Generally 5% but many realtors will cut that to 4% if they sell it without another realtor involved.

If you are listing a property you don't really want to go below the 5% because many realtors will not show a co-broke property to a client if their half of the deal is not at least 2 1/2%.

I think demand was so I high I couldn't get much response (as a buyer) from non listing agents. But when I called the listing agents they they were much more responsive.

Are you fricken kidding me? You would let those things get in your way of considering a property?

The entire process of "staging" a property is over rated. Because if it is staged in a different way then a potential buyer would want to see it, it can actually work against you....

What if the owner prefers not to use a bed frame some people don't.... Just because you think they are necessary doesn't mean they are....

So a couple of Adirondack chairs are blown over.... what if the person looking at the photos doesn't even like Adirondack chairs....

Perception is important don't get me wrong. But the things mentioned here are frivolous... If I was able to afford to look at property for 4M$.... I am likely also planning to come in and spend an additional 500K - 1M$ to make updates to the property to make it mine...

Last if I was buying a 4M$ piece of property, I would also be investing some money, in a thorough inspection of the home including heating and hot water systems as well as the structure itself to insure I knew what I was buying.

In the end the pictures are fine... only nit picky people would be offended by them.

Likewise folks spending $4million could care less if it needs a new furnace.

I waived inspections to make my offers look stronger on several properties.

Inspections are mostly an escape clause or a plan to re-negotiate price and generally weaken your offer. You either really want the property or you don’t. You really gonna reject a $4m home over a leaky water heater? Or renegotiate for a $1000 off, when they have 2 cash backup offers waiting in wings? I don’t think so.

One place I made an offer on with no contingencies and site unseen.

That’s what you need to do in today’s market.

If you hesitate or put down any more contingencies than someone else, you’re out.

It looks to me like someone just went with a "make me move" price on this. Shoot for the stars and if someone is dumb enough to pay it, pack up and go. There are far better properties on the lake for less money, even in todays market. The inside is clean but in need of updating. Outside the deck and roof looks ratty, it could certainly use maintenance and landscaping, and the driveway isn't even paved.

Maybe my freshly renovated island property should be $2mil now! :D

You are definitely underestimating inspections. You have only highlighted small issues and left out major expensive issues such as structural integrity of framing, HVAC, roof replacement, foundation issues, mold, termites, dry rot etc. many buyers use inspections to justify they are paying for what they think they are getting and not as a negotiation tool.

Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

Agreed, esp in this market where you are possibly paying over listing to get the property.
If it was a buyers market and you are making an offer well below listing then sometimes waving the inspection is a great tool knowing that you are going to go in and rehab the property anyway.

I agree people use inspections for re-negotiations, it's unbelievable what's happening to a friend. They are picking apart every little nit picky thing on what is clearly a perfect condition house. It's causing him a lot of unnecessary pain as he finally said sorry no deal and moved onto the next offer he had. I have a good friend who owns a real estate business in Mass with 6 offices - she HATES what it's all turned into.

I also agree on a 4M property that the owners are dumping another $$$ into it and most likely only care about the big ticket stuff which is not the furnace.

Agreed?
 

I think by now, we're all agreed that this is not a $4MM property.
I'm not generally enthusiastic about home inspections, but last house, I took my HVAC guy with me for the walk through. (No charge) He said the furnace was no good and the seller knocked $5K off without hesitation. He apparently had more credibility than a home inspector. Ironic to me however, is that wouldn't buy a boat without a survey. My experience is that boat surveys, at least on larger boats are more detailed than home inspections--multi: engines, heads, AC systems, electric systems, generator etc, etc. I had one home inspector turn on a furnace, it fired and he turned it off, gave a good report. In reality, the furnace would only run about 5 minutes and then shut itself off because the system was perforated and it would pump CO into the house. His fee was a waste. Yes, I know banks require it, if that's how you're buying.

