suppose you had a parent with COPD and on oxygen who can't walk too far, but they could still enjoy a day on the lake. Or a returning veteran with a spinal cord injury, who has excellent use of their upper body but happens to move around in a chair instead of on their legs. None of those people need lifts, just the right kind of space to access their boats safely.
Technology and common sense (universal design) can go a long way to help us not handicap a person who happens to have a disability.

And we've come full circle
 

Wholeheartedly agree! But how is ANY of the above solved by the reserved Wolfeboro docks. They serve only one unfortunate unplanned purpose, and that is to create resentment among hundreds of boaters looking for a dock on busy weekends all summer, knowing this is only a "reserved" spot and not a true "handicap" spot.

ADA of 1990
 

Did you know the act was initiated by a Vietnam vet that had difficulty getting around not only because of available disability access but because of the inability to get the govt and business attention to his plight? Watch the movie 'Music Within', it is very touching.

If someone with a disability file a complaint with the DOJ, the municipality or business must respond and provide access for the disabled. That is what happen to Wolfeboro. After looking over the provisions of the ADA, it does not clearly spell out what to be done dockside, but the town must have access available. The way I see it they should designate 30' of dockspace for the disabled with a lift. Wolfeboro designated too much dockspace and no lift. Someone can and probably will file another complaint.

Glendale did not designate part of the dock for disability access, but they do provide a lift. The lift been there for several years and it looks like not designating dock space is an issue. Something to think about.

I reach out to business and govt when I get a complaint regarding the use of NH TRS (Telecommunication Relay Service). The DOJ will give the entity a chance to accept relay calls or suffer serious penalties. If you would like more information on telecommunication access for the Deaf, hard of hearing, Deaf-Blind, or speech impaired individuals, don't hesitate to give me a call at 224-1850 x206 or email: relaynh@ndhhs.org

Glendale
 

B.H.;

Glendale does in fact have a clearly designated area of handicap dock (see below). It is in the same location as the lift. The poles are clearly marked with Handicap signs and no one parks there without a placard. FYI...I have never seen any boat park there.

Dan

Thanks for the clarification
 

I haven't been paying attention to the docks, but I can remember at one time the lift was at the end of the dock open to the public. It looks like they moved it toward the Marine Patrol area. I was not aware of this.

You would have to be a real fool to park in THAT Glendale space without a placard.

Just Guessing
 

That space is reserved for Handicapped MP Officers. :D

OR: It's intended to be used for removing Injured Handicapped persons from an MP Boat returning from a Island or Boating rescue mission. (Maybe that person weighs 600 pounds.)

Otherwise a Stokes stretcher would be used to transport an injured victim. No need for a crane :look: NB