Pit Bulls
 

When will people learn that these dogs are killers and always will be.
On Monday we lost our 10lb 13 year old Jack Russell to our neighbors pit bull.
Our dog escaped from our fenced in yard and was wondering around the house when the pit bull caught her and mauled her. Although my wife who was home at the time did not see it our dog would have been avoiding contact with the pit bull.
This same dog attacked our beagle while my wife was walking her on a leash.
This same family moved in with 2 pit bulls who got loose while they were away and attacked both my wife and I, fortunately no harm to either.
We have had 3 reports now with one consisting of a dog being killed and all the law allows is for a $100 fine. Even the police officer was upset she could not do more.
This dog is a family dog and around 2 small children but when it senses fear in another dog it has attacked twice. Proof that you can love this breed all you want but the urge to attack and kill will ALWAYS be there.
RIP Pirate you will be missed. :emb:
We will not rest until we kill this dog.

Want some help?

Sorry to hear about your Jack Russell being murdered by this Pit Bull.

Belmont Resident: Sorry about your loss. That is a horrible story. What was the owner's position? You'd think if they were responsible they would get rid of this dog especially with young kids in their home.

I truly truly feel for your loss, but I can't agree with this statement. We don't own pitbulls, though I know several friends who do. Dogs are more products of their environment and owners than anything else. Irresponsible owners are the root of the problem.

Given the events you've described, were I in a similar case I would likely come to the same conclusion as you in this scenario. Just remember to maintain your own humanity and not inflict undue harm or cruelty on an essentially defenseless and outmatched adversary...

No remorse
 

Had I not turned up my road when I did and witness her and her 2 children walking from the scene (the bus stop)she would have denied knowledge of the whole incident. (this is what the officer said after interviewing them)
She even went to far as to tell the police she did not know who's dog it was after living across the street for the last 10 years.
After they were issued the ticket they called the police station to complain stating our dog was loose as well and why were they being ticketed. (they were ticketed for the death not the dog being loose)
Before the end of the month I will have installed video camera's that will monitor our yard. If the dog is so much as spotted off their property without being on a leash the police will be called. They encourage us to call as often as possible so that a case can be built and action taken.
We were more saddened by the responses she gave then the fact our dog was killed. I honestly do not think I would be more devastated if something happened to one of my boys.

Before this happened I would have agreed with you, this dog is part of a family with children, it has played with one of my other Jack Russell dogs that is a strong Alfa dog and will snap at the pit bull and send it running. There have never been signs of aggression in this dog. So given this I totally disagree with your statement in this case. I now firmly believe these dogs have a deep underlying urge to conquer and kill. although this may be suppressed by love and affection it still lies dormant and always will.
FYI my dog suffered for over an hour, this dog crushed both sides of her chest breaking ribs on both sides, how she lasted so long before passing at the vets is beyond me.
I was raised with cats and dogs and for the most part have always lived with the company of one or more, but a line has been crossed and now I or my wife will end it with a clean shot and there will be no suffering involved should this dog be caught on our property again. I know this will not bring back our dog but it may save another dog from the same fate.
I passed this story onto the local news station WMUR but got no reply back. I had hopes that bringing these people to light just may shame them into a change.

First one's on me. There is some good free recorder software out there if you have a PC that you can leave running.

So Sorry
 

B.R.;

Terribly sorry for your loss. That is a horrible way to lose a pet.

Such a tragedy...

Dan

I am so, so sad to hear this. It makes me sick. And then for the people to more or less deny it? This dog should be removed from the people that have it. I don't know what I would do if this happened to one of my "kids." I am so sorry for you and your wife.

This is very sad. I agree with you about an inbred danger in these dogs. While out walking with our puggle we were approached by a very nice family with a pit bull similar breed. Their dog was trying to engage our dog in play, such as nudging him and running around him. Our dog, who normally will play with ALL dogs, was hiding behind me with his tail between his legs.
It was if he knew....

I'm terribly sorry for your loss and am very empathetic to what you are going through - when we lost our dog 2 years ago it there me into a funk for months.

That said I don't think its fair to generalize about any breed. A good deal of it is the breeding and family they are in. That said all dogs are still dogs. We had a pure breed golden that was wonderful with people, great with kids and at about 4 years old became horribly aggressive with other dogs. I think he would of killed another dog if given the opportunity. We made sure that for the last 5 years of his life he never had access to other dogs but come on - a mean Golden?? We also have a friend with a beagle that is great with adults and other dogs but terrible with little kids. Just like people all breeds have great dogs and bad dogs. I would hate to see one bad family / bad dog result into thousands of dogs being labeled as killers.

Pirate
 

Belmont Resident, my heart is heavy with sadness over the loss of your little girl in such a tragic manner. This dog is a ticking time bomb and the parents of these children are insane to keep them.

A pertinent question from this informative website about the history and nature of Pitbulls:
http://www.dogsbite.org/dangerous-dogs-pit-bull-faq.php

Q: Why does my friend say, "Pit bulls are dog-aggressive not human-aggressive?"
Due to selective breeding for the purposes of dogfighting, pit bulls are highly dog-aggressive. This aggression is not limited to dogs; pit bulls frequently kill other companion pets and domesticated animals. Leading pit bull education websites warn pit bull owners to, "Never trust your pit bull not to fight." These same websites also state that pit bulls should never be left alone with another dog or animal.16 The practical question is: Why is "pit bull dog aggression" tolerated at all?
Pit bull dog aggression is unacceptable for two reasons. In many instances it leads to human aggression. A common scenario is the following: A loose pit bull attacks a leashed dog being walked by its owner. The owner gets seriously injured trying to stop the attack. In 2009, two human beings suffered death due to pit bull dog aggression: Rosie Humphreys, who had been walking her two poodles, and Carter Delaney, who had tried to protect a smaller dog in his home.
Secondly, far too many beloved companion pets and domesticated animals suffer a violent death by the powerful jaws of pit bull terriers each year. In some instances, these attacks involve pit bulls charging through screen doors of private homes -- in a home invasion attack -- to kill the pet living inside.17 Owners of the pet are then forced to watch as their pet is disemboweled by the pit bull and pray that the dog does not turn its attention on an innocent family member next.

