What Speed Limit ????????
 

I had an interesting conversation with an old timer yesterday. He approached my wife and I at one of the public docks. He says I have seen you and that Beautiful Baja out on the lake every weekend this summer so can I ask you a question. He says today is the unofficial end of the boating season, so how was the first summer with a speed limit?

-So I told him to be honest, I have not boated any differently this year than the past 10 years. I always boat safely and responsibly; however when in open areas of the lake and all alone, I lay on the throttle and use my boat.

-My wife and I also told him we see people ignoring the speed limit everytime we go out..In fact I told him while skipping across the broads at a good clip not 20 minutes prior there was a Silly Fast Boat that passed us about 700' off the port side doing at least low 80s

-He then says to us WHAT SPEED LIMIT....he tells us that he lives on the Broads and sits on his dock and watches people shatter the day time speed limit all day and every day.


So it begs the question?

A. Have the Marine Patrol decided to allow speeding in open areas of the lake when it is not a danger to anyone

or

B. Does the MP just not have the resources to enforce the speed limit

or

C. Does the MP purposely not devote resources to speed limit enforcement as they dont see speeding as a major problem

Are we talking about the same lake? We live in an channel but wide enough so there's not a NWZ. The boats used to tear through here at all sorts of ungodly speeds (including last year at $4.50/gal). And the sound was deafening. This year I may have seen an occasional boat possibly going faster than 45 MPH in this part of the lake but the difference is like night and day. And putting the safety issue aside (unlikely to ever be agreement there), people who have come here comment on how much more quiet the lake is...it's great. A select few should not be allowed to ruin the lake experience for everybody. I would be very much reluctant to give up these hard fought gains we've achieved for Winni.

I have seen the opposite guess it depends on where you are on the lake
 

I live in bay that basically if the MP's aren't there then you can't be caught and there is only one way in and you can see them coming. Seems this year there has been more very fast watercrafts especially. I figured that they were afraid of getting caught speeding on the open lake so they duck in this bay to play and speed. I don't remember so many at these fast speeds in previous years but maybe.

Assuming you are telling us the truth, what's all the whoop then? If the speed limit is not negatively impacting the speeders, but the rest of society thinks it is working so well, why not just pacify us and let us have our "useless unenforceable feel-good law"? Don't give us that nonsense that you are just trying to keep our statutes pure of unnecessary laws. There are hundreds of more useless, less enforceable, and better-feeling laws on our books that would be the first targets of someone just looking to clean up the statutes. That one does not pass the sniff test. If, for argument's sake only, it is true that the MP has "decided to allow speeding in open areas of the lake when it is not a danger to anyone", "does not have the resources to enforce the speed limit", and "purposely does not devote resources to speed limit enforcement as they don't see speeding as a major problem", then it appears we are all happy with the status quo...you think the law is not negatively impacting anyone or costing any money or energy, and we think it is working just ducky. Everyone is happy. SO WHY ALL THE BIG NEED TO SUNSET IT??

Nice day out there today. And I was in the Broads and did not see a single boat that even approached 45 mph. Which Broads were you talking about? Sometimes I wonder if you guys are just making stuff up.

Are you one of them?
 

Seems like 'society' is made up of only a handfull of you. Where are the rest? Give us a list of names!

I have already send a list of over 100 landowners that don't want the 25 mph speed limit at night because of wake erosion. Perhaps you should ask the bill sponsor why he so 'conveniently' says, 'We have to start somewhere' instead of addressing our concerns.

My parents live on the Broads. I see boats traveling at the speed of light every day, all day! I'm just concerned of the lack of MPO's on the lake this year due to budget cuts and buying laser guns and spending precious time training!

I am a native of NH. I am a true Republican. The state was fine until the Democrats took over. There is even talk about removing the state motto!

I think it all just depends on where you are looking. I have seen days when people are tearing around and some that aren't.

For all the made up stuff I have read on these forums someone should really get a patent on it!!!

I know this question is probably patented but...

Did you ever notice the SUN (el sol) and the MOON (tortuga) never appear on the forum at the same time?

Ah maybe its la luna

FYI...I am not Walt Disney my first post is not Fiction!!!!!!

However if you want to believe I am full of it and no one has exceeded the speed limit on the lake all year that is your right.

Once again elchase posts things he has deluded himself into believing. The argument is tiresome. You keep your head in the bag of sand and the rest of us will continue to fight for real change on the lake that will address the problems that actually exist. Spare us the painting of the perfect lake picture that does not exist. Seriously though it is fun to read your posts. You sound like the Iraqi information minister during the war. Everyone remember Muhammad Saeed al-Sahhaf affectionately known as "Baghdad Bob?" "There are no Bombs, the Americans are being defeated." :laugh: Or in this case "The lake is a wonderfully safe place with no bad drivers." "The war is over we have won the safety war." :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

When the dust settles at least we all had a laugh right.

Let me know what channel so I can fix that for you.

I'll try this again.......

Have you discussed this year's lack of noise and speeders with BI? He posted not long ago that there are so many boats and some PWC's that go full throttle through the Bear Island NWZ that he thought it would be burdensome to call the MP every time it happened.

We discussed the BI NWZ at length last year, because I was bewildered as to why the MP wouldn't park near such an obvious violation zone. So maybe BI can give you a heads up as to how many "a select few" is.

No way chump! Lovin' things the way they are.

Chump? You really should choose your words much more wisely. There are alot of names I would like to refer to you as, but do not, to keep it civil. Smarten up!

I agree, lets keep it civil.. I am sure it was just a little razzing... but keep in mind when you post online people don't always know your "tone"... That's what the smiley faces are for.

Originally posted by TurtleBoy
So you live in a part of the lake that SOUND is an issue? This is why you support a speed limit because NOISE is an issue? Then be truthful and support a law that allows High Performance boats to legally use sound dampeners...switchable exhaust is currently illegal in NH!

Originally posted by VtSteve
I made it a point to go throught BI's channel this year to see what he was complaining about. I saw Mama Bear on the dock and BI up on the deck but as far as boats violating the NWZ? I personally witnesses several large boats coming up to the NW sign, each and every one dropped to headway speed when they arrived at the NWZ sign as required by law.

Ok, now you have done it, I don't feel real strong one way or the other about the speed limit even though I have expressed a Libertarian view of the issue, but name calling will close you guys down. I talked with Don during the FF on the Mt. Washington and he was thinking of closing this thread. I think the only reason he hasn't is because people are being civil. I haven't been following everyone's comments thread by thread, but this is the first example of a mild name calling i have seen.

I am certainly not an example of a perfect member, as per some really stupid posts of mine in the past, but I enjoy a good debate and hope that both sides can continue to post their opinions, particularly this important issue. Don't let this issue die, because of uncivil posts. Cheers!

How hypocritical. You guys badger, bully, insult, and name-call in every thread. That's ok so long as you are doing it, but someone responds to one of your "uncivil" threats with a comparatively gentle retort and you get all puffy. When you do it you call it "razzing". When we do it you call it "name calling". Grow up. Look at the post Turtle was responding to if you want to talk about "uncivil". Turtle says it is nice and quiet in the channel in front of his home and PM replies "Let me know what channel so I can fix that for you." That was civil? If you guys cared about being civil, you should have jumped all over him for that inappropriate comment. Or is harassing those with different views by threatening to head over to their home and torment them ok with you as long as nobody calls anyone a name? I'm called "la luna" and worse, but that's just "razzing" and when I make light of the "Thunderclub" I am accused of violating the forum rules. You guys really need to thicken up or else stick to the "opposer's thread" or offshoreonly where nobody is going to disagree with you. It's apparent that the moderator here is not going to let you flaunt the rules at your pleasure and then try to enforce them when it suits.

