What Speed Limit ????????
I had an interesting conversation with an old timer yesterday. He approached my wife and I at one of the public docks. He says I have seen you and that Beautiful Baja out on the lake every weekend this summer so can I ask you a question. He says today is the unofficial end of the boating season, so how was the first summer with a speed limit?
-So I told him to be honest, I have not boated any differently this year than the past 10 years. I always boat safely and responsibly; however when in open areas of the lake and all alone, I lay on the throttle and use my boat. -My wife and I also told him we see people ignoring the speed limit everytime we go out..In fact I told him while skipping across the broads at a good clip not 20 minutes prior there was a Silly Fast Boat that passed us about 700' off the port side doing at least low 80s -He then says to us WHAT SPEED LIMIT....he tells us that he lives on the Broads and sits on his dock and watches people shatter the day time speed limit all day and every day. So it begs the question? A. Have the Marine Patrol decided to allow speeding in open areas of the lake when it is not a danger to anyone or B. Does the MP just not have the resources to enforce the speed limit or C. Does the MP purposely not devote resources to speed limit enforcement as they dont see speeding as a major problem |
Are we talking about the same lake? We live in an channel but wide enough so there's not a NWZ. The boats used to tear through here at all sorts of ungodly speeds (including last year at $4.50/gal). And the sound was deafening. This year I may have seen an occasional boat possibly going faster than 45 MPH in this part of the lake but the difference is like night and day. And putting the safety issue aside (unlikely to ever be agreement there), people who have come here comment on how much more quiet the lake is...it's great. A select few should not be allowed to ruin the lake experience for everybody. I would be very much reluctant to give up these hard fought gains we've achieved for Winni.
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I have seen the opposite guess it depends on where you are on the lake
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Nice day out there today. And I was in the Broads and did not see a single boat that even approached 45 mph. Which Broads were you talking about? Sometimes I wonder if you guys are just making stuff up. |
Are you one of them?
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I have already send a list of over 100 landowners that don't want the 25 mph speed limit at night because of wake erosion. Perhaps you should ask the bill sponsor why he so 'conveniently' says, 'We have to start somewhere' instead of addressing our concerns. My parents live on the Broads. I see boats traveling at the speed of light every day, all day! I'm just concerned of the lack of MPO's on the lake this year due to budget cuts and buying laser guns and spending precious time training! I am a native of NH. I am a true Republican. The state was fine until the Democrats took over. There is even talk about removing the state motto! |
I think it all just depends on where you are looking. I have seen days when people are tearing around and some that aren't.
For all the made up stuff I have read on these forums someone should really get a patent on it!!! |
I know this question is probably patented but...
Did you ever notice the SUN (el sol) and the MOON (tortuga) never appear on the forum at the same time? Ah maybe its la luna |
FYI...I am not Walt Disney my first post is not Fiction!!!!!!
However if you want to believe I am full of it and no one has exceeded the speed limit on the lake all year that is your right. |
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Once again elchase posts things he has deluded himself into believing. The argument is tiresome. You keep your head in the bag of sand and the rest of us will continue to fight for real change on the lake that will address the problems that actually exist. Spare us the painting of the perfect lake picture that does not exist. Seriously though it is fun to read your posts. You sound like the Iraqi information minister during the war. Everyone remember Muhammad Saeed al-Sahhaf affectionately known as "Baghdad Bob?" "There are no Bombs, the Americans are being defeated." :laugh: Or in this case "The lake is a wonderfully safe place with no bad drivers." "The war is over we have won the safety war." :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: When the dust settles at least we all had a laugh right. |
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Have you discussed this year's lack of noise and speeders with BI? He posted not long ago that there are so many boats and some PWC's that go full throttle through the Bear Island NWZ that he thought it would be burdensome to call the MP every time it happened. We discussed the BI NWZ at length last year, because I was bewildered as to why the MP wouldn't park near such an obvious violation zone. So maybe BI can give you a heads up as to how many "a select few" is. |
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Originally posted by TurtleBoy
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Originally posted by VtSteve Quote:
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I am certainly not an example of a perfect member, as per some really stupid posts of mine in the past, but I enjoy a good debate and hope that both sides can continue to post their opinions, particularly this important issue. Don't let this issue die, because of uncivil posts. Cheers! |
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My post was intended to be funny, and I have never called anyone any names. And maybe Turtle Boy's response was an attempt at humor as well. You, however, are the one always looking to stir the pot. Your view's and opinions are not shared by the majority on this site. If we started a poll on whether Elchase stays or goes on this forum, I'm afraid it would be bye-bye for you. You need to lighten up a bit and stop your whining. You have your precious speed limit, and you feel safe and can enjoy the quiet, all by yourself.
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just my 2 cents... Nothing personal but lets call this what is actually is please... EL has done nothing but stir the pot time and time again. When directed at him or Turtle boy he crys foul. When a completely civil and productive conversation takes place he jumps in and trys to curve the conversation to get people into a tizzy.
These tactics were done before by others if you read back in the threads to try to disrupt and ultimately get the threads shut down. Those individuals that were very strong in their convictions for some reason have disappeared this time around, but suddenly there is EL who claims to be a person who has sat on the sidelines all those years now wants to be the leading advocat. After reading many posts and just using common sense it is personally hard to believe. I feel that in many of these threads we have made progress. We have determined that many people have issues on the lake and would like to have them dicussed and ultimately addressed. Please continue to discuss these in a civil manner and do not get dragged down the wrong path. That will only lead to these being shut down which is some posters true intentions. |
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I agree to keep the forum classy, however, pm's first response was clearly just humor. Turtle's response back (the "chump" response) also came off as humor to me. Brush it off, it's the internet. |
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Yes, I know, you can go 5 or 10mph over the limit on Rt93 all the time and never get stopped. Try going 25 or 30mph over the limit and then tell me about it. By the way, give the Judge my best, you will be seeing him soon. And that 65 number will suddenly be very important as they subtract it from your recorded speed to calculate your fine. And it is my understanding that if you are caught 15mph or more over the limit then court is required, you can't send in the fine. There IS a speed limit on 93 and on Winnipesaukee. |
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There are many people that do 90+ on 93 and do not get caught. Of course, you can't do it all the time, or you will get caught. As far as the lake, I don't mind crusing at 45- 50 ish, but, once in a while, if that is exceeded, chances are there will be no repercussions. I already have my compromise.
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They also regularly stop multiple PWCs outside the NWZ, I assume for being to close together. I guess there is a common belief that PWCs traveling together don't need to stay 150' apart. The MP explain this error. All in all things were a lot quieter this summer. I like to think the SL is a big part of that but who can say? I do think the SL is at least a little part of the improvement. |
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You bring a fair game to the discussion BI, and I always respect your positions, whenever you're not reluctant to show them. Your post above, as compared to others on the very same subject, are not consistent observations. Believe me, there are many people that are against the speed limit that support your positions in some areas, particularly the safety aspect. The biggest thing we all offered for those like yourself, is a constant discussion towards enforcement of the obvious laws, and necessary MP support. One of the many areas the SL crowd is pretty weak in. |
Two questions
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Second, what's your reasoning for lowering the 45 to 40 ? Am I to understand that you think the 50 MPH mentioned above is too fast ? Specifically, that 50 is not just unlawful but dangerous to the public at large ? |
ELCHASE “I'm called "la luna" and worse, but that's just "razzing"”
My post on 9/8/2009: “ I know this question is probably patented but... Did you ever notice the SUN (el sol) and the MOON (tortuga) never appear on the forum at the same time? Ah maybe its la luna “ 1. la luna = the moon 2. If you took this to mean you (elchase) then I called you the Sun..or the Moon...now I am confused :eek:…not sure what the insult would be there. The intension of my post was not to call you a name. However I guess if I need to explain a joke…it was not funny in the first place. My Bad. |
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I'm thinking that you probably witness many a violation at that particular spot on the lake. I know I witness chaos every weekend where my Camp is. One thing that I appreciate is that you have not pretended that this law has some how solved every problem that plagues Winni. |
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We enjoyed the show as well. Kept RG busy with the camera. It was especially interesting because of how rough the water was on Saturday. The blue boat seemed to be having some real fun having the lake all to themselves.
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Attended the Vintage Race by Boat Saturday
It was 'ROUGH' on the Broads. I haven't seen this condition in a long time. The wind was blowing from the Northwest. It was fun crossing from North to South with the wind. The wind did not die down toward the end of the day. Against the wind, it was a bit intimidatiing for a 22 footer. I had to take it slow home. There were a few 'dancers' out there having fun. I was jealous. I was surprise to see a PWC off of Welch. The guy appeared to be having trouble. I noticed he was heading back to the island. I watch to make sure he was safe.
There was one guy at the regatta preaching the speed limit. Nobody gave him a time of day. He was definitely at the wrong place at the wrong time. He was really turning people off. Good news for the opposers. |
Broad Fun!
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http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...1-09_045-2.jpg http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...1-09_056-2.jpg http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...2-09_358-2.jpg I totally loved seeing the high Performance Boats this past weekend! The first three shots are from Saturday out on The Broads. The last one was taken as we were leaving Smith Cove. I wish the Powerboat Races would return! |
I wish the powerboat races would return, too, RG. Weren't they great? And you must have had the best seat in the house!
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Powerboat Races Must Have Been Cool!
The races must have been very cool from our spot. Sadly they stopped just before we arrived. :emb:
The closest I've come to a race our various poker runs. This year it was quite fantastic seeing so many boats coming down The Broads all at once. I snapped a few pictures, but didn't the best vantage point - need to get higher next time. :D As far as the 45 mph speed limit goes this year, it seems that many of us, especially me, cannot judge what 45 mph looks like. Case in point; just after the Dozi Poker Run, a thread popped up; Where was the Marine Patrol? Lots of people thought they were exceeding the speed limit, but they weren't. Scroll down to post 11 - they were all traveling at 45 mph. Don’t get me wrong, there are definitely some speeders out there, but I don't think there's as many as perceived. I definitely believe there is far less speeders on the lake than there are captain boneheads. Is there law of common sense? :laugh: |
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This boat is AWESOME!!!!!!
http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...1-09_045-2.jpg It is dead quiet and barely creates a wake... He made me feel real small and real slow a few weeks back... Of course we were well under the 45mph speed limit :devil: |
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Aha
I knew it could be done right. OCD, does that boat have some sort of proper muffler systems on it? I'd like to find out.
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Speaking of Rattlesnake...
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They were very cool, but it was more of a parade than "a race", and were quite distant from "your" side of Rattlesnake Island. To watch, I chose NOT to anchor, but floated next to a one anchored boat and a Lake amphibian aircraft. :coolsm: Quote:
I had taken my smallest powerboat, and elected to row the ¼-mile home for the exercise. The MP made a stop—of me! :confused: :o :confused: :eek2: Quote:
Right in the middle of the lake—Rattlesnake Island—has many fewer "For Sale" signs than in previous years. :look: |
Aps
APS,
I am not sure why there are fewer “For Sale” signs on Rattlesnake, but I do know for sure…The speed limit is NOT the reason. |
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They must have been reading your posts on here... LOL!! :D J/K |
Need for speed
As a longtime (49 yrs) user of Winni, and an avid fisherman, the speed limit is bull. And, if you talk to the MP off the record, they think it's a waste of time. Over the years, the biggest issue has been the morons who don't have a clue about boating safety and booze. The best thing that ever happened was the madatory safety training. While it will NEVER save us from all the morons, at least it has educated the majority. The past couple of years on the lake has shown a great improvement, that has nothing to do with the speed limit. By the way, when I'm not trolling for salmon or lakers, I will take a 60mph ride around the lake but it's done safely. The only thing the speed limit does is make people so paranoid that they don't get their boats up on plane and that is tearing appart the shoreline with large wakes. I live in NH and have a home on Alton Bay. It doesn't get much busier than that and the sound of a well tuned "go fast" is great!
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Did you ever think that maybe it has to do with the economy and real estate market? Rattlesnake has a history of having a lot of lower priced island properties which make it more affordable for the average consumer. In general there are not a lot of island properties for sale anywhere, far less than a normal season. The lesser amount of island properties for sale everywhere has NO correlation to your dream that performance boats are the root of all evil and are scaring residents off the lake... |
RG and I took a ride around the island Saturday and counted 12 places for sale. I don't have official statistics on what the 10 year average is but this actually seems higher than usual to us.
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Speed Limit is a Waste of Resources
I have been on the lake in many different ways since 1968. I have looked at the speed limit from my perspective as a boater, waterfront homeowner, condo slip owner, commercial property owner and marina owner.
Nothing that the speed limit has done has changed the lake one bit. First, remember that the marine patrol did not write one speeding ticket all season. Second, bear in mind that the economy is so far down that a significant number of boats were never put inthe water and a large number of people cut way back on the amount of boating that they did. Third, the weather in June and July also had a major impact on the amount of boats on the lake for half the summer. I live on a very open part of the lake and I agree that the lake was very quiet this year, but guess what "it's the economy stupid" As so many on this forum have said: The boaters who do not abide by all of the other rules (especially safe passage) are the problem. It is too bad that the uninformed and cluless continue to cite the speed limit as some great solution, when the enforcement of it would actually use valuable resources needlessly and create more problems than it solves. Thankfully, the marine patrol had better things to do this year. |
Clarification...
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I don't recall seeing Rattlesnake Island's NE shore having any large swim rafts. (At least not for very long! :emb: ) Quote:
The Broads NE shoreline has the largest concentration of offenders in my usual area of fair-weather boating. I'd expect that most islanders who must boat off that shore previously had to look both ways as though they were trying to cross I-93—on foot! :eek: |
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Trying to correlate a smaller amount of properties for sale on Rattlesnake today compared to years past to a newly imposed speed limit is ludicrous. The two have NOTHING in common. If I lived on the broads side of Rattlesnake, speeding boats would be the least of my concerns. |
On THE BROADS Side...
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I watch there carefully because I get a charge out of watching wind-driven waves and spray and consider the idea of owning there someday. It can be like living on the exciting ocean—without low tide! :eek: Yet one can enjoy a quick ride to nearly anywhere else on the lake when it's not rough. I scan that shore on nearly every outing, which I've been doing for as long as I've been afloat. Quote:
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2) But maybe you're right: Broad-side Rattlesnake Island residents have very steep shorelines and are unlikely to be victims of collision injury, damage or fatality: plus, Rattlesnake is an easily-seen island. Nearby Parker Island is small, yet has a disproportionate number of collisions onto it—one involving a fatality. 3) Why are all these names so readily-linked to tragedy among the speed crowd...on the inland-waters we all wish to protect...? deTourillon Cody Colann Cameron Rush Frisbie Mastronardi Gibson Mineo Littlefield Blizzard Yet all we can recall is "Thorndike" when it comes to non-fatal misadventures with Winnipesaukee's performance boats? :confused: http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...76IM000702.JPG This photo is just one example of serial "Broads" crashes since 2002, has an unknown, un-named "driver", and is not Mr. Thorndike's boat—which is a similar boat that ran onto Parker Island. The scenery includes Mt. Shaw in the background. |
Case of Recklessness
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A speed limit wouldn't have made a difference in this case. This guy was just being reckless. The Accident on The Broads can be seen here, scroll down to posts #4 and #6. For those who haven't been on the Forum long enough, Acres Per Second used to post under madrasahs. :D |
Should I show a picture of my kayak or canoe in a similar prone position and what would we deduce from that?
There was also a similar "bow up" picture of an older MFG boat being attended to in aAlton bay that was attributed to a "big wave" in one article. Thanks to RSG's technical response we can probably show this was a BONEHEAD move...... |
Well the boat is layed up for the winter....:(
I can report that I operated in a safe manner all season long. I was respectful of my fellow boaters..even those in kayaks and sailboats :D On occasion I gave my big block Mercruiser a workout while all alone in the broads and even convinced my wife this year that it is safe to do so and the speed limit is not necessary. -------------------------- Now I cant wait until the snow and ice so I can blast across the lake at 100mph+ on my sled :banana: Have a safe winter everyone... |
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I guess those in the broads won't be tormented by your rath anymore:eek::laugh: See you out there next year... |
Yes
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Example: Q: Mr. Smith, have you ever snowmobiled? A: No Q: have you ever been to lake winnipesaukee? A: No Q: Don't you think traveling over 40 mph in a congested walmart parking lot could be considered dangerous to the general public because you may hit children. A: Of course Q: Do you think that this should also apply to snowmobilers on a lake? A: Yes Q: So I can assume you would be in favor of speed limits A: Yes Thank you for your time. :laugh::eek::laugh: |
Thanks OCD, just inhaled coffee up my nose.:laugh:
I am not sure but I thought there was no speed limit on the lake for sleds. Althought there is a 150 rule for bob-houses..10 mph I think. |
[QUOTE=Kracken;110198]I am not sure but I thought there was no speed limit on the lake [QUOTE]
I are you sure? I thought there was a state wide one? My god the chaos this could bring!!!! Lets start a group called the Snowfabs! We can not have this. I can not believe that there is a part of the world that is unregulated. I don't know what we could end up doing with our lives! Anarchy I tell you! Anarchy!!! Thank god there are no penguins! but oh my! what about those seagulls that I see in the winter! or the squirrls! They need protection! Call the NH house as we speak! :D:laugh::eek: |
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:laugh:....good laugh... re my 496HO..it has a closed anti-freeze system |
There is a 45 MPH snowmobile speed limit on trails. There is no speed limit on lakes/ponds, with a couple exceptions.
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The speed limit on state trails is 45. There is no speed limit on frozen water.
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How can we just let these SnowCowboys ride at unlimited speeds. I can't believe that nice Senator from Belmont failed to see that this frozen water is unregulated!!!!!! |
We need to make the snow/ice of our lake more tranquil and peacefull than it has been in recent years. We need to make sure people on ice skates and flying saucer sleds feel safe without having noisy quater ton machines of death flying by them at speeds not seen since…….
Wait a second, as I was typing this I realized some people might actually think it’s a good idea and start sending letters to the Laconia Sun. |
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Besides, don't snowmobiles at least have brakes? |
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Ooops there we go again throwing out ideas that they might actually use... We have to stop that.. ;) |
Boater in fatal crash was traveling at high speed
Good thing that accidents like this don't happen on Winnipesaukee anymore since we got the SL;
http://www.newsday.com/long-island/n...1.1501898?qr=1 |
Kracken.. A friend of mine in alton.... her father just bought a brand new formula. I believe Fastech with twins... I am trying to get the details for you so you can look for him. Hoping to meet up with him a shibleys at some point. you should join us!
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I agree with you OCD, tolls on trails are in order!!! :laugh:
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Ooops you said Tolls on trails. I can see it now E-Z Pass for my sled! :D |
How about hover crafts and air boats, they can go pretty fast as well, perhaps laws need to be passed to slow them down as well. :D
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EZ pass on sleds, now that is a great way to generate revenue for the State.:) Perhaps you should contact the Governor with that suggestion. :D
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Only one of the five passengers got killed in this high-speed crash...the other passengers were only injured. I bet it would have been a lot less tragic, or even avoided, had they been going 45;
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/200...t_crash_a.html |
Good point Hnut. There should be a law...
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NY incident.
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Discussion about tolls and snowmobiles should be taken to another thread. This thread in the Anti Speed Limit section is for speed limit talk only.
Let's talk about this accident that killed a 12 year old girl when the boat she was in was hit by another traveling at "a very fast rate of speed". Wonder if her chances for surviving would have more likely been increased or decreased if the boats were limited to 45? http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2291795/posts |
I wonder why the NH Legislature did not think about tolls on snowmobile trails.
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Three killed in this one where "speed and proper lookout played crucial parts in the wreck". Wonder if the families of the dead would be amused by all this talk of tolls?; http://www.nwfdailynews.com/articles...t-srowson.html |
Give it time indeed.:rolleye1:
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you know what was amazing with the EZ pass? When I towed to VA it picked up the trailer as well. I still could go through even with two extra axles. Any idea how it figures that out.
By the way the Tapanzee bridge WICKED expensive. I forgot the exact but it was like $5 a car / truck then $11.50 per axle! it was like $26 to go over it ONCE! |
It's amazing that only one of the drivers was killed when these two boats collided at high speeds;
http://www.sanduskyregister.com/arti...ont/939482.txt |
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Fatal boat crash raises safety questions
It's a big problem down under too;
http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/con...8/s2232602.htm Can you imagine that over 22 people were killed in high-speed boating accidents right in Sydney's harbor in just seven years? Amazing. |
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You forgot to wink. Better hurry up and add it before they start quoting you and including you in their numbers. |
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I agree Hnut, it is coming.
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"it appears that the boat was traveling at a high rate of speed"
This guy killed his 25 yr old passenger by taking him for a boat ride that was a little too fast;
http://www.midwestboatparty.com/foru...ead.php?t=5594 |
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"High rate of speed" seems a little bit open to interpretation, especially when we have seen from some posts here that there are people who think 30MPH is a "high rate of speed". It is also impossible to determine if the operator of the boat would have felt compelled to adhere to a speed limit law had one existed in the first place. Further, this incident seems to be entirely limited to the people on-board the vessel involved. While I'll admit this is speculation on my part, there is a high probability that they were all riding under their own free will. I personally do not believe that we need any laws that only protect us from ourselves, and that such laws are rarely ever observed by the people they are geared towards. About the only relation this story has to Winnipesaukee is that there is water involved. |
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