Belmont Resident, what a horrible story. These people sound like terribly irresponsible dog owners. As the owner of a large dog who happens to be a pitbull mix, if my dog ever attacked a person, it would not get another chance. People who own large, strong dogs of any breed need to pay a lot of attention to training and dominating the dogs to ensure that the dogs know who is in charge.

The problems arise when people get these dogs because they are cool and then do not invest the time and energy in building a healthty relationship with the dog. I think this problem is especially prevalent with pit bulls. People often get them because they are bad ass, not realizing that they tend to be very high energy, high intensity dogs. They need a lot of attention from their owners to be well adjusted. Any high energy dog that is not getting enough exercise and attention is going to become anxious and probably aggressive.

The first time you were attacked, these owners should have realized that they had a real problem on their hands and taken drastic steps to correct it. I have a very hard time faulting the dog for the owners irresponsibility.

That was more-or-less my earlier view—until the folks I've seen every summer for ten years advised of a similar story this July.

(I had been keeping their Pit Bull at a literal "arms-length"). :eek2:

Last May, it was their own Pit Bull that killed their own small dog. Understandably, they couldn't keep the Pit Bull around their one remaining small dog, so the Pit Bull was euthanized.

(Losing two pets). :(

Hmm.. My parents have a pitbull and he was bossed around by a Boston Terrier and a Dachsund before those two little ones died from old age.

I understand your frustration completely and I'm sorry that it happened (how awful!), but your statement just isn't accurate or fair. I am shocked that this dog was not seized by animal control for at least a short amount of time.

Sorry to hear about your loss.
 

It is a terrible situation when another dog owner denies involvement, especially when he/she is a neighbor.

I knew a doberman breeder in Nashua that was attacked many times by his own dogs, yet he thinks nothing of it. The owners are as much to blame as the dogs.

I did rescue a female Rotweiler who was dying of cancer. Bette was the most gentlest dog I can imagine. She would let the cat take over her bed without a fight and allow my grandbabies to sleep with her. Yet, I met folks that are deathly afraid of Rotweilers and say I am out of my mind.

You can't blame the dogs, blame the owner/handler!

I too want to chime in with my sympathy for your loss. Very sad to hear of this often repeated story.

Rotweilers are very gentle within the family and for those people that are recognized as welcome members to the home, but they are also very protective of their owners. I wouldn't mess with anyone who owned a Rotweiler.

I have a friend who adopted a rescue pitbull puppy and he appears to be as gentle as lamb. Who knows what he will grow into, but for these owners it will not be nurture that dictates an aggressive demeanor. They are very loving and even tempered folks. The owners are launching a facebook campaign on how this breed is not a threat, but I feel they are not only being very protective of their new puppy, but also being very naive. Time will tell, and through knowing them and their dog, I will form an opinion. I love dogs, all dogs, and I don't want to form an opinion based on stories. BTW, I don't dispute what happened, I just want to see for myself if this pitbull matures an aggressive trait.

So sorry for you!
 

BR: This is terrible. I am so sorry for you and your family, and especially your poor little Jack Russell, who suffered so much. When my Siamese, Koko, had a stroke 5 years ago and had to be euthanized, I couldn't even go to work the next day... our pets are family. I am sending you a hug.

For those who disagree.
 

My wife's sister was hanging out with a guy friend who owned a pit bull, she had been around this dog quite a few times and was very comfortable.
The last time she was with this dog it was licking her face when all of the sudden it snapped and bit her in the face. Unprovoked out of the blue.
The dog in question as I've already said is a family dog, as much as I hate these people I must say my wife and I have never seen them abuse or hurt this dog. There is something in this dog that when it senses another dogs fear of it provokes it to attack. From my understanding this is ofter what is determined to be the case with many pit bull attacks.
Sorry but that isn't in my opinion the owner. I truly believe that these dogs were bread for fighting and will always harbor that instinct deep inside. How, when or if it is ever triggered it usually ends in tragedy.
Yes in the end it was the owners fault because they knew this dog was dangerous and should always have been restrained.
What I can say is that I now have a hatred for this breed that will stay with me for the rest of my life. I hope it comes out, I've attached last years Christmas card, Pirate is on the far right. As you can see sh isn't mush of a challenge for a pit bull.
Attachment 7111

That's cute. They're saying, "We get to eat cookies on the couch tonight for this".

It takes my wife over an hour and a hundred shots using the remote just to get the right one.
Unfortunately this year she will not do one, maybe next year.:(

Sad so sad, my sympathy to your family.

An agressive dog with the size and strength of a pitbull is too dangerous to have as a pet. Just my opinion.

I know it's tough to think about it this way, but if you have a documented monetary investment in your dog, maybe you can sue them for your financial loss. Obviously this is not your "real" loss, but it may be tool to convince them to remove their dog from the situation. You have other dogs to protect.

Dogs are breed
 

Some pit bulls have been breed to fight. They are breed to be strong and aggressive. Not much else to say.

Very sorry to hear of your loss. Your dog looks like it was a great pet.

With pitbulls, they are often fine and loving with the humans they live with, but they can never be trusted with other four-legged animals. Once they sense fear in another animal, watch out. It is in their genes, what they as a breed were developed to do.

R2B

Get one of these dogs and introduce him to your neighbors pit bull.

http://listverse.wpengine.netdna-cdn...no_stacked.jpg

Dogo Argentino

First bred in Argentina in 1928, the Dogo was taken from the now extinct Cordoba Fighting Dog, which was mixed with various other breeds, including the Great Dane, Dogue de Bordeaux and Irish Wolfhound. Breeder Antonio Nores Martinez developed his dog as a big game hunter, taking on such dangerous prey as the mountain lion. Although it was not its original purpose, the Dogo has also been used for fighting. Generally weighing in at just under a hundred pounds, it is solid white and resembles a larger Pit Bull. The Dogo is banned in at least 10 countries, including Australia, New Zealand and Portugal.

Thank you
 

Unfortunately you cannot pick your neighbors and unfortunately we wound up with what we have.
There have been a multitude of other problems with these neighbors over the years including dogs and also their chickens in our yard.
They do not have much but my wife and I do plan on taking them to court for the vet bill when we get it as well as the replacement cost.
Even if the cost to do so over rides the return in this case it is the point.
Little, considering our loss.
We do hope that they do not pay the ticket within the prescribed time. If so the town can then take legal action. Right now they are bound by the extent of the law which doesn't allow for more then a fine.

Shoot the damn thing
 

If the pit bull is in your yard or threatening you I would assume you would have the legal right to shoot the damn thing?

I would not let that beast within 10 feet of me.

B.R.;

When Pirate was attacked was he in your yard or your neighbors?? If he was in your yard you definitely have a case to recoup cost for the dog and all vet bills. If he was in your neighbors you will have a fight on your hands I think.

Either way my heart goes out to you and your wife for your loss.

Dan

I agree 100%!

I don't trust that breed as far as I could throw them. I don't care what people say they cannot be trusted..

Sorry
 

BR So sorry for your loss, it is horrible.

I am in my office and was scrolling through the thread when I hear this dog growling behind me (it was my Steeler). I was reading the description of the Dogo white dog above and he obviously saw something he did not like in the posture or something.

BR, so sorry for your loss.
I too have no use for this breed of dog. A few years ago my son came over our house with a friend's pit bull. I told him to keep it on a short leash even while in the house. Though I was able to "pet" it, I didn't trust it. I dropped something on the floor, fairly close to the dog. As I bent to retrieve what was dropped, the dog lunged for my face. I managed to reach out and caught it by the collar and held it at bay until my son was able to get it under control. I consider that I was pretty lucky to make that collar catch.
I asked my son to get that dog out of my house and not return with it again.
I have a hard time thinking that some folks think they are really a gentle breed. They are not. There are way too many horrible stories like this one.

Bob,
Was this the dog that rides the surf board?

I'm sorry but this story doesn't show that all pit bulls are terrible killers. It shows that that dog was. Obviously there are bad pit bulls, as has been stated there are bad dogs of any breeds. Anyone who own a large strong dog needs to be responsible with it, just like anyone who owns a gun needs to be responsible with it. This extends to putting it down if necessary. I don't know why anyone would keep a dog around that had to be physically restrained over a piece of food like this one. To me it's equivalent to keeping a loaded, cocked pistol on your coffee table.

Sorry for your loss...
 

Advice:

Bring a legal action against the owners of the dog that killed yours.

The loss of your pet in this manner has caused you emotional distress.

Any vet bills stemming from this cost you money.

Your dog had monetary value which is now gone.

Seek significant damages for these.

By bringing this action against your neighbor they will have to respond through their homeowners insurance. When their insurance company realizes what has happened they will likely demand the dog be removed. If the owner is not complant, the insurance company may not renew their policy.

Whether or not you win, you have had an impact on the neighbor.

If owners don't have enough sense to choose another breed, maybe the economics of owning a Pit Bull can be made unfeasible.

No that was my Rascal. This was Pirate a gift from me on my wife's birthday about 10 years ago. She is never on the lake without her dog.
Believe it or not Rascal is a strong alpha dog and has sent this pit bull running for home many a time.

ishoot308: Pirate had escaped our fenced in yard and the attack happened on our dirt road. We did not see it but given past history, whenever pirate saw this dog she would give it a wide birth. Our belief is that she was trying to avoid the dog and the owner did nothing to stop her dog from chasing down pirate.

I would like to do that as well but my wife wants to put it behind her and not have to face these people. We are planning on moving to get away from these people. We are however going to pursue legal action in small claims court for vet bills and attempt to get compensation for the cost of pirate.

Pit bulls are almost always the only dog in the news constantly for killing or maiming other animals and people. This breed of dog is a ticking time bomb.
Many cities have special ordinances specifically for dealing with pit bulls.

BR...I am so sorry for your loss. I cannot even imagine it. Please extend my condolences to you family.

Allie

Dogs that Attack
 

Belmont Res. I am sorry for your loss. Unfortunately usually only those that have personal experiences with dogs attacking understand the true capabilities of certain breeds. Pit bulls and rottweiler because of the attack gene bred in are always capable of killing and there is NEVER a guarantee that something, however minor won't trigger that attack circuit.
For the doubters, look up how many children have been killed by their family pitbull or rottweiler. Surely they thought their dogs would never hurt a family member, but humans and dogs do not think the same way.

My son was attacked by the neighbors rottweiler when he was 6. The dog crashed through the front screen and ran across the street and attacked. He aimed to kill. Clearly the two little boys playing in their front yard triggered something that caused him to "snap". Luckily my son was saved by a 17 year old who fled with my son while the dog continued to lunge toward my son. They both sustained a lot of injuries and the hospital took pictures of them before treating.
Unfortunately the owners also thought it was fluke and decided the dog needed to be neutered. Within a few weeks the dog was seized and put down.

So for any owner of the suspect breeds, never, never ever trust that your animal is not capable of killing your pet, child or a stranger.

Well said. A friend of the family got two of these dogs as pets about 18-months ago. We immediately ruled their house a no-go zone for the kids. They haven't been there since. It simply isn't worth the risk.

BelmontRes - I mean no disrespect by posting this on your thread but it seemed the appropriate area for the discussion. A pitbull puppy was tied to a bumper and dragged over a mile yesterday (mind you pit bulls are subjected to more abuse by humans than any other dog breed - wonder if its a coincidence?). Most statistics I can find suggest that humans inflicting acts of cruelty against dogs each year is higher than the incidence of dogs biting humans. Even the breeds being discussed are a result of humans breeding these undesirable traits into their animals. 60 years ago pitbulls were the single most popular family dog in america. Its only when the Scott Vicks of the world decided to breed them to fight each other that problems start to arise. We need to focus on what we can to target Bemont's irresponsible neighbors and leave the poor dogs alone.

You will probably grind through the small claims process and after about two years, still not get anything out of those people. Good luck. My last experience when the people were in contempt of court for not paying 10$ a month toward a bill ended up with the judge telling me they didn't have enough money to pay since they only made 18,000 a year on disability. So I am disgusted with the whole process. I was in shock when the judge said that. I do a fair amount of collections and that has never happened to me before. Not able to pay 10$ a month???? But I know he has money for beer, etc.

So sorry for your loss. Horrible.

In my humble opinion, these types of dogs are aggressive by nature and it does not take much to bring it out in them. My father in law loved these types of dogs, (Rottweilers, pit bulls, Dobermans). His dogs were highly trained and were "show dogs" and on many occasions I saw his own Rotty's growl, snap and behave very aggressive towards anyone.
I never let my guard down and never ever trusted these animals or these breeds around my kids or my own dogs.

There is a raging national debate on the merits of owning a Pit Bull. I've heard most of what both sides say. There is often a comparison made of bite incidents by different breeds. Pit Bull advocates may tell you that some other, well respected, kid friendly breed bites more often.

Here is where I see the difference:

Most dogs that bite do it once to send a messege and then disengage.

A Pit Bull will likely keep biting until what it is biting stops moving.

A Pit Bull has extremely capable biting equipment, thus making each bite cause more damage.

I stear clear of them. I cross the street when I see one coming. I believe this "bullying by proxy" is why some owners choose this breed.

Another bright Pit Bull owner
 

Pit bull left to "babysit" 10-month-old child, Fla. man arrested


(CBS) PALM COAST, Fla. - A 41-year-old northeast Florida man, James Irvine, faces child neglect charges after he allegedly left an infant in the care of a pit bull while he went out to drink Friday night.

The mother of the 10-month-old child left the baby in Irvine's care when she left for work on Nov. 30, the Daytona Beach News-Journal reports. However, Irvine soon abandoned the child to go out to a bar.

The child's mother reportedly became alarmed after she tried contacting Irvine several times Friday night. When Irvine finally picked up the mother's phone calls he reportedly told her "I'm watching the game," before hanging up, the newspaper reports.

When the mother arrived home, she discovered Irvine trying to get back into the house through the garage door.

According to the News-Journal, citing a Flagler County sheriff's report, Irvine told her that he had not "left the baby alone," because the "pit bull was watching the baby."

The dog was sitting outside the room where the child was left. The door was shut, and the child was allegedly crying, the Daytona Beach News-Journal reported.

Irvine was arrested and brought to the Flagler County Inmate Facility. He was later released on $1,500 bail, the newspaper reports.

The dog owner thinks it makes them a bad ass! That kind of stupid thinking shows how stupid they really are! Probably why the owner was going to deny it was their dog that did it! Get a clue! :rolleye1:

Sad, sad, sad
 

BR -- I am so sorry for your loss. As you can see by my avitar I am a dog lover myself.

I am not familiar with the local laws, but perhaps you document every call and response, get a copy of the police report you filed, and whatever other information could help you make your case and then consult a lawyer for a civil suit. Again, I don't know the laws or if it's feasible but hitting an ignoramus in the wallet may wake his/her sorry butt up.

GB

As much as I now hate the breed I would NEVER advocate this type of torture to any animal.
But I do not agree with you. As stated earlier I believe the breed is a ticking time bomb weather it gets all the love and training in the world or it is trained to fight.

All the best training in the world will not completely overcome genetics. It may mask the genetics most of the time, but a psychological trigger, no matter how small, can make these dogs instantaneously snap.

You buy a purebred dog because of the genetics in the breed you have chosen. Within a small range, you know what you are getting. Pit-bull owners need to realize what they have gotten into and take all necessary precautions to make sure their dog does not harm anyone or anyone's pet.

That is responsible ownership and if they are not doing that job, the dog should be removed as a menace to society. That is what an untrained and improperly supervised pit-bull truly is.

R2B

I was walking my dog on the cotton valley trail in Wolfeboro this afternoon when I passed a lady who was walking a Jack Russell. The dog went nuts when it saw my dog and the owner had a hard time calming it down.

I talked to the owner and she said that she just got the dog and was going to take it to dog obedience training because of the way it acts when it sees another dog. She said it barks constantly and gets very aggressive when it comes in contact with other dogs.

Is this common in the Jack Russell breed?

I searched for a video and found this one. The Jack Russell acted just like the one in the video:


<iframe width="960" height="720" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/3EoMTeCYHRw?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Yes Jack Russell males are very alpha strong in many cases. I have known 2 people who had to put a male JR down because of this and the sad thing is that in both cases it was definitely lack of the owners to act on this.
In one case it was our elderly neighbors, we had offered to take the dog and work with it since we had 3 but in the end he felt bad letting us and eventually put him down.
Many dogs will display this kind of behavior towards other dogs but in most of those cases it is because the dog has not been allowed to interact with other dogs so in the end it doesn't know any other way. This type of behavior can in my opinion always be traced back to the owner.
We have never had one of our dogs act this way around other dogs. My Rascal who is a strong alpha and rules the house will turn and growl at another dog when the dog refuses to leave her alone, but only then.
I have a friend with a huge German Sheppard and it is comical to see her chasing him across his yard while snapping at his heals after she has sent him the message that she wants to be left alone and he persists.
80-90lb German Sheppard being run down by an 18lb JR, what a sight.

I have a friend with a male and female Jack Russel. In his case it's the female that is hyper and acts like this. If it were always the owners that are the problem why are some breeds of dogs more hyper then others?

Lakepilot, read up on Jack Russell's, they are normally a very hyper breed of dog. While they are not normally an aggressive dog they like any other dog can be.
I noticed in the video Rusty posted that the lady that had the hyper JR was older.
No disrespect meant but when older/elderly people get dogs they tend to shower them with love and affection but do very little when it comes to discipline. Kind of like grand parents with grand kids, they can do no wrong.
We have been very lucky to have gotten Jack Russel dogs that have taken well to training and interact well with any dog they have met in public.
I take mine with me to work all summer and she sits in the sun all day sleeping or watching me work. I've even got her to stay on command if she see's a squirrel or chipmunk. That took a while to achieve.

I am so sorry about your baby. It must have been horibble for you and your wife to have to deal with that. A friend of mine was walking her dog a few years ago, on leash. A 7 year old girl was walking her mother's boyfriends Pit. The Pit got loose and attached my friends dog. He kept coming at her dog until he had killed him even though people were trying to pry him away.

The owners reaction? "Well at least he killed this one so I don't have to pay the vet bills like I had to the last time he attacked a dog.....$100 fine is nothing".

I think the OWNER should have been euthanized....

I do believe this breed has been bred for this and irresponsible owners allow these dogs to act this way.

My nephew has an American Bulldog (another of the "Bully Breeds" and she is the sweetest dog on the planet.....she is the grandaughter of the dog who was in the movie The Incredible Journey. She was well trained and lives with other dogs of all sizes, cats and young children with never an issue.

Again, so sorry for you and I hope you can find some peace.

So Sorry
 

Belmont Resident,

Our hearts go out to you and your wife on your loss. What a very sad way to lose such a wonderful family member.

My husband and I are total animal lovers, who own the dog in the avatar and three cats, and we would not hesitate to want justice for any one of our "kids" taken away by a menace and heartless family.

We were thinking that if you could not win the fight to have this dog put down, what about asking the town to make sure this dog is muzzled every time it leaves the inside of their house, even in their yard? Every time you see this dog without its muzzle call the town and report them and hopefully they will actually consider seizing this animal and do something they should have done a long time ago.

All our best to you,
Mary and Frank

Sorry to hear the news.
 

Both my wife and I are sorry to hear the about Pirate. We will be still thinking of him when we anchor over at Mark Island.

BR will need this.

Just some thoughts
 

Frist BR, I am sorry that you had a to loose your dog in such a way, it is never easy...

2nd, many homeowners insurance policies, will not renew policies if an aggressive breed is found to be residing in the home. And it isn't just pitbulls, rotwillers, etc. that are considered aggressive. My Aunt has Malamutes and had trouble with her insurance company a couple of years back.

3rd while it is true certain species have more agressive personalities, it is always the lack of responsibility on the part of the owner that causes the problem. I have seen pitbulls, rotwillers, dobermans etc. all make great pets. But in order to do so takes a certain type of owner. Someone that understands that dogs traits, and can provide the attention and constant training that these dogs need.

All dogs have inate tendencies, my springer for instantence is a hunting dog, and while I don't hunt with him, my wife and I do train and work with him constantly. This allows his natural tendancy to want to track, flush, and retrieve, to be full filled in a constructive maner. When I see well behaved Rotwillers, Pits etc. they usually have owners that understand the agressive nature of the dogs, and also find ways to allow them to get that aggression out constructively. I have found when I see dogs snap, and attack, it is generally because the owners, have not found a way to constructively live with their dogs traits, and try and restrain the dog from showing those traits, and thus the dogs eventually snaps.

Last dogs are dogs, they are animals, there genelogy is to be aggressive, and that is true of any dog. Look at the behavior of the wolfs. They are very agressive, even towards there own pack. However in a pack the behavior is understood and not a suprise to any of the members. Dogs think of humans as part of the pack, they expect us to understand their behavior, alas oftern we do not.

Don't blame the dog, the problem is always the owner. And the bottom line is some people just don't care, or don't take the time to learn and understand their dog.

I keep hearing and reading "don't blame the dog, blame the owner". How, pray tell, does one discern between a responsibe owner and an irresponsible one?

Do I make a quick judgement as I walk my dog (or kid) down the sidewalk?

Do I assume innocence until after the maiming and then apologize for my error?

I am not in the business of gauging Pit Bull aggression levels.

As far as I'm concerned, there are Pits who have had incidents and Pits that WILL.

I suppose that makes me a "breedist". So be it.

I think this thread should be directed to the firearms thread... I have 4 dogs and if a neighbors dog did that to one of mine it would disappear in the night...

I have owned many dogs, the toughest one being a chessie. My jake was an angel, had him since he was 8 weeks and he was the best chessie I had ever met. Many vets and groomers were scared of him as they are known to be bull headed, not loving, and sometimes aggressive but certainly not fierce like a pit bull. He turned out to be loyal and lovable. He was focused and a bit intense when it came to his toys but beyond that my kids could climb all over him. He lived to be 14, a good long life for a Chesapeake.

I was mauled by a black lab as a kid, it roughed me up pretty bad. It's a miracle I like dogs as much as I do. I have been attacked by rotties and pit bulls before so I have no love for either.

Our 4 dogs are all family friendly. My leonberger is a moose and has a bark that could wake the dead, but is a teddy bear. The rest are all sissies.

Sorry for your loss. Awful...

Codeman671

(Codeman, otherwise named Cody, was my golden retriever and probably the best friend I have ever had)

As much as I'm sure you'd love to put one through it's skull, you have to know they'll just get another. You can't win that way - you need a bigger bully.

It wouldn't take much for a lawyer to find out who the lienholder is and who insures the property, then send them both letters describing the incident, as well as a copy of the police report. I'll bet the bank and the insurance company will take care everything else for you. :)

A start
 

My wife is taking them to small claims court to recover the vet bills and possibly the cost of pirate.
My suggestion was to tell them when she saw them that they had a choice, pay up or we get a lawyer and go after their homeowners or at the very least send them all the police reports and let them make the call. I do like the part about including the lien holder.

Isurance Companies
 

Check with your lawyer. Filing a claim against their homeowners policy should start wheels in motion as others have indicated on this tread. Neither the homeowner or the insurance company want the liability of having a dog with a violent history. While they may turn down the claim, they will request the dog be removed (with proof) or they will cancel the policy. The next time it could be a human ! :(

Ribbons
 

Here is the yellow dog project. Perhaps we should have a red ribbon for dangerous dogs.

I honestly do not think I would be more devastated if something happened to one of my boys.

I find that to be a bit of an odd statement. :confused:

So sorry for your loss, Belmont. It's like losing a family member......and you are so right about pit bulls.
I have to laugh at people who use that tired cliche' that "There are no bad dogs, just bad owners" Nothing could be further from the truth. Pit bulls account for over 70% of dog attack fatalities (128 in the last 7 years) even though they are only 5% of the dog population. They are born and bred to kill things....it is in their DNA and nothing can change that.
Last year, according to Dogbites, 8 of them actually killed their OWNERS
We've noticed, when visiting Florida that pit bulls are the favorite of gangbangers and other losers. The city of Miami has actually banned them. Good for them.
Hope you do contact their landlord and insurance company and, again, sorry for your loss.

In the news today
 

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Further reading:

http://nationalcanineresearchcouncil...hatisadogbite/

http://www.americanhumane.org/animal...dog-bites.html

Good reading, but what is your point?

In this situation, no human was bitten, but a pet dog was killed by an aggressive pit-bull, that appears to have been raised and owned by irresponsible owners. I am a dog lover and I have two very passive dogs. I am completely in favor of responsible dog ownership, including but not limited to socialization, training and control of the pet at all times.

R2B

I agree with you 100% I posted the further reading only because I feel there is a lot of stuff being thrown out in this thread without a lot of facts backing it up. Many people bash pitbulls, say they are bade despite their owners and then go on to bash their owners as well. It is true that there are more dog bits from pit bulls than other breeds, but it's also true that thanks to pit bulls reputation, many people own them who have no business owning a big, strong dog. It turns into a negative feedback cycle. I'm just trying to post some facts.

I agree with the training vs genetic statement. I own a Jack Russell, and no matter how well trained, at some point he WILL take off after a varmint. I don't expect any amount of training or love will make him 100% reliable, and hence. . . pit bulls give me the willeys.

Ignorance is not bliss
 

I understand you're grieving but change the tables, how would you feel if your varmint hunting terrier dog killed my kid's pet rabbit? and I vowed to to murder your dog because of it??
Pit Bull Terriers were originally bred for bull-baiting and later thrown into dog fighting pits together (this is all back in the late 1800's) They were not bred to be people aggressive and actually wiped from the gene pool if they did. Yes, today you have the people out there raising their dogs for terrible reasons but its not just pit bulls being abused. Both of you are at fault here. The first time that dog showed any sort of aggression it should have been humanely put out of it's misery. I can almost guarantee that dog is not fixed, was not properly raised and probably was allowed to live as the dominant pack member. Pit Bulls need a structured routine in their life, they cannot think they're the alpha in the houseor horrible incidents like this CAN happen (same as any dog) but also, shame on you for being a careless owner and letting your dog run free. If your dog had been ran over by a car would you seek revenge on the driver as well??

Do everyone a favor and read up some on some unbiased articles on American Pit Bull Terrier (yes....Terrier. Just like your Jack Russel terrier. They both come from the same blood line, Imagine that )

If you really do your homework you'll learn that most of the dogs covered in news articles or tv stories arent even purebred American Pit Bull Terriers, they're inbred, improperly raised and cared for mutts that have a big skull. The media likes to drop the 'pit bull' name because they know it keeps people interested aka ratings. They did it with Rottweilers, Dobermans, Sheppard's and now Pit Bulls.
"With a recorded bite force of 235 PSI, pit bull terriers bite at only 71 percent of the strength of Rottweilers. Pit bulls have a false reputation for being a dangerous breed, and evoke more irrational fear than any other domesticated dog. Contrary to the myth, this muscular breed has a mild temperament, and if raised like any other house pet, can make a loyal addition to the family.
Read more: Strongest Dog Bites | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/list_6519877_strongest-dog-bites.html#ixzz2FVoDVi65"

To go around persecuting certain dogs because they're some bad reports makes you just as ignorant as your stupid neighbor for not properly caring for their dog. Do your homework before you open your trap. If I find out anything has happened to any pit bull type dog whether it actually be a pit bull or your ignorance thinking some mutt looks like a pit bull, I will personally make sure you face the consequences for your nescient comment.

While we're on the subject, take a look at the photo and tell me which dog is a pit bull.....

http://s12.postimage.org/9gguus7p5/main_pitbull.jpg

OH! And what a horrible show this was too! Espeically when Pete ate all the kids.....
http://s8.postimage.org/5whn70p75/pete_the_pit_bull.jpg

Or what about when Helen Keller's pit bull lead her into a dark room only to maul her to death.... oh wait....
http://s10.postimage.org/ta8f5uq3p/Helen_Keller1.jpg

I know you're too hell bent on revenge right now to even comprehend the amount of information I've just supplied by hopefully some day you and anyone else will think back on this and realize what a bunch of morons you look like saying such horrible things.

Just shake'in my head! :(

Welcome
 

Ummmm...Yea....Welcome to the forum - great first post.:confused:

Yuh,great first post.....maybe you should educate yourself before you make a fool out of yourself.