I think there are some broad generalizations being made. A lot of people that have accumulated the wealth needed to afford a $4mm house got that way because they invested wisely and didn't squander money. I agree that people that drop that kind of coin on a house will likely want to make improvements to make the house fit their tastes. I don't consider replacing a furnace, a roof, etc. an improvement. It's deferred maintenance the prior owner should have done and reduces the budget for putting in flooring, kitchens, etc. If someone is looking at that house and seeing plastic adirondack chairs all over the back yard, a roof covered in pine needles, etc. I think a pretty fair question to ask is what kind of care of the house did the owner take.

Regarding the price tag, that neighborhood is around the corner from me and is really nice but that house isn't a $4mm house.

As far as inspections go. If it’s a 30 year old house and the original HVAC. It doesn’t matter if it works or not. It’s essentially worthless. Similar on a roof, if it’s 20 years old it needs replacing “soon” if it leaks or not. If it’s a 10 year older house and the HVAC is broken, just fix it.

If the house is $250K these things matter. At $4M they are a minor nuisance.

Structural issues that are not obvious, in expensive homes are not that common.

Fir the most part, my experience with building inspectors on both sides has been a joke. But they can be handy for other reasons (for the buyer).

Septic inspection and site assessment are way more important.

Staging is not overrated. Nearly all real estate agents focus on this because first impressions are lasting ones and it gives them a competitive edge. They aren't doing it for fun. They will also tell you to paint the walls, get rid of personal photos, clean up the basement, re-carpet the dining room and maybe rearrange some furniture. Simply stated, a place that looks clean and well-cared for is more attractive than one that isn't. It gets folks in the door who might otherwise walk by. Especially these days when people make quick decisions over the Internet. If they see pictures of unkempt properties, then a perfectly qualified buyer just might just move on to the next listing. I would likely approach just such a property with, at a minimum, elevated suspicion.

Especially a property like this where they are trying to get $4M for a $2.5M+. Why wouldn't you take the simple extra steps to clean it up? Yes, a lot of it's smoke and mirrors, but if it gets more people in the door then why not? Take two properties, exactly the same, except one is clean and the other is not. The clean one is going to get more interest and better offers.

Of course, in a very narrow slice of some very rare market, such as Winni lakefront during this Pandemic, people are stumbling over one another to buy those properties, all the while practicing less due diligence than they would in normal times. Staging is probably less critical in these situations. However, this is the exception rather than the rule. Still, to get a bit of advantage, why wouldn't you just do the simple things at least? It doesn't take a huge amount of effort to turn the chairs over.

A good thing with all this is that there still are people, like the owner/realtor of this property, that apparently don't give a hoot about staging. That does create opportunities for folks like you, LIfor, that place little emphasis on these things and will always investigate further. Maybe you can get a better deal because of that. But in that case we're talking about an advantage for buyers/still a disadvantage for sellers.

Marketing when selling or buying a home
 

From my personal experience over the last decade, I can give you a few comments on the marketing/photography of home sales from both the selling and buying perspective. Just my opinion...

Selling: In 2014, wife and I decided we were moving within Westchester County NY. We used a "friend" who was a well thought-of realtor. Well, we pulled the listing after 3 months and I believe we had less than 10 showings. There didn't seem to be too much interest. We paused to regroup.

We decided to try again, after a 6 month break. We thought about it and decided to research, ask questions, etc. We found the top realtor (by sales and reputation) in the area and decided to interview her. Turns out she interviewed us, as she was that in demand. She accepted us, put us through our paces...made us stage our house, remove things, etc. She brought in a professional photographer (on her dime). We had 40 realtors at the realtor open house. We had 2 offers on the day it was officially listed. Sold it for the same amount that the first realtor couldn't get a nibble at...

Buying: We purchased a home in Wolfeboro last year. I don't want to name names, but it was not marketed well, and because of that, it sat for 3-4 months and it should have sold quickly. The pictures were done with a cell phone. Because of that...even though we found the house late, we lucked out. Had it been marketed better, we'd not have been able to get it. Don't let lousy photos keep you away. As a buyer, poor marketing can be an ally, as you might have a diamond in the rough.

Sellers need to tell buyers during the offer and accept phase not to bother trying to nickel and dime after the inspection process. That they will fix fundamental problems but not normal wear and tear.

After reading all of the comments and looking at the listing, I just had to look up the owner.

He is a recent widower, and his wife of 63 years was a big contributor and volunteer to the M. Library for many years, as well as a Minister in Meredith. She passed 3 years ago.

At his age, I'm thinking he is less concerned with the chairs being down outside and just wants to downsize into a smaller home that doesn't hold so many memories.

I hope he gets though the winter in an easier place to manage.

As a fellow waterfront property owner I truly hope the owner of this place gets over the asking price. I think any negative comments are directed at the realtor rather than the owner. They either mislead the man into what could be expected in order to get the listing (very common) or all involved understand they are just taking a wild shot at the moon with nothing to lose. Either way given what the realtor would make on this deal a few of the pics could have been done a bit better.

A 4 million dollar property would pay a hefty commission. The reality should have taken it upon herself/himself to higher someone to clean the place up and take professional pictures.

I obviously meant the current owner no ill will and I wish him nothing but the best as he moves on from his home. And if someone pays him 4 million dollars for his home more power to him. At the end of the day he owns the place and I'm commenting on a message board in the middle of the work day to avoid the stacks of work on my desk.

However, I do agree with others that I think this reflects poorly on the realtor. If we assume a split of the 5% commission between the buying and selling realtors, and then also assume that the realtor splits half of the commission with their broker as I know many do: 5% of 4 million is 200,000, half of that is 100,000 and half of that is 50,000. So we're looking a possible 50k dollar payday for the realtor and they didn't put the effort in to tidying up the place a little. Sweeping, raking, and stacking chairs doesn't cost any money.

And LIforrelaxing, while you might argue that staging is pointless because rich people will spend money anyhow, I don't think you turn anyone off by having the place look well kempt. In other words, no one looks at a clean porch on the listing and says "Nope, not for me, I don't see pine needles all over the place and how dare they neatly arrange their chairs around the fire pit." Yet, posting it the way they did turned me and at least a few others off.

Also, how far does the "rich people are gonna spend money anyways" theory go? If you bought a new Bentley Continental GT should you expect the car to be clean when you pick it up at the dealer? Or is it assumed since you have the money to buy the Bentley you have the money to take it through the car wash too?

I think that house had to be at least partially staged. I can't imagine a single 83 year old man keeping his house like that.

Agents typically don't split 50/50 with their broker unless they cut a really bad deal when they signed on. Sometimes listing agents will favor the split towards themselves, like a 3% to listing agent/ 2% to buyers agent. This usually pisses off buyers agents, but money is money.

The listing office gets a cut also so that's usually why the listing agent gets more.

I absolutely stand corrected then. If anything I was trying to put together the most conservative estimate of what the listing agent stood to gain. And again, no insult intended to anyone involved, just some constructive criticism from the cheap seats.

Just a "tiny" price cut
 

Well, they've dropped the listing price almost 20% down to $3.25M. Still too high IMO, I think if they sell at all, it'll be in the $2.0 - $2.5 range.

I recently spoke to a local realtor to ask who are the people selling their homes here to the newcomers (mostly MA 80%, then CT, NY, NJ buyers), and was surprised by the answer.

Many of the sales are from elderly people who don't want to keep up with a 2nd home and would rather cash out in a good market, feeling they can always rent for a few summer weeks if they miss the area.

Another group- the adult children of the recently deceased (or their parents have moved to a long term facility) and are unwilling or cannot come to an agreement on covering the costs of keeping the family vacation home, vacation black out days, whether to rent it out, etc.

This group is typically where the selling price seems too high or unreasonable- there's in-fighting, one sibling may want to keep it, and the others want the money instead- many price it higher, against a realtor's instincts, hoping some out of towner will jump at it.

Lastly, those that are divorcing are selling their vacation homes as well.

I just hope the new residents are friendly, adapt to NH, and don't try to change what we have here.

Thought provoking summary of sellers
 

Marinewife, your seller/buyer summary is very interesting. We fall into the senior category, and we were just discussing the headaches involved in owning 2 properties, 1500 miles apart. We both dislike extreme temperatures....Florida is beastly hot from May through September, and we all know how frigid it is here during the winter months, but it’s nice having the option of going to either one when you want to....plus you have your own belongings, etc, and don’t have to worry about what creature occupied the place the week before. 🤨 It’s a tough one, and the older you get, the less patience and ability you have to cope with problems that come up. A dilemma, for sure.

Is there not a place that's temperature all year? The Carolinas? Arizona? I don't really know, but my wife and I have often talked about our future in retirement and am interested in knowing options other than what you've identified.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

Tough question
 

I guess there’s no perfect place.....some have claimed that the panhandle of Florida is more temperate....also some love Hilton Head, SC. For you, I would think that anywhere South, and hanging on to Arcadia, would be perfect.

I spent over 3 years doing research on where to move before moving here.

Being an East Coast person for most of my life, I couldn't picture moving out west
and dealing with a completely different set of issues and unknowns.

The south, well, I don't think real southerners seem to accept or appreciate northerners, I could be wrong. There's a recent study on where people move from and to for all 50 states, and the south has maybe 5-10% of northerners in SC, NC and FL, mostly due to weather. I have relatives who moved to FL and NC, and while they're in gated communities or regular neighborhood homes, they say the people are different.

That left the mid-Atlantic and NE states. Tax-wise and in terms of natural beauty, NH seemed to have the best circumstances for me.

While I would love a shorter winter than what is up here, I guess my answer will be to rent somewhere for a few weeks to get a break from the cold. I think if I had two houses, I'd always be worried about the one I WASN'T in during any weather issue, and I'm getting too old for constant worry.

~just my two cents

The more things change, the more they stay the same...
 

Way back in the 70's, when my parents bought their vaca home at the lake, their realtor, who was also a family friend, told them that 2nd homes are mainly put up for sale because either the owners are old and can't afford it or keep it up anymore, or the kids don't want it, (or they can't afford it), or there's a life-changing event, like a divorce, major illness, spouse death, etc. So it's really no different right now, with the exception of the sudden huge spike in prices that is maybe motivating some folks to sell to take the money and run. I also believe that the majority of 2nd home owners have always been out-of-staters, so again, I don't think there is anything new going on.

Mr Think:

To your point of where to go in retirement, we are having that same discussion in our house. We envision being at the lake 1/2 the year and "somewhere more south" the other part of the year, but we don't know where. Neither of us like FL...we have some friends in SC who absolutely love it, but we've never been there. I guess the thing to do is pick a few places and do some long weekends or a week or two there to get a feel for the areas. Then we'll be the out-of-staters that the locals will hate...HA:laugh:

This appears to be something many here are familiar, or are dealing, with, so I'll start a new thread!

Sent from my SM-G950U using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

Unreal. Now under contract... We shall see what it will actually sell for... Dropped from original asking of $3.995M to currently listed at $3.25M.

$1.5 and two days free bulldozer work. It isn't a $3MM house.

I love it when you start seeing panic buying...

No better position to be in as a seller!

Let me guess - Cash, no inspections, no contingencies, close within 30 - 45 or however fast the seller can get their ducks in a row.

thank you water front owners for paying my property tax!! THANK YOU

in the end a house is worth what one person is willing to pay

You're very welcome!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

Today, 518 Weirs Blvd. 540 sq ft condo cottage, $399K. Really! :eek:

Closed at $3M
 

Prices just keep going up, and up, and up. Where it will stop, no body knows? :rolleye1: