Booster shot: Not as easy as you might think

[Seaplane Pilot]

This guy got 4 shots of his own juice. I have no words.....

And coming from CNN, it can't be fake news.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/15/healt...ive/index.html

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

This guy got 4 shots of his own juice. I have no words.....

And coming from CNN, it can't be fake news.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/15/healt...ive/index.html

Not surprising at all, especially since the symptoms are mild. As multiple Forum posters have detailed, the vaccines are not perfect. A bit odd you don't remember this?

For folks who believe in statistics, probability, data, etc--the vaccines have been shown to greatly reduce your chance of getting covid, and do even better at preventing serious effects. Tons of infor available if you Google something like "covid vaccine effectiveness", or "have covid vaccines saved lives"

[John Mercier]

I think the most a vaccine can do is create a herd immunity.

Even the small pox vaccine was to be administered every ten years.

So after the last US case, we continued to use it for a few decades among the masses.

[Major]

I am sorry, but if you read Robert Kennedy's book, there is NO valid study as to the effectiveness of any COVID vaccine. As he did with AIDS vaccines, there are no studies conducted by Dr. Fraud of any COVID vaccine having a valid control group in which candidates were given no vaccine or a placebo. Dr. Fraud has a rich history of pumping ineffective vaccines and short circuiting the testing process. Unfortunately, there is no data showing the ineffectiveness (or effectiveness) of the COVID vaccines.

Also, you should read Robert Kennedy's book before you denounce it. It does not paint a pretty picture for the effectiveness and safety of vaccines in general. However, it is well researched and footnoted. The COVID vaccine is historically unsafe when compared to other vaccines.

Everyone has an antidotal story about someone who died of something that is relatively rare. The statistics that people should look at are average age of death (83+) and average number of co-morbidities (4+). It is old and sickly people who die with COVID, not necessarily from COVID. I am 57 and statistically speaking I have a better chance dying in a car accident than dying from COVID. The people who want to keep the COVID panic going will dispute this, but thems the "facts."

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by Major

I am sorry, but if you read Robert Kennedy's book, there is NO valid study as to the effectiveness of any COVID vaccine. As he did with AIDS vaccines, there are no studies conducted by Dr. Fraud of any COVID vaccine having a valid control group in which candidates were given no vaccine or a placebo. Dr. Fraud has a rich history of pumping ineffective vaccines and short circuiting the testing process. Unfortunately, there is no data showing the ineffectiveness (or effectiveness) of the COVID vaccines.

Also, you should read Robert Kennedy's book before you denounce it. It does not paint a pretty picture for the effectiveness and safety of vaccines in general. However, it is well researched and footnoted. The COVID vaccine is historically unsafe when compared to other vaccines.

Everyone has an antidotal story about someone who died of something that is relatively rare. The statistics that people should look at are average age of death (83+) and average number of co-morbidities (4+). It is old and sickly people who die with COVID, not necessarily from COVID. I am 57 and statistically speaking I have a better chance dying in a car accident than dying from COVID. The people who want to keep the COVID panic going will dispute this, but thems the "facts."

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04516746
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT05046548

https://www.npr.org/2020/12/22/94930...s-be-unblinded

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-re...sults-landmark

By the way, Dr. Fauci isn't responsible for doing or reviewing double-blind studies.

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Not surprising at all, especially since the symptoms are mild. As multiple Forum posters have detailed, the vaccines are not perfect. A bit odd you don't remember this?

For folks who believe in statistics, probability, data, etc--the vaccines have been shown to greatly reduce your chance of getting covid, and do even better at preventing serious effects. Tons of infor available if you Google something like "covid vaccine effectiveness", or "have covid vaccines saved lives"

Oh don’t worry, I clearly remember. But I don’t believe the self-appointed experts on this forum. My position on this issue has not wavered, unlike the opinion of the “experts” at the CDC and Fauci himself.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

Oh don’t worry, I clearly remember. But I don’t believe the self-appointed experts on this forum. My position on this issue has not wavered, unlike the opinion of the “experts” at the CDC and Fauci himself.

Not asking you to believe me or experts. But as I posted, I hope someday you'll consider statistics, data, probability, clinical trials, etc

[Major]

From Robert Kennedy's book.

Dr. Fauci has been in bed with vaccine manufacturers for decades. Here are six strategies that Dr. Fauci employed with the assistance of drug companies to greenlight new vaccines.

1. To abort the three-year clinical trials at six months and then vaccinate the controls - a preemption that would prevent detection of long-term injuries.

2. To refuse to fix HHS's designated-to-fail vaccine injury surveillance system (VAERS), which systematically suppresses reporting of most vaccine injuries.

3. To enlist mainstream and social media companies to make reporting of injuries and deaths disappear from the airwaves, newspapers, and the Internet, and therefore from public consciousness.

4. To discourage autopsies in deaths following vaccination.

5. To populate key FDA and CDC committees with NIAID, NIH, and Gates Foundation grantees and loyalists to insure rubber-stamp approvals of the mRNA vaccines, without any long-term studies.