My post was intended to be funny, and I have never called anyone any names. And maybe Turtle Boy's response was an attempt at humor as well. You, however, are the one always looking to stir the pot. Your view's and opinions are not shared by the majority on this site. If we started a poll on whether Elchase stays or goes on this forum, I'm afraid it would be bye-bye for you. You need to lighten up a bit and stop your whining. You have your precious speed limit, and you feel safe and can enjoy the quiet, all by yourself.

Then you don't need a speed limit! :laugh:

Don't get it??? The speed limiit is why I'm lovin' it.

just my 2 cents... Nothing personal but lets call this what is actually is please... EL has done nothing but stir the pot time and time again. When directed at him or Turtle boy he crys foul. When a completely civil and productive conversation takes place he jumps in and trys to curve the conversation to get people into a tizzy.

These tactics were done before by others if you read back in the threads to try to disrupt and ultimately get the threads shut down. Those individuals that were very strong in their convictions for some reason have disappeared this time around, but suddenly there is EL who claims to be a person who has sat on the sidelines all those years now wants to be the leading advocat.

After reading many posts and just using common sense it is personally hard to believe.


I feel that in many of these threads we have made progress. We have determined that many people have issues on the lake and would like to have them dicussed and ultimately addressed. Please continue to discuss these in a civil manner and do not get dragged down the wrong path. That will only lead to these being shut down which is some posters true intentions.

There may be a speed limit on paper, but in reality, it doesn't exist any more than 65 MPH does on 93.

As much as I do not agree with elchase as much as the rest of you, this post is very true. You guys are getting your panties in a bunch over a "chump" comment. I made a post a week or so ago that had an acronymn (deserving)in it with a smiley face next to it, however, now when I post it doesn't post automatically (moderator has to review it to be posted). So, apparently I am being reprimanded for it.

I agree to keep the forum classy, however, pm's first response was clearly just humor. Turtle's response back (the "chump" response) also came off as humor to me. Brush it off, it's the internet.

So you think there is no speed limit on Rt93? Are you serious?

Yes, I know, you can go 5 or 10mph over the limit on Rt93 all the time and never get stopped. Try going 25 or 30mph over the limit and then tell me about it. By the way, give the Judge my best, you will be seeing him soon.

And that 65 number will suddenly be very important as they subtract it from your recorded speed to calculate your fine. And it is my understanding that if you are caught 15mph or more over the limit then court is required, you can't send in the fine.

There IS a speed limit on 93 and on Winnipesaukee.

BI... I think you are reading into the post.. I think what he was saying is that the limit isn't set in stone and you will see people traveling over the given speed limit as you do on 93. Obviously blatent offenders will be pulled over as would someone operating a boat recklessly for the conditions on Lake Winni whether there is a speed limit or not.

There are many people that do 90+ on 93 and do not get caught. Of course, you can't do it all the time, or you will get caught. As far as the lake, I don't mind crusing at 45- 50 ish, but, once in a while, if that is exceeded, chances are there will be no repercussions. I already have my compromise.

So you make a good argument that we don't need a compromise (except 45/25 was the compromise, 45 MPH being very fast). You also make a good argument for lowering 45 to 40.As we saw from a post about the GFBL pulled over one evening 2 weeks ago, eventually you'll get caught, and the expense and trouble will indeed slow you down in the future.

People are still going through the NWZ at cruising speeds. It happens every day but I can't give you numbers. The Marine Patrol hang out "around the corner" quite often and do boat stops. Sometimes they get people going through at high speed but mostly they are stopping boats that are going a little to fast to be considered "no wake".

They also regularly stop multiple PWCs outside the NWZ, I assume for being to close together. I guess there is a common belief that PWCs traveling together don't need to stay 150' apart. The MP explain this error.

All in all things were a lot quieter this summer. I like to think the SL is a big part of that but who can say? I do think the SL is at least a little part of the improvement.

I'm sure you caught heck for your last post, which seemed more like a Cowboy Mentality to me. It's far more beneficial for everyone involved in these "discussions" if people didn't feel such pressure to stick to one side or another. Except for you and me BI, there really isn't anyone else that mentions the BI NWZ, especially on your "side" of this issue. I personally, find violations of NWZ's to be irritating at best, at least very annoying.

You bring a fair game to the discussion BI, and I always respect your positions, whenever you're not reluctant to show them. Your post above, as compared to others on the very same subject, are not consistent observations. Believe me, there are many people that are against the speed limit that support your positions in some areas, particularly the safety aspect. The biggest thing we all offered for those like yourself, is a constant discussion towards enforcement of the obvious laws, and necessary MP support. One of the many areas the SL crowd is pretty weak in.

Two questions
 

First, in what way do you consider 45/25 to be "the compromise" ? IIRC those were the numbers proposed in the original HB162 per Rep Pilliod.

Second, what's your reasoning for lowering the 45 to 40 ? Am I to understand that you think the 50 MPH mentioned above is too fast ? Specifically, that 50 is not just unlawful but dangerous to the public at large ?

ELCHASE “I'm called "la luna" and worse, but that's just "razzing"”

My post on 9/8/2009:

“ I know this question is probably patented but...

Did you ever notice the SUN (el sol) and the MOON (tortuga) never appear on the forum at the same time?

Ah maybe its la luna “

1. la luna = the moon
2. If you took this to mean you (elchase) then I called you the Sun..or the Moon...now I am confused :eek:…not sure what the insult would be there.

The intension of my post was not to call you a name. However I guess if I need to explain a joke…it was not funny in the first place. My Bad.

I don't think that has anything to do with the SL..... Economy *****s all.

You can only hope.

All in all I do not believe that the SL has had any impact on the lake. I fully blame weather and economy but... as you said, who can really say. I do appreciate your posts and views. In light of what we are seeing from a select one or two individual supporters on this forum it is refreshing to have you back B.I. In the past I may have gotten heated with you over this topic but I've come to appreciate your position and the reasons you give. You have never varied from your belief. You also seem to have an open mind and at least listen and debate openly.

I'm thinking that you probably witness many a violation at that particular spot on the lake. I know I witness chaos every weekend where my Camp is. One thing that I appreciate is that you have not pretended that this law has some how solved every problem that plagues Winni.

Just wondering, this time of year how much traffic do you usually see there? Not only violations.... Just curious.. I would assume it is very very quiet like in my area.

Lots of High Performance Boats out Saturday, It was like the Powerboat Races were back. Loved every second of it, one guy must have made 5 or 6 passes across Rattlesnake. Of course everyone was operating within all aspects of the law.

We enjoyed the show as well. Kept RG busy with the camera. It was especially interesting because of how rough the water was on Saturday. The blue boat seemed to be having some real fun having the lake all to themselves.

Attended the Vintage Race by Boat Saturday
 

It was 'ROUGH' on the Broads. I haven't seen this condition in a long time. The wind was blowing from the Northwest. It was fun crossing from North to South with the wind. The wind did not die down toward the end of the day. Against the wind, it was a bit intimidatiing for a 22 footer. I had to take it slow home. There were a few 'dancers' out there having fun. I was jealous. I was surprise to see a PWC off of Welch. The guy appeared to be having trouble. I noticed he was heading back to the island. I watch to make sure he was safe.

There was one guy at the regatta preaching the speed limit. Nobody gave him a time of day. He was definitely at the wrong place at the wrong time. He was really turning people off. Good news for the opposers.

Broad Fun!
 

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I totally loved seeing the high Performance Boats this past weekend! The first three shots are from Saturday out on The Broads.
The last one was taken as we were leaving Smith Cove.

I wish the Powerboat Races would return!

I wish the powerboat races would return, too, RG. Weren't they great? And you must have had the best seat in the house!