2011 U.S. Dog Bite Fatality Statistics - DogsBite.org
Fatal Dog Attack Statistics
DogsBite.org recorded 31 fatal dog attacks in 2011.1 Citations of each victim's story are located on the Fatality Citations page. The last year the CDC released data about dog bite-related fatalities was 1998. Likely due to pressures from animal advocacy groups, the CDC stopped studying these deaths by dog breed. Since 1998, pit bulls alone have killed 181 U. S. citizens. The only other known entity, in addition to DogsBite.org, that tracks this vital data publicly is Animal People.2

31 U.S. fatal dog attacks occurred in 2011. Despite being regulated in Military Housing areas and over 650 U.S. cities, pit bulls led these attacks accounting for 71% (22). Pit bulls make up less than 5% of the total U.S. dog population.3
Notably in 2011, adult victims of fatal pit bull attacks more than doubled the number of child victims. Of the 22 total pit bull victims, 68% (15) fell between the ages of 32 to 76, and 32% (7) were ages 5 years and younger.
The year 2011 also marks an increase in pet pit bulls killing their owners. Of the 8 total instances this year in which a family dog inflicted fatal injury to its primary caretaker, the dog's owner, 88% (7) involved pet pit bulls.
Together, pit bulls (22) and rottweilers (4), the number two lethal dog breed, accounted for 84% of all fatal attacks in 2011. In the 7-year period from 2005 to 2011, this same combination accounted for 74% (157) of the total recorded deaths (213).
The breakdown between pit bulls and rottweilers is substantial over this 7-year period. From 2005 to 2011, pit bulls killed 128 Americans, about one citizen every 20 days, versus rottweilers, which killed 29; about one citizen every 88 days.
Annual data from 2011 shows that 58% (18) of the attacks occurred to adults (21 years and older) and 42% (13) occurred to children (11 years and younger). Of the children, 62% (8) occurred to ages 1 and younger.
2011 data also shows that 39% (12) of the fatal incidents involved more than one dog; 26% (8) involved breeding on the dog owner's property either actively or in the recent past, and 6% (2) involved tethered dogs, down from 9% in 2010 and 19% in 2009.
Dog ownership information for 2011 shows that family dogs comprised 65% (20) of the attacks that resulted in death; 74% (23) of all incidents occurred on the dog owner's property and 29% (9) resulted in criminal charges, up from 15% in 2010.
The states of California and Texas led fatalities in 2011, each with 4 deaths; pit bulls and their mixes contributed to 88% (7) of the 8 deaths. North Carolina, New Mexico, South Carolina and Virginia each incurred 2 deaths.
See:

I started to read the post and then was forming a response, but I realized that the poster obviously doesn't have as you lead on enough education to have understood.
2% factor would apply to this poster: you have to be 2% smarter then a pit bull, enough said.

Really? Wow!

I also understand you cannot fix stupid.

R2B

Maybe you missed what it says in the "Posting Guide Lines":

Be Polite

Always show courtesy and respect, even when you strongly disagree with another person.

http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/...lines_faq_item

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Responses.
 

Judging by the responses, and thank you everyone for all the well wishes, I would say that pit bulls and the people who own them are not well liked in the lakes region.
The same opinions and statistics that were put on this site were also brought up on social media where the subject was discussed.
Most of us who own animal do so responsibly, but there will always be those who have to own an animal that is known to be dangerous, both to other people and other animals as well. I believe someone else summed it up when they said it just makes them look cool/macho amongst their friends.
I noticed donthasslemeimlocal that the show and picture referenced were from years gone by before our population exploded and before statistics were being kept on just how dangerous these dogs are.
How many shows are out now that have pit bulls in them? I do not recall any!
Like you donthasslemeimlocal I am sure that lady who owned the monkey who almost killed her and left her disfigured for life thought monkeys were perfectly safe to own. Most who own dangerous animals think nothing bad will ever happen right up until it does.
donthasslemeimlocal I do not know you but judging from your total lack of tact or common sense I doubt you are welcome in most circles. You are welcome to have you opinions on pit bulls, but before you go off ranting about things you know nothing about you should do your homework.
The word terrier is a word used to categorize a group of dogs, it has nothing to do with blood lines what so ever. The following link may help you become more educated http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrier.

Dogs are not people, you cannot use the same rules.

We all believe and are taught that you can't judge people by their looks, their skin color, their ethnic background, their "bloodlines" you have to judge people as individuals, by their actions and by their personalities.

We want to apply this logic to dogs, but we can't. Dogs have been selectively bred for hundreds of generations. Individuals that did not conform to the breed were removed from the breed. The difference from individual to individual is much smaller.

For example no one believes that you can take a dashund puppy, feed it well and nuture it to grow into a St Bernard. A dashund is bred to be small, it's going to be small, if breeders get a freak big dashund they are removed and do not reproduce. Why would anyone believe that a breed that was bred to be large, strong, fearless and aggressive, could be changed by some good upbringing?

...if you know all of us where's my Christmas card???
 

Center Harbor has approximately 827 property owners and 364 actually reside (have a mailing address there)
Meredith NH has 4,184 with 2,074 of which actually residing there
Laconia, NH has 7,510 owners with 4,213 reside there
Gilford , NH has 6,816 owners and 3597 there
Moultonborough, NH has 7,377 owners and 2,025 actually live there.

You believe because a handful of people, half of which don't even live here full time 'thanked you' by clicking a button that that means 'pit bulls are not well liked in the Lakes Region' ???

I haven't seen anyone respond to my picture about what dog is actually a pit bull. I wish someone would just reply because I bet barely anyone will know what breed actually is a pure bred American Pit Bull Terrier, and I hope that maybe with that little bit of eye opening realization that someone will see that the media and naive human beings like yourselves are bullying a dog breed that they dont even know. What's next century's victim going to be?? It's already been Rottweilers, Sheppards, Dobermans- who's next?

We're not five years old. Stop pointing fingers, it's no ones fault except irresponsible dog ownership. Their dog should have been exercised, neutered, properly raised and cared for. Your dog shouldn't have been loose. I'm familiar with Belmont laws and there is a leash law in place.
You had no right saying that you would take the law into your own hands and murder that dog and that is what the big deal is here.

....




You may want to read your educational link; especially section 2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrier.

I think this might be the most intelligent thing you have said in your 2 posts!

That doesn't mean Pit Bulls are not a dangerous breed, they are! My next door neighbor has one, but you know what, I have never seen it but once, and that is when it got loose and was running around the neighborhood.

Based on what I have read in multiple posts in this thread, I'm thinking this dog is might not getting the proper training/attention that is demanded of such a breed. I also could be wrong too. For all I know, they also could have gotten rid of it as I only saw it that one time.

And why wasn't the "Pit Bull" on a leash if we're going to put blame where blame is due?

I'll take a stab at it: Image 16

Dogs ???
 

Thought I'd chime in on this thread as it sems to be getting nasty. Some dog owners are weird in the way they treat their dogs. Today at Walmart in Gilford the woman in front of me had her litle dog (really little) in her pocketbook which was in the cart. Why?

Just a stupid little note to remind all to be nice, after all it is Christmas time.

I was going off about the ignorant Pit Bull owners and forgot the most important I think.....but if the dog was properly cared for to begin with, it shouldn't have been running wild??

I believe Belmont said this was the second incident, don't get me wrong the first time anything happened that dog should have faced some sort of consequences but by the law, even if the law is flawed, not premeditatedly on the internet.

Rusty you nailed thanks for playing! Wish I had a prize for you....:look:

To be fair, I do not believe Belmont said he would kill the dog. I believe he wants to do this through legal means. He said he would not rest until the dog was killed, he did not say he would kill it.

R2B

Not to split hairs, but it also sounds as though the Pit Bull was running wild too! If I had my choice between the two running wild I'd take the Jack Russell. Haven't seen or heard anything on the news regarding a Jack Russell mauling. :confused:

Because she wanted to bring her dog shopping with her? :laugh::laugh:

Why not?

I frequently take my dogs to Home Depot. The dogs seem to enjoy it, many of the floor workers at HD carry dog treats for people that bring their dogs along.

I'm not a fan of "pocket dogs", but if I had one, I'd probably bring it along to more places when I was shopping.

I love dogs, but I would never take one shopping in a store. Guess I'm just an old fashioned one.

My local Home Depot has a sign on the door..."no pets allowed."

I was in the Meredith library the other day looking at some books when the older lady next to me starting making some strange noises. I though that maybe she just hadn't eaten in awhile but no, she had a lap dog in a bag with her. I mean really, the library?

• Never having owned any breed but dachshunds, there is much correct in what you've written here. :)

• Remember...it was the Wolf that was the progenitor of all domesticated dogs. IMHO, it's unfortunate that some breeders are trying to re-insert Wolf genetics back into the domestic dog population. :confused:

• What Pit Bull advocates need is a video that can show similar traits that are touchingly demonstrated in the following video for Golden Retrievers: :look:

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i1...psd3e45cf0.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JA8VJh0UJtg

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JA8VJh0UJtg?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I'm surprised, HD does not allow animals unless they are guide animals.
I was asked not to bring my dog into the Tilton store several times which is another reason why I was glad Lowes came to Gilford.
I know this for sure because my wife used to work at HD and there policy was, not pets, unless it has been changed.

We had a tiny 4 lb toy poodle who was within an couple of weeks to the end of his life and couldn't leave him alone and had to go to HD in Rochester. We were told we couldn't have him there. We explained that we couldn't leave him alone and the situation but it didn't matter. I don't think Lowe's allows them either. I used to feel if my dogs weren't welcome in a store I wouldn't shop there. I was even allowed to bring them in Hunter's in Wolfeboro (in a bag of course). But it took me so long to shop because everybody stopped me wanted to talk about and or pet the dog, that I finally gave that up. THat is why I like small stores. Now if I had a big dog that needed to walk on the floor on a leash, I would never think of bringing them in a store. In fact, we used to have bigger dogs and never took them everywhere with us. There is just something about the little dogs.

I got that video in an email, with the retriever and the little boy. So cute!

I don't understand why HD doesn't allow dogs...they have millions of birds flying around inside ( going after bird feed).

Lowes does allow dogs. In fact when my Rascal was a puppy if I showed up at Tilton Lowes without her the girls were disappointed.
I often bring her to Gilford and many workers there know her by name.
I have never been asked to remove my dog from a Lowes store. I do however from time to time get looks from obvious none animal lovers with a look that says why do you have a dog in the store.
I would however never bring a dog into a store that needed a leash. To much work, but that is why we have lap dogs.
Oh FYI for those interested I bought my wife another JR puppy for Christmas. It doesn't replace pirate but it sure helped put a smile back on her face. :D

I like that about Lowe's then. I wonder if all Lowe's allows them? I was thinking I saw a sign once that said no dogs allowed. I only go to Lowe's and HD when I can't find something somewhere else anyway. We have taken our dogs in stores and when we do, people always say how good they are and how they wish kids that came in were that good. Ours don't move a muscle as long as they are being held.

I am glad you got your wife a new puppy. It is so true, it doesn't replace, but it sure does help you get your mind off it and you love the new one just as much!

I think HD and Lowe's should not allow kids in the stores. I believe it is not a safe environment for little kids and strollers alike. Too many chemicals, to many hazardous tools, too many forklifts, too many sharp objects. If I came around a corner and tripped up on someones kid or dog.......:rolleye2:

As far as the pit bull attack.....after reading really quickly through most of the replies....Is all the attacking dogs owners got was a ticket? Was it ever answered where this attack happened? On the dog owners property? Public property? The dead dogs owners property? If on public property, I'm highly surprised the Pit was not taken into custody until a review was done on the dog to determined if it was indeed safe to be allowed back to its owners.
I have trained dogs for over 25 years and I have never heard of just getting a ticket in the case of another dog being killed.

Congratulations on the new puppy. I hope that it helps to ease the pain that you both have gone through.

I hope that you can pursue a resolution with your neighbor. That dog should not be loose in public.

Merry Christmas