6. To eliminate the control group to hid vaccine injuries by striving to vaccinate the entire population.

Kennedy uses the Pfizer vaccine as an example. "At this book's November 2021 publication date, only Phizer's COVID vaccine, known as Comirnaty, had won FDA approval. . . . The final summary of the Pfizer's six-month clinical trial data - the document that Pfizer submitted to the FDA to win approval - revealed one key data point that should have killed the intervention forever. Far more people died in the vaccine group than in the placebo group during Pfizer's clinical trials." Further, the Pfizer vaccine was shown to prevent a single COVID fatality among 22,000 vaccine recipients, whereas the placebo group had two deaths.

I am not an anti-vaxer. I was in the Army for 24 years and was a human pincushion for their vaccines. All I want to show is that we should have a healthy skepticism of our political and governmental leaders, and look to see what other motivations they have to justify what they are doing. Dr. Fauci has a long history in partnering with big Pharma and the Gates foundation, and as a result has achieved phenomenal personal wealth.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

From Robert Kennedy's book.

Dr. Fauci has been in bed with vaccine manufacturers for decades. Here are six strategies that Dr. Fauci employed with the assistance of drug companies to greenlight new vaccines.

1. To abort the three-year clinical trials at six months and then vaccinate the controls - a preemption that would prevent detection of long-term injuries.

2. To refuse to fix HHS's designated-to-fail vaccine injury surveillance system (VAERS), which systematically suppresses reporting of most vaccine injuries.

3. To enlist mainstream and social media companies to make reporting of injuries and deaths disappear from the airwaves, newspapers, and the Internet, and therefore from public consciousness.

4. To discourage autopsies in deaths following vaccination.

5. To populate key FDA and CDC committees with NIAID, NIH, and Gates Foundation grantees and loyalists to insure rubber-stamp approvals of the mRNA vaccines, without any long-term studies.

6. To eliminate the control group to hid vaccine injuries by striving to vaccinate the entire population.

Kennedy uses the Pfizer vaccine as an example. "At this book's November 2021 publication date, only Phizer's COVID vaccine, known as Comirnaty, had won FDA approval. . . . The final summary of the Pfizer's six-month clinical trial data - the document that Pfizer submitted to the FDA to win approval - revealed one key data point that should have killed the intervention forever. Far more people died in the vaccine group than in the placebo group during Pfizer's clinical trials." Further, the Pfizer vaccine was shown to prevent a single COVID fatality among 22,000 vaccine recipients, whereas the placebo group had two deaths.

I am not an anti-vaxer. I was in the Army for 24 years and was a human pincushion for their vaccines. All I want to show is that we should have a healthy skepticism of our political and governmental leaders, and look to see what other motivations they have to justify what they are doing. Dr. Fauci has a long history in partnering with big Pharma and the Gates foundation, and as a result has achieved phenomenal personal wealth.

You're not an anti-vaxer? Hahaha--stop making me laugh. This is your fourth or fifth post promoting the country's number one anti-vaxer. Robert Kennedy,as I've posted before, is an absolute nut who is opposed to all vaccines.

But to your other misleading points--Fauci does not "greenlight" vaccines. That is the FDA's job based on rigorous clinical trials. This and throwing in Gates is only fear mongering.

The Pharma industry is not perfect, and is often incredibly greedy. But has produced amazing results, and is keeping many of us alive, likely including your family members. This is the source of the vaccines.

For folks who do not trust Pharma to produce great drugs, the approval process, or the system in general--I encourage you to also stay away from your blood pressure medication, your statins, your insulin, your reflux meds, your Viagra...it's all coming from the same place

[Major]

Before you judge, read the book. Otherwise you have absolutely no standing to weigh in or even comment on it. I have never read a book that was as well researched.

As for the other drugs - blood pressure medication, statins, insulin, reflux meds - I actually think people should avoid having to use these drugs by living healthier lifestyles. Don't think for a second that Big Pharma doesn't LOVE fat Americans! All the drugs you listed treat afflictions that are caused by poor diet and health choices. A person is much better off losing weight than using these drugs.

[Major]

He may not personally greenlight new drugs, but he wields tremendous power within his agency, which influences the FDA. He functions as the king maker for any new drug that treats infectious diseases. Answer this, why is he so wealthy? He rigged the system so that he gets a cut of royalties on patents developed by his agency in partnership with pharma companies. He has a vested, self interest in making sure that the vaccines that he participated in developing make it big. You would know this if you read Kennedy's book.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

Before you judge, read the book. Otherwise you have absolutely no standing to weigh in or even comment on it. I have never read a book that was as well researched.

As for the other drugs - blood pressure medication, statins, insulin, reflux meds - I actually think people should avoid having to use these drugs by living healthier lifestyles. Don't think for a second that Big Pharma doesn't LOVE fat Americans! All the drugs you listed treat afflictions that are caused by poor diet and health choices. A person is much better off losing weight than using these drugs.

I agree lifestyle changes are best. But as you so often do, you veer from the main point...

Kennedy's criticism of vaccines, and your own, is based on fear and conspiracy theories. These nutty critiques could just as easily be applied to Pharma and the FDA in general. But this presents a problem--all of us have loved ones being kept alive by the industry and processes you fear. We all know that our lives would be more difficult and much shorter without pharmaceuticals and the FDA.

The people keeping your blood pressure, cholesterol, diabetes, reflux, and cancer in check; and saved you from polio and a half-dozen other horrific diseases, are the same people who developed the covid vaccines.

[Major]

Actually, since you don't know me, I will tell you that I am not a fearful person. I was an engineer who became an attorney. As a youngster, I was good at math and science. I have a thing for statistics. I do not get off at promoting fear.

I look at the data without prejudice or disclaimer. To quote a great coach, it is what it is. Kennedy provides graphs of mortality versus year for vaccines including measles, pertussis (whatever that is!), influenza, tuberculosis, scarlet fever and polio, and without exception, the introduction of the vaccine had very little impact on reducing the rate of mortality. The polio graph is the one that surprised me, since as with everyone else, I was told that the polio vaccine eliminated polio. It did not. The rate of mortality was dropping by the time the live polio vaccine was introduced (circa 1960) and continued on the same downward trend until it was effectively eradicated in 1980.

As far as propagating fear, which side is propagating the most fear, the left about the so-called dangerousness of COVID or the right about having a skepticism about vaccines, lockdowns, social distancing, masks, etc. The government's reaction answers that question.

[John Mercier]

So you went to the military and got about six vaccines that Kennedy has stated will either kill you, cripple you, or make you stupid.

Are you crippled?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamand...h=9e15a8e7d5f7

Now, do you want to see how much Kennedy has made?

[Major]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

So you went to the military and got about six vaccines that Kennedy has stated will either kill you, cripple you, or make you stupid.

Are you crippled?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamand...h=9e15a8e7d5f7

Now, do you want to see how much Kennedy has made?

Did you read his book? Why do people have such a difficult time with nuance? There is a lot of gray in the area between absolutes. So according to you (and Scott, I guess) every vaccine is 100% safe and effective and if someone expresses some healthy skepticism, they believe that every vaccine is dangerous and ineffective. At least in this book, I did not read where he said that all these vaccines are expressly dangerous. However, his ultimate conclusion is that the benefits do not outweigh the risks. That's all. Again, read the book and come to your own conclusions. Have an open mind. I do.

I don't care how much Kennedy is worth. He's a private citizen who made his money by inheriting it and in the private sector, I guess. As taxpayers, we should be critical of those who make money when in office. Fauci is one of a long line of career bureaucrats who have become wealthy through so-called government service. See Biden, Pelosi, and the ilk. Yet the left is obsessed with people who made their money in the private sector and then decide to go into public service. See Trump.

And finally, no I am not crippled, but my wife would sometimes profess that I am profoundly stupid!

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

Did you read his book? Why do people have such a difficult time with nuance?

Kennedy is a dangerous person whose primary tactic is to raise BS questions in the name of "nuance". His goal is to raise just enough doubt that a few gullible people send him money and/or skip vaccines that are very important to their health. But of course, there is no nuance with respect to the vaccines that are a standard part of US healthcare--they have saved millions of lives and are extremely safe. Thank goodness the vast majority of Americans are too smart to fall for his garbage.

[Major]

I find it shameful that most Americans fell for the sky is falling, chicken little alarmists of the so-called dangerousness of the virus. I wish more Americans were smart enough to figure out this was a media and social media crisis used to scare us into compliance. If more Americans understood statistics and past histories of similar viruses, the unconstitutional lockdowns would have never happened. But hey, at least they are smart enough to stand in line for a vaccine that doesn't work and may be harmful.

[John Mercier]

No one claimed the vaccines were 100% effect or had no serious health effects to some members of the population.
You took at least six that have histories that are worse...
Where you an alarmist?

The only claim I refuted, is the false one that you inferred that Fauci made all his money from vaccines... and the other false one that he approves the vaccines. That would be like suggesting that President Trump personally approved the vaccines... which is also false.

[Major]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

No one claimed the vaccines were 100% effect or had no serious health effects to some members of the population.
You took at least six that have histories that are worse...
Where you an alarmist?

The only claim I refuted, is the false one that you inferred that Fauci made all his money from vaccines... and the other false one that he approves the vaccines. That would be like suggesting that President Trump personally approved the vaccines... which is also false.

You provided a link that showed one year of income. My claim hasn't been proven false. Dr. Fauci is worth in excess of $10,000,000. How does a "civil servant" become so wealthy? He has earned millions in royalties in his career. Also, I am sure he has invested wisely, much like Mr. Nancy Pelosi.

[John Mercier]

I'm younger than he, have made far less yearly, and have about two-thirds of his estimated wealth.

The secret... save and